1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

  2. Watching NBA Action
    Come join Clutch as we're watching NBA Play-In Tournament action live ...

    LIVE: NBA Playoffs!
    Dismiss Notice
Welcome LIVE NBA ACTION

Was this the weakest run to a title?

Discussion in 'NBA Dish' started by francis 4 prez, Oct 12, 2020.

Page 1 of 3
  1. francis 4 prez

    francis 4 prez Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2001
    Messages:
    22,025
    Likes Received:
    4,552
    based on an 82 game schedule, they beat:

    1. 39 win portland team, which for good measure dame got hurt in game 4 and turned a lopsided series into a more lopsided series the last 2 games
    2. 50 win rockets team, which for good measure had russell westbrook playing his worst ever off an injury and it ended up in several easy wins
    3. 52 win nuggets team, arguably their highest ceiling opponent was a not-ready-for-primetime nuggets team that was as close to losing 4-1 to the jazz in the first round as competing with the lakers.
    4. 49 win heat team, which for good measure had 2 fairly big injuries that made it feel like they never had a real chance in the series

    going back to at least 1990, i can't think of a team that faced teams with such a low ceiling. maybe a team had worse average opponents, but given their opponents had an average of 47.5 wins, and there has been a year where 48 wins didn't make the playoffs in the west, that seems unlikely? but to not have a single team that was any more than an upstart and a decent challenger is strange. upsets are fun and the team that wins the upset deserves it, but they usually make future rounds weaker. like the "we believe" warriors beating the mavs, it was great until a "meh" utah team for whom they weren't a matchup nightmare beat them soundly in the next round and we got a weak WCF out of it instead of an epic spurs/mavs rematch. i will always treasure the clippers' collapse, but they had a gear to go to that the nuggets didn't. i will treasure giannis' collapse almost as much, but they are scarier than the heat when playing well.

    this is such a weird title because the lakers aren't an all-time juggernaut like '96/'97 bulls, '01 lakers or '17 warriors or even a foregone conclusion team like '99 spurs, and yet they only ended up losing 5 games and basically never had a competitive series. usually lebron is hard-carrying his teams, but i don't think he shifted into high gear in until game 4 of the finals because it was simply uncompetitive most of the time.
     
    #1 francis 4 prez, Oct 12, 2020
    s3ts, don grahamleone, Ramo$e and 3 others like this.
  2. Icehouse

    Icehouse Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2000
    Messages:
    13,383
    Likes Received:
    3,724
    Bro, you don’t even have to look at a different franchise to find an example. How can you forget the 09 Lakers run, when they beat us without T-Mac or Yao, then the Nuggets, then Orlando without their PG? Or the 87 Lakers.

    https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_1987.html

    It’s really ok just to give LeBron his props lol
     
    #2 Icehouse, Oct 12, 2020
    Yung-T, gatsby, calurker and 8 others like this.
  3. DJ

    DJ Member

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2000
    Messages:
    1,389
    Likes Received:
    411
    Or the Warriors in 2015. They played against Houston without Bev and Dmo and the the Cavs without Kevin Love and Kyrie Irving
     
    #3 DJ, Oct 12, 2020
    don grahamleone, Richie_Rich, Yung-T and 9 others like this.
  4. francis 4 prez

    francis 4 prez Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2001
    Messages:
    22,025
    Likes Received:
    4,552
    '09 nuggets might be better than any team from this year and '09 magic had peak dwight and won 59 games. they would basically be like this year's lakers team. too good of a finals opponent. i stopped at 1990 because i wanted to look more at the late 80's lakers. i knew they had a season where they faced 3 terrible western teams with a combined sub-.500 record. it was 1987, but they also had to beat the '87 celtics, which was basically the last prime celtics team. even though their average opponent was a comical 44 win team, the celtics alone mean they had to bring it big time at some point to win a title.

    '88 might have a better case. really weak western opponents with only 1 of the 3 getting 50 wins, then a 54 win pistons team where isiah got hurt in game 6 and possibly saved them. that's probably the best case similar to this one from low win totals to injuries helping. granted, some of this is because there were only 23 teams and a 16-team playoffs made for some bad teams at the bottom (31 win spurs team in 1988).

    come on, i've made as many pro-lebron posts as anyone over the years in the dish. that's not what this is about.
     
    #4 francis 4 prez, Oct 12, 2020
    JumpMan likes this.
  5. what

    what Member

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2003
    Messages:
    14,586
    Likes Received:
    2,553
    The nba is broken when you have have 2 superstars and scrubs and win a title.
    But more to the point, the farm team model is so tiring at this point.
    New Orleans will never see the benefit of trading AD, because as soon as Zion gets mature he will do the same thing.

    That is why my proposal is the only way to save the nba and that is to do away with the draft, everyone is a free agent and no salary cap.
    The only way to beat the superstars and the blessed cities is to make them pay 200 million for an over the hill player until they are stuffed with useless contracts.
     
    #5 what, Oct 12, 2020
    Caesar, BigShasta and hakeem94 like this.
  6. Jontro

    Jontro Member

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2010
    Messages:
    34,367
    Likes Received:
    22,111
    pretty sure the rox titles were the weakest cus no jordan
     
    #6 Jontro, Oct 12, 2020
    hakeem94 and adoo like this.
  7. James Gabriel

    James Gabriel Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2007
    Messages:
    2,007
    Likes Received:
    711
    Mmm, I dunno, If we have won it, would you guys consider it an * title?
     
    #7 James Gabriel, Oct 12, 2020
    don grahamleone, calurker and Sajan like this.
  8. francis 4 prez

    francis 4 prez Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2001
    Messages:
    22,025
    Likes Received:
    4,552
    we were still a 56 win team that had just beaten a 56 win team, who themselves had already beaten a 55 win team just to get there. and even with injuries, having to face that version of lebron is more than facing jokic/murray or butler.
     
    #8 francis 4 prez, Oct 12, 2020
    hakeem94 likes this.
  9. francis 4 prez

    francis 4 prez Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2001
    Messages:
    22,025
    Likes Received:
    4,552
    no salary cap or no max contract? no salary cap will just help the rich teams.
     
    #9 francis 4 prez, Oct 12, 2020
    roslolian likes this.
  10. LosPollosHermanos

    LosPollosHermanos Houston only fan
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2009
    Messages:
    28,627
    Likes Received:
    12,559
    Damn, constant excuses for the winners, and constant excuses for why we keep losing
     
    #10 LosPollosHermanos, Oct 12, 2020
    Asian Sensation and WinorLoseMate like this.
  11. banzai

    banzai Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2013
    Messages:
    2,410
    Likes Received:
    1,404
    Yup, they did this in MLB. Small market teams were basically farm teams for the big ticket teams.
     
    #11 banzai, Oct 12, 2020
    hakeem94 and daywalker02 like this.
  12. roslolian

    roslolian Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2008
    Messages:
    24,390
    Likes Received:
    14,676
    Jordan had some pretty weak title runs himself, he never went up against a truly great team when his Bulls were in their prime. Bad Boy Pistons, Bird and Magic where pretty much old AF by that time I believe the only great team they faced were Stockton and Malone and that team was already overmatched cuz they didn't have elite wing defenders to guard MJ and Pippen while the Bulls can throw multiple 7 footers to guard Malone in the post.

    BTW Jordan was only out 1 season, he was back in the league during the 2nd Rockets Title Run but his team got eliminated before they reached the Finals. It ain't the Rockets' fault if MJ couldn't get to the Finals c'mon bro.
     
    #12 roslolian, Oct 12, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2020
    don grahamleone and hakeem94 like this.
  13. roslolian

    roslolian Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2008
    Messages:
    24,390
    Likes Received:
    14,676
    Yeah farm team, that's why the recent winners were GSW and Cleveland, clearly huge market teams in the NBA prior to Lebron and the Splash Bros. OTH New York Knicks the greatest NBA franchise in the world and the biggest market has clearly been building a dynasty exploiting all these farm teams it has.

    If you do away with salary cap then the blessed cities can have 7 all stars on their team cuz they can afford it c'mon man. If you are sick of seeing the best teams win all the time then make it like March Madness and have every Playoffs be 1 loss and out, win or go home. That's the real only way to have parity by increasing the luck factor cuz even if you are the better team you can still lose in the first round.
     
    #13 roslolian, Oct 12, 2020
    Major and hakeem94 like this.
  14. daywalker02

    daywalker02 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2006
    Messages:
    89,501
    Likes Received:
    43,106

    No salary cap would render some owners bankrupt before they know it, it is for their own good.
     
    #14 daywalker02, Oct 12, 2020
  15. GreatOne1978

    GreatOne1978 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2010
    Messages:
    2,874
    Likes Received:
    435
    If its so easily gettable why didn't the Rockets do it
     
    #15 GreatOne1978, Oct 12, 2020
    calurker, Canadiandude, roslolian and 1 other person like this.
  16. RHU525

    RHU525 Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2002
    Messages:
    4,565
    Likes Received:
    6,253
    What about last years Raptors. Crappy east, and then KD and Klay less warriors.
     
    #16 RHU525, Oct 12, 2020
    Caesar, hakeem94 and roslolian like this.
  17. JumpMan

    JumpMan Contributing Member
    Supporting Member Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2004
    Messages:
    7,946
    Likes Received:
    4,377
    If the Rockets had won it, it wouldn't be considered weak because they would have beaten the Lakers to do it.
     
    #17 JumpMan, Oct 12, 2020
    plutoblue11, hakeem94 and Easy like this.
  18. roslolian

    roslolian Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2008
    Messages:
    24,390
    Likes Received:
    14,676
    Talking about wins doesn't mean anything when comparing all time eras. Hell it doesn't even mean anything when comparing teams from different conferences. Wins aren't equal, when you are beating on crappy teams then obv you'd have more wins compared to a team from a different era with different opponents.

    This is def on the weaker side of title run, but it isn't the weakest by a mile. For example, just last year Toronto faced a GSW team without Cousins, KD and Klay Thompson. A year before that, KD, Klay, Steph, Iguadala and Green faced Lebron with injured Irving and KLove. Statiscally Lakers had stiff competition from teams like Bucks (HISTORICAL NET DIFFERENTIAL WITH MVP?DPOY) and Clippers it ain't their fault if those teams choked.

    You also need to take into account the Pandemic. In the playoffs they had matches every other day so the grind was def harder for teams than it is normally. Look at how wiped out Jimmy Butler was this game dude looked like a walking dead.
     
    #18 roslolian, Oct 12, 2020
    hakeem94 likes this.
  19. francis 4 prez

    francis 4 prez Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2001
    Messages:
    22,025
    Likes Received:
    4,552
    because the lakers were better. not sure how that changes the fact that this was (one of) the weakest run ever.
     
    #19 francis 4 prez, Oct 12, 2020
  20. Icehouse

    Icehouse Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2000
    Messages:
    13,383
    Likes Received:
    3,724
    They weren’t. They were led by Melo.

    Peak Dwight could be contained if you had a decent center. Gasol handled him with ease. And they were down their PG.
     
    #20 Icehouse, Oct 12, 2020
(You must log in or sign up to post here.)
Page 1 of 3

Share This Page

Toggle Width
Style
ClutchFans Original

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Rockets Content

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now