25 year old man murdered in Georgia for jogging while black

Who is ignoring anything?

Anyway I am done, this thread has been derailed and I am seriously worried about you and how you have reacted in this thread.

Good day sir!

 

What does “I’m not to b****” mean?

is it like: “mom said that I’m not to b**** nor burp at the table.” ??

 

Stand your ground wasnt even applied to Zimmerman. You always have a right to defend yourself if you are under assault. If anyone could have claimed stand your ground as a defence, it would have been Martin. Had the DA applied the right charge, Zimmerman would have gone to jail.

I studied martial arts as well, we were required to be fingered printed by the NYPD in fact. You are right, we were taught not to get into fights and were warned that even if it was self defense, that if we used excessive force to say break someone's arm, we were likely to be found liable - even if it was self defense. The reason is because even if someone throws a punch at you - knowing you have the skills to break someone's arm makes you liable for the result when a punch really isn't that big of a deal - and you could have avoided the situation if you really wanted to.

Martin didn't go up to Zimmerman's home and assault him, that's why stand your ground didn't apply. And there's no proof Zimmerman was looking to kill Martin.

By the same token it's not clear that these men were intending to kill arbery. It looks like their racism made them judge a black man running to be a suspect and they decided to make a citizen's arrest. The Arbery most likely saw that this was a dangerous situation and decided to fight versus run, and in the process was killed. The DA (or GBI or whatever) has to be very careful about what charges they bring forward. There's a lot of pressure to make it the most severe, but they need to make sure they can bring the charges that can be proven without a reasonable doubt in court - that's how our system works.

This is the problem with citizens carrying guns in public. Once things escalate even in a rational way, someone is very likely to get shot. You see threatening men stop ahead of you with guns. You feel you are in danger - you decide to fight and wrestle a gun away. The other person has someone they see as a threat try to wrestle a gun away, all of a sudden they are fearing for their lives now.

This is why vigilantism doesn't work. Because only officers of the law should be able to use lethal force to enforce the law. For this very reason.

 

You're thinking of the Castle Doctrine, Stand Your Ground applies to anywhere not just your house. It says that when under threat you have no duty to retreat.

In both cases none of the parties either the shooters or victims had to retreat. All were allowed to stand their ground. The argument that Arbery was mistaken in trying to grab McMichaels gun he is perfectly within his rights to do so as an act of self-defense (whether that is practical that is a different matter) but the point is he is under no obligation to try to retreat from McMichaels or surrender to him.

I stated in the Trayvon Martin thread that I didn't think Zimmerman intended to kill Martin when he set out. I don't think the father and son in this case intended to kill Arbery but in both cases they set off with lethal force after someone only on a suspicious and who they already considered enough of a threat to arm themselves. They went looking for trouble and found it. To me that calls into question self-defense. The prosecutors here can better answer this but 1st degree or 2nd degree murder might not be appropriate but manslaughter or some other charge seems to be fitting.

 

good post. Not to quibble but i think it’s important:
They went looking for trouble and created it, from scratch.

 

That's also what Zimmerman did as well so it might not be that important.

 

@pgabriel may I ask what changed your perspective? Your earlier posts seemed very, very different. I believe you were one of the posters defending OJ Simpson even when it was clear that he was guilty.

Didn't you spend some time in jail? What happened?

Just curious.

 

Uh-oh... Video emerges showing Arbery taking an apparent detour from his "jog" to "look around" inside of a house under construction. I'm sure he was just looking for interior design inspirations!

https://www.ajc.com/news/crime--law...ge-ahmaud-arbery-case/xvSWFTbaD0k9cr80R7CTnL/
The video shows a man wearing a white shirt and shorts, who appears to be Arbery, 25, walking down Satilla Drive on that Sunday afternoon. It shows the man walk into the garage of a house under construction and then walk around back of the house.

Soon after the figure in shorts and t-shirt enters the construction property, a man wearing what appears to be overalls walks near a stand of trees across the street from the site and the figure appears to be observing the construction site.

A minute later, after a car passes, a figure that appears to be Arbery comes out of a front door of the house quickly and runs down the road in the direction of Travis McMichael’s home on Satilla Drive.

 

Regardless of the interpretation of stand your ground, it was not applied in Zimmerman's case and it won't apply here. So it's irrelevant.

Looking for trouble is not a crime. Manslaughter is a crime. The criminal code defines what is and is not a crime.

Zimmerman was guilty of acting recklessly which resulted in the death of Martin. But the DA went for an unprovable charge which is why he got off the hook. The jury was not to blame for this. That was my point.

The father and son are guilty of taking actions that was likely to result in a confrontation and death. And for that they should go to jail. But let's be clear, if you go out to a bar to argue with someone you don't like, and that person gets really violent and starts beating you up - were you "looking for trouble"? A case could be made for that.

Which is why looking for trouble isn't the crime here.

 

How does this figure appear to be Arbery?

I can't even tell if he is black.

What does this video have to do with anything?

 

Too much caffeine?

 

Oh, you know: if anyone visits a construction site, they should be killed ASAP... if black.

Did you sleep on some part of this law?

 

He was prolly tryna steal the TEEEveeeee out that empty house. I dindunuffin! amirite?

 

...and now we know why the McMichaels were looking to apprehend Arbery. It was absurd, and racist, from the start to assume they were chasing him because of his skin color. Now we know it was because he was suspected of burglary. Consistent with and corroborated by the 911 call and the video.

 

Which one is Arbery? At what moment in the timestamped video is it clear he appears?

 

https://www.ajc.com/news/crime--law...ge-ahmaud-arbery-case/xvSWFTbaD0k9cr80R7CTnL/

"It is important to note that this footage was reviewed at the beginning of the GBI investigation and before the arrests of Gregory and Travis McMichael."

GBI Director Vic Reynolds said Friday that his agency received the case Tuesday night and began investigating Wednesday. By Thursday afternoon agents had concluded they had sufficient evidence to charge the two men.

“I can tell you there was more than sufficient probable cause in this case,” he said. Both men are in the Glynn County jail after a judge refused to free them on bond Friday afternoon.

 

Wait what?

McMichaels did not see him at the site or leaving the site.

https://www.ajc.com/news/crime--law...ge-ahmaud-arbery-case/xvSWFTbaD0k9cr80R7CTnL/

Gregory McMichael told police that he was in the front yard when he saw “the suspect from the break-ins ‘hauling ass’ down Satilla Drive.”

Gregory McMichael ran in the house to alert his son, Travis McMichael. The men armed themselves and went after Arbery, according to Gregory McMichael’s police statement.

The McMichaels told police that they had decided to arm themselves and pursue Arbery because they suspected him of committing burglaries in the Satilla Shores neighborhood. They also told police they had seen Arbery on earlier surveillance tapes and were concerned that he could be armed because they said they saw him on another occasion sticking “his hand down his pants.”

 

The police had to make an arrest just to quell the public outcry and prevent social unrest. No way the McMichaels are convicted in court. They credibly suspected Arbery of attempted burglary (it's on video), tried to stop him, he attacked them and went for their gun, and they shot him in self defense after the gun struggle. That's not murder - not even close.

 

He literally only has one function.
It is to be the black friend that will agree with the Racist in order to be special in their eyes.

He lives for one phrase . . ..
"You're not like the others. . .you are different."

Rocket River