[BimaThug] how the rockets can avoid the tax while signing buyout guys

I’m very likely mistaken but to clarify, I was thinking they rockets couldn’t match anything more than TPMLE because that we’re at the LT. ie I was thinking if they free up space under the LT apron (not the actual salary cap) they could match any offer house is signed to. I know that’s how it worked with other RFA’s in the past...you could exceed the cap to match. But House’s contract is a different animal all together so not sure.

 

We have Shump's bird rights so letting him go would take some ridiculous contract from another team. Don't see that happening.

 

You're making too big a deal of "having his birds rights". Birds rights mean nothing if he's a scrub. And that's what he's been here. We cannot afford the risk of a long-term deal for more than a little above minimum unless and until he shows us something. And he's had ample opportunity.

We really should release him and add another player to the roster for the playoffs that may give us a better chance of beating the Warriors. He can't help us beat them (just like Capela and Nene and Faried) shooting like he is. He'll have to sit down. Time's a wast'n.

 

You are fooling yourself if you think Shumpert is going to be released for another player to be added.

 

I'm fooling myself for thinking it MAY happen??????

Tell me........if we could get Anthony Randolph or Sergio Llull under contract for the playoffs.....would you release Shump to make that happen? Would you release anybody on this roster to make that happen???

 

Anthony Randolph? Let no one say you are not fully committed.

 

Anthony Randolph is not only out with another shoulder injury but his team is in Euroleague playoffs.

I like AR too but he would be a vet min end of bench fill roster type signing and no way Rockets jettisoning Shump for him anytime soon.

 

Post those tweets.

I'd like to know where that is in the CBA. I've been looking for that. It does say that if they use any portion of their Taxpayer MLE that they cannot revert to the non-taxpayer MLE. But it also says this under the Taxpayer Mid-Level Salary Exception portion:

p.205

Section 8(e)(1) pertains to sign-and-trade transactions. We didn't have any of those that I recall.

Page 206 of the CBA goes on to describe that in the event the team signs contracts that conform to the Taxpayer Exception restrictions (3 years, and equal to or less than the Taxpayer amount) that those contracts can LATER be designated as taxpayer midlevel exception contracts in the event that a trade pushes salaries above the apron.

So...the way it works is this. If a team is below the apron after signing a player(s) to an exception contract...as long as the contract(s) meets the criteria for the Taxpayer Mid-Level exception but the apron hasn't been breached......then those contracts are first designated as non-tax payer MLE contracts....(with the theoretical apron limit) that can then be re-designated Taxpayer MLE contracts if a trade causes the team to cross the apron.

Because we never crossed the apron this season (at least to my knowledge we didn't), then we can now keep these signings (Hartensten, Clark, Chiozza, and Frazier) and non-tax payer MLE signings and have access to the remaining Non-Tax Payer MLE prorated amount...which is significantly greater than the Taxpayer MLE. And as long as we use it after today's game....then it doesn't count against us for purposes of calculating the luxury tax.

This essentially means we could waive a player (or possibly trade them I suppose) tomorrow after the season and we could possibly sign a player(s) to the balance of the Non-Tax Payer MLE, which should be a starting salary of between $3.2-3.4 million (I didn't calculate the deductions for Chiozza and Frazier because I'm not quite sure what days they were actually signed) and that contract could be for up to 4 years...including this season. That is substantial. And it's why I keep thinking there's another move...or two...that could possibly be made to this roster...before the playoff rosters are set at 2 pm Friday.....to help us in the playoffs. Or we could possibly sign a guy within the next week or so...that would not be playoff eligible (Llull, etc.) this season, but would essentially allow a high caliber player to buy out their Euro contract and join us in time for next season.

 

That would be an annoying technicality, but I suppose it makes sense.

Are you saying that a team can't sign someone for (say) $5m as a TPMLE to allow them the freedom to exceed Apron later (say, on a salary-increasing trade), but then later failing to make such a trade, so want to use more MLE as NT, if they have room under Apron?

that is, the first use must be declared one way or another, locking you in to NT under the Apron, or use TPMLE with freedom of taxpayer trades/signings...but not ability to change mind.

 

He's not a rookie. He's a vet. BIrd's rights don't mean anything if he's a scrub. We do not want a bloated contract. We are still paying for the last one. Remember Ryan?

 

And you are my Cameron.

 

I just believe that his contract is key to the 'next big move'.

 

Yeah, it's expiring. Bowel moves and then we sign somebody a lot better.

 

I want Shump (as a trade piece).

 

Combined with picks, yes, that has always been the strategy.

 

I am not sure I agree with bballholic here because it appears to circumvent the CBA but if possible we should use that money to sign House to a 4yr deal now because we need next year's TP MLE for Faried.

As far as the offseason, we need our contracts. I think we resign House but will need the full TP MLE to retain Faried. Rivers is gone so we need Shumpert's contract. If we package him with Nene and our money allotment we MIGHT be able to get Butler with the picks if his other plans fall through. Shumpert can be resigned for 1 yr just under EGo's price (11.1M X <120%) without triggering base year compensation rules in trades. You only become hard capped if you RECEIVE a S&T. Shumpert would be sending out a S&T. Our best team needs to use our picks to leverage keeping EGo. We simply cannot replace his value with the vet min and that is ALL we will have after House and Faried. If House takes part of the TP MLE above the min for a 3yr deal does Faried accept the rest? Maybe. Green will return but we have to fill out the rest of the team with vet mins. If we can keep EGo things get interesting because we are in a unique position to keep him for a final contract and not have to pay more than now and maybe slightly less. With Rivers gone we will need another PG and someone like Beverly would be perfect but those are hard to find and not cheap. Who can we find our there for the vet min. Green will have to continue to fill that void. Harden/CP3/EGo covers 96 minutes better than anyone else. With Butler/House/Tucker/Capela/Faried you have amazing coverage for 144 minutes. That is one hell of a solid team if we can get there. A few ring chasers to fill things out like a shooter and another versatile wing defender would really solidify the rest of the bench.

 

Circumvent. ... and the winner is
... @luckyman76. There's always one vote for circumvent.

 

You’re right about the bird rights meaning nothing. Shump is a goner. He doesn’t seem to wanna be here to be honest and I don’t see why we would take any offence to that seeing how he played.

But you’re just dead wrong about us releasing him.