...now, now...let's not limit the little fellow. ...he's sunk to lower depths than this plenty of times...and there wasn't a global health crisis he needed for cover, either...
Cases in Texas have doubled over the last 4 days. If you're for reopening, I don't ever want to hear you say you're "pro-life" again.
Just a reminder...Little Ben was concerned about older people's lives when Obamacare was being implemented: https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2014/11/11/death-panels-coming/ The Death Panels Are Coming BEN SHAPIRO11 Nov 2014 With Obamacare open enrollment about to begin anew, rumors of trouble in Healthcare Paradise run rampant. Enrollment has dropped to 30% below Congressional Budget Office estimates; fully 1 million of the 8.1 million people who originally signed up for Obamacare dropped out. But Obamacare’s shoddy implementation doesn’t even begin to scratch the surface of its great evil. Obamacare architect Jonathan Gruber quite correctly attributed the passage of Obamcare to “lack of transparency” and the “stupidity of the American voter” – because it turns out that Obamacare will ration care, and that the most well-respected bodies in terms of health rationing have already recommended cutting off services. The US Preventive Services Task Force is an independent body authorized by Congress to make “evidence-based recommendations about clinical preventive services such as screenings, counseling services, or preventive medications.” And since the onset of Obamacare discussions, the Task Force recommendations for treatment and screening have become less and less generous. In November 2009, the Task Force recommended that mammography for women every other year between the ages of 50 and 74. They admit that they have insufficient information to suggest that it would be fruitless to screen after 74, and they say that case-by-case screenings should take place before 50. The Mayo Clinic, by contrast, recommends annual mammograms for women above age 40; so too does the American Cancer Society. As Dr. Sandhya Pruthi of the Mayo Clinic writes, “Findings from a large study in Sweden of women in their 40s who underwent screening mammograms showed a decrease in breast cancer deaths by 29 percent.” Then there are colonoscopies: the Task Force recommends against routine colonoscopies for adults 76 to 85 years of age, and recommends against screening at all beyond age 85. The American Cancer Society and American College of Gastroenterology, by contrast, do not give an age limit for colonoscopies. Medicare, coincidentally, happens not to cover CT colonography but fully covers colonoscopies. A great way to cut costs: tell doctors not to give colonoscopies. How about prostate cancer? The USPSTF completely recommends against prostate-specific antigen (PSA) screening for prostate cancer. Every other major organization says that patients should make that decision with their doctor; the Mayo Clinic recommends “offering PSA screening and DRE annually to men ages 50 to 75 with a life expectancy greater than 10 years.” The USPSTF recommendations are just that: recommendations. But as the Annals of Family Medicine reports, Obamacare “reinforces the ability of the secretary of the [Department of Health and Human Services] to add services to Medicare that were not given a D rating by the USPSTF. It also authorizes the secretary to remove preventive services not given an A, B, C, or I rating by the USPSTF.” So get ready, folks. Care may soon reflect the standards of the USPSTF. And that means that rationing of care is coming, and soon.
Have you seen Carl's posting? Every other post is an anti-Christian post. He thrives on posting the worst stories about Christians in order to get some kind of revenge on them. I think he had a traumatic experience at Church Camp or something. Also funny you would call someone Crazy because you've been getting more unhinged every time I see you get into an argument around here. I used to think you were somewhat balanced.
In general , we agree on this subject .... Just one question: Why is this about Trump? Consider the facts - These states that are reopening are doing so on the direction of governors. Some of these states don't meet the guidelines set forth by the white house Covid team and Trump admonished at least one of them (Georgia Gov.) for doing so not having met those guidelines. I think we'd all like to get back to normal and I really wonder what the hell the new normal looks like .... but I for the most part , these re-openings are very much premature. Personally , I'm taking the next 6 weeks no different than the last 6 weeks - staying home / avoiding people , wearing PPE when I must go out .... A good friend of mine is an MD and his statements pretty much mirror my thoughts on this - Its going to lead to a significant increase in cases - I wont call it a second wave because the first hasn't passed. Re-opening at this point seems to me like a complete waste of the last 6 weeks and however many trillions of dollars we threw at this problem .... All we've done is pushed the timeline down the road a few weeks. My personal feelings aside , I understand we can't continue this indefinitely and that many people are hurting (some destroyed) financially - If those people want to go back to work , I'm fine with letting them do their thing .... Its their lives they are putting at risk , let them do it.
California city official ousted over his pandemic remarks ANTIOCH, Calif. (AP) — A Northern California city official has been ousted after he suggested on social media that sick, old and homeless people should be left to meet their “natural course in nature” during the coronavirus pandemic. City council members in Antioch, a city of about 110,000 people 35 miles east of Oakland, voted unanimously Friday night to remove Ken Turnage II from his post as chairman of the city’s planning commission. He wrote on Facebook: “the World has been introduced to a new phrase Herd Immunity which is a good one. In my opinion we need to adapt a Herd Mentality. A herd gathers it ranks, it allows the sick, the old, the injured to meet its natural course in nature.” As for homeless people, he added that the virus would “fix what is a significant burden on our society and resources that can be used.” Turnage later deleted the post but refused to resign or back down from his comments. During the two-hour council meeting held on Zoom, Turnage said his personal opinion had no bearing on his duties as a planning commissioner and that removing him would violate his freedom of speech. But city officials countered that his posting caused a loss in confidence and created a disruption to the city. Mayor Steve Wright said politicians are held to a higher standard by representing the city to all. After the council stripped him of his post, Turnage said that if residents had lost confidence in him, “that’s their opinion and I can’t help that.” “It’s not like it used to be,” he lamented, “when you could have an opinion, talk about it and then sit down and have a beer together and talk about football.” https://www.chicoer.com/2020/04/29/...ioners-resignation-over-coronavirus-comments/ In a long post April 23 on Facebook, commission Chairman Ken Turnage II compared the spread of COVID-19 to a forest fire that burns off all the “old trees, fallen brush and scrub-shrub sucklings” that drain resources. The nation and planet “would strengthen when this is all settled,” he surmised. “We would have significant loss of life, we would lose many elderly, that would reduce burdens in our defunct Social Security System, health care cost (once the wave subsided), make jobs available for others and it would also free up housing in which we are in dire need of,” Turnage wrote. “We would lose a large portion of the people with immune and other health complications. I know it would be loved ones as well. But that would once again reduce our impact on medical, jobs, and housing.” He said his post was “not malicious, or racist” and had “nothing to do with money or business.” Rather, he was simply stating what he believed was happening to the Earth through the global pandemic. Turnage later said his comments were misunderstood. “I believe in ecological balance,” he said. “Our species is out of symbiosis with the rest of the planet. We have a disease … a virus, that if it ran its course, it would bring us back into a closer balance. I didn’t say people should go out and get infected. “It’s our world’s way of balancing itself. It’s like a volcano going off,” he added. “It brings the temperature of the Earth down.” Turnage also said that while he does value life, he does not do so over the greater good of the planet, country and species. He noted that if unchecked, the virus would run rampant through the homeless community. “I’m not saying let’s kill the homeless, but because of what this virus is attacking, these are the sectors that it would affect the most. … I’m sorry but that would be one of the side effects,” he said. “Yes, that’s a harsh way of looking at it — I know people aren’t going to like this — but this is just reality.” Although he disagrees with the need for sheltering in place, Turnage said he is honoring the order and does not encourage people to disobey the rules. “People need to protect themselves,” he said. “… (But) it is my belief that when something is out of balance, there will be something that brings the balance back (possibly a virus) or the scales may tip and then there is no return.” https://www.chicoer.com/2020/05/01/council-removes-commissioner-who-said-let-nature-take-its-course/ In a phone call to the council during the Zoom meeting, a defiant Turnage stood by his words, reiterating his belief in “ecological balance,” which he said he wrote about to “spark debate.” “My personal opinion had nothing to do with the city or my position on the planning commission, so to try to somehow link them or create a nexus to further your political agenda is shameful,” Turnage told the council, adding his ouster would amount to a violation of First Amendment rights. “Being removed from the planning commission because my opinion is not liked or agreed with is not a fair reason to be removed,” he said. “In fact, in a country where we value free speech, it is unconscionable and sends a message that only like-minded people can serve this city.”
Only highly developed country to not have universal healthcare, while simultaneously sniffing our own ass all the time with rhetoric about Merica being #1, when **** hits the fans lets try to kill grandparents, the Immunocompromised young people, to save money, while not saying a god damn word about the trillions in corporate bailouts or tax cuts for wealthy. The age-old technique freaking out about how we can't afford vital social programs, only to throw the money as fast as you can at the wealthy when given the opportunity, all from the working mans, not elitist, American right-wing!
It's the richest and greediest Americans who are hell bent on keeping it that way. No way in hell do they want the billions of dollars worth of tax cuts and loopholes going away to make healthcare affordable for all.
You really think Trump is not behind the openings. He is only saying he was against some of the opening to protect himself. He would then tweet support for openings and support for protesters. Now... he will say “I didn’t want the openings” when the numbers spike.
What's more unsettling is that many of those protesting and pushing for things to open are older people over 50 many of whom are not in the best of health. Many of them simply don't believe this disease is as bad as it is and will claim that the numbers are exaggerated.
This is the part that I think causes part of the tension we are seeing. There are a lot of people that do not believe that COVID19 is any worse than the common flu. They believe all of this is a case of the intellectual elite and government trying to control their lives. This isn’t just a belief in rural America. This is something many middle class Americans believe as well.
I say this sincerely: What those people need more than anything is a 1 hour conversation with a therapist.
America: Home of the largest population of confident stupid people more concerned with the illusion of being the best nation than actually being the best nation in the world.
Yes, I’ve seen his posts. Often, he’s using sarcasm that isn’t always appreciated (understandably in some cases), but that isn’t the case here. Did you watch the video? What the young man is saying is both outrageous and grossly misleading. He conveniently, for his “argument,” is using the most extreme example to make his “point.” I put argument and point in quotes, because he is not managing to do either one honestly. If you are over 60, you are at a higher risk of either dying or suffering significant long term damage to your body from getting the virus. Damaged lungs, neural damage we’re still trying to understand. If you are under 60, way under, and have health issues you may have lived with successfully for years using meds, like asthma or diabetes, and get the virus, your body may respond to it the same way it would if you were far older. That’s a fact. You can be in your 40’s, in your ‘30’s. It’s the luck of the draw. Also, my use of the age of 60 as increasing your risk is purely arbitrary. Many have reacted the same way at age 50. There is nothing magical about your age, @dachuda86. If one of the people your care deeply about get the virus and reacts badly to it, someone older than you, but not anywhere near to being in their 80’s, as the fellow on Carl’s video so dishonestly used as an example, your view on age and it’s relation to the virus would change dramatically if you feel remotely the same about it as the young fellow on the video. Maybe you don’t feel the same way. I don’t want to assume that. My comment directed at you that I take umbrage with was your use of religion to make an attack. While I personally am not the least bit religious, I have always respected those who are. My late mother certainly was, numerous relatives are, several of my friends. The religious people I don’t respect? Those who wear their religion on their sleeve. Those who use their religion politically against others. We are a secular state. It is enshrined in our constitution. Many of the founders of our republic were not religious, or belonged to a religion that had suffered persecution within their memory. Who had come from countries with a state religion and came here to practice their different religion freely and without fear. So they cared deeply about religious freedom. Your use of “I bet you would be OK with Christian 81 year olds dying” was dishonest and divisive. @Commodore’s post was outrageous, dishonest and divisive. In the same vein as your own. Why do both of you make posts of this nature? What on earth do you read or listen to that would even put such an absurd idea in your head in the first place? It is extremism of the highest order. It goes against everything this country stands for. Partisan politics doesn’t give either one of you license to make those kinds of attacks and then complain because you are called out for it. Politics of that kind has always belonged on the very fringe of political discourse in this country. Simply because a president you support encourages that kind of extremism doesn’t change that.
Interesting how some people are very interested in defending the type of “Christianity” preached by the likes of Kenneth Copeland and Jerry Falwell— the type that, in a pandemic, actively denied science and results in death. Go practice your religion (and for that matter, your “civil liberties” and “economic freedom”) all you want, but don’t expect religion to shield you from criticism any more that it shields you from the virus when you are behaving like an ignorant asshat.
