Isn't there analytics like VORP, WS, PER, etc. that can show how valuable of a player Simmons is? Maybe someone who understands analytics better than I can compare to a player like Harden, etc. It has to be a metric that measures defense as well as offense if at all possible. I would assume WS/48 minutes is the best but don't know for sure. Maybe compare Simmons vs. Westbrook or someone of that ilk so people understand that Simmons is more of a winning basketball player than most people give him credit for due to his playmaking ability, transition game and elite defense. Anyways, one thing to consider with the Ben Simmons debate is that he holds a ton of value in this league. You can trade Ben Simmons in the next 1-2 years for a similar package that Jrue freakin Holiday just got if the Rockets want to start over for a complete rebuild to a team that has aspirations of contending like Dallas, Phoenix, New Orleans, Charlotte, Magic, Knicks, Kings, etc. All of those teams are star hungry and could make a reasonable offer for Simmons as he will hold value as a 2nd or 3rd best offensive player on a playoff team while being that team's best defensive player as well.
That's why you compare TS% betwen positions and shot distributions profiles. Durant, Curry? Harden? That's just top 20 all time players. But Centers with 61-62 with no outside shot% ? That's many. It is not "REGARDLESS OF POSITION" It has 100% to do with shot distribution. It is laughable to compare Steph's and Durant's TS% with a Center who doesn't leave the paint. It is like comparing apples with oranges. Curry is an apple, Capela is an orange. And Ben Simmons is also an orange. An orange that can't shoot FTs.
Because if you are completely physically and mentally incapable of literally shooting the ball outside the paint you are a huge liabillity in the playoffs.
Yeahh. Why not go for the easiest shot you can make? Not everybody can be James Harden. Crazier to think that because of his poor shooting that defenses will sag off Simmons and thats a wrap for his involvement in that play. Everyone here agrees that Simmons can put the ball on the court and get to the rim with ease right? At 6'10 its like two strides to the cup. I like Simmons grit NOT to shoot and understand his limitation and do everything else great.
Instead of wanting to trade Simmons two years down the line for a Jrue Holiday package why not trade JAMES HARDEN for such a package?
no, let me be clear - what every other gm does to build their roster or how they value players doesn’t matter because that’s an entirely different subject and factors like salary cap space and draft positions are in the equation. We are talking about Simmons vs herro in a James harden return. that’s a landslide. That’s very much relevant. I don’t care how they evaluate a draft or a bad free agency signing. Let’s deal with apples to apples not apples to oranges. Stay on topic. I’m talking in a vacuum if a gm’s job in a harden trade is to get a dollar for a dollar that answer is Simmons. That’s what we r talking about.
This isn't understanding ones limitation. This is a limitation on its own. It's one thing to not prefer to shoot because you are a bad shooter and another thing for defences to have NO CARE in the world to leave you wide open from 3 or midrange or send you to the line for FTs.
You can dribble the ball inside the 3 point line. I know it seems strange saying this as a Rocket fan, but not everything has to revolve around 3 point shooting. When defenses sag why not just have Simmons attack the paint and create a mismatch instead of forcing a shot?
it isn't a different subject. you literarlly brought up polling gm's. simple as that. its only apples to oranges to you because your post got put into perspective and applied across the board. we are talking about simmons vs herro packages. key word packages bc thats what it is you're never going to get a dollar for dollar value for harden. that's probably been one of the most repeated statements in the last month bc it's true. it comes down to what you're looking for post harden and how far you actually want to take into account down the road in your rebuild
Because Harden wants to go to a ready made contender so none of those teams I mention will offer assets for him since they know and he knows they are not true contenders. Also, Dallas isn't going to make an offer for Harden, Phoenix isn't going to make an offer for Harden but they would make an offer for Simmons IMO due to his versatility on offense and defense. You can play him as a playmaking PG or a playmaking PF.
Well I guess if brabra says it at this point that's it...? If we are to engage with Morey on trade talks that's going to take a while. A long while. A long long while. And we are more likely to get out of these talks as losers than winners unless there is interest from others. I mean that we demand Simmons shoudn't even be a point of debate at this point.
Because there is a chance Simmons can develop in an all world type of player. Tanking can be done here, with or without Simmons. Tyler Herro or whatever else is out there, simply isnt enough. Unless Denver gets involved and we somehow get MPJ.
