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[Matt Moore] The Definitive Case for James Harden as MVP

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by durvasa, Apr 4, 2019.

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  1. BeBreezy

    BeBreezy Member

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    Exactly why I wouldn't have appreciated any chip won with LeBron added to this Rockets roster. That's as close to a carbon copy of the Dubs as you can get, in my opinion, and I don't respect any of their rings in the KD era.
     
    #21 BeBreezy, Apr 5, 2019
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  2. daywalker02

    daywalker02 Member

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    Chris Paul is as much an Alpha as LeBron, maybe Durant is Beta, he just did not win a ring and lost MVP to Kobe only.
    I dun think anything is different other than he is much hungrier for the ring.

    Chris at his best is still not much worse than Prime LeBron, maybe not as versatile.
     
    #22 daywalker02, Apr 5, 2019
  3. daywalker02

    daywalker02 Member

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    The impact of 2 all time great PGs is as great as 4 legit Allstars IMO.
     
    #23 daywalker02, Apr 5, 2019
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  4. jordnnnn

    jordnnnn Member

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    The section on Hardens passing is a must read and watch in the app.

    Truly is not recognized for how unreal his passing ability is.

    As he put it... Not one of...The BEST passer in the league.
     
    #24 jordnnnn, Apr 5, 2019
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  5. vlaurelio

    vlaurelio Member

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    This. Melo/no biglyD era should be forgotten

    Thats on morey. Signing melo is one thing but giving in to his demands is stupid
     
    #25 vlaurelio, Apr 5, 2019
  6. Riz

    Riz Member

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    Look, at his point, someone on CF said it best, Anyone voting for Giannis will not consider Harden no matter what Harden does to prove his worthiness. A vote for Giannis is simply a vote against Harden. Take Harden out of the picture, and yes, Giannis is most definitely this season's MVP.

    Ask yourself these questions, If Harden was having Giannis type season and LBJ put up the EXACT same historical numbers in Lakers' uniform while Lakers were in top 4 in Western Conference, would anyone (national media) consider any other player as MVP besides LBJ? The answer would be No, it would be unanimous MVP vote.
     
    #26 Riz, Apr 5, 2019
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  7. vlaurelio

    vlaurelio Member

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    And replace lebron with harden and same result
     
    #27 vlaurelio, Apr 5, 2019
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  8. Nero

    Nero Member

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    That's exactly right. If LeBron was having the season Harden is having, he would win 100% of the votes.

    For that reason alone, as I have said before: anyone who does not vote for Harden this year should have their vote taken away permanently, because they are clearly not qualified to be a voter for such things.
     
    #28 Nero, Apr 5, 2019
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  9. durvasa

    durvasa Member

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    I don't think it would be close to unanimous given the strength of Giannis's case, but I agree that he'd be the favorite. New players that join a team as the best player and provide a significant win boost will get extra credit in the MVP voting. Voters will tend to give a larger share of the credit for a team's success to such a player.

    The Rockets winning 65 games a year ago and not quite hitting their preseason expectations (I think Vegas had them at 54.5) is sort of working against Harden here.
     
    #29 durvasa, Apr 5, 2019
  10. Riz

    Riz Member

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    The problem with MVP voting is that national media, primarily ESPN, drives the narrative on who is the primary candidate. When was the last time they gave Houston or any key Houston player/coach any respect? Rocket's championship is followed up by "well, MJ didn't play", Coach Rudy T is still not a hall of famer after leading his team to 2 back-to-back NBA championships. There's an obvious bias against Houston. My question is, why do media personalities even have MVP voting power? Who are they to have that exclusive right? Especially, when ESPN has the monopoly on driving the national narrative.
     
    #30 Riz, Apr 5, 2019
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  11. durvasa

    durvasa Member

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    It might have been during that 22 game win streak, when the love from the media towards the Rockets was most unqualified. That was special. But it was more of a "How about those plucky Rockets?" type narrative, rather than "The Rockets are hands down the league's best team".
     
    #31 durvasa, Apr 5, 2019
  12. Riz

    Riz Member

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    I agree with your reasoning and it's a common language to use when choosing an MVP candidate. But, do you agree that Harden has created an exception here with his historical stats while still winning games? Something that hasn't been done in decades. I don't care what team a player is in if that player did what Harden as done in the regular season while caring his team from down 14 to top 4, I would choose that person any day. I get that there are people in the position of voting wanting to change it up each year, but that is not a good reason when a player like Harden comes along.
     
    #32 Riz, Apr 5, 2019
  13. Riz

    Riz Member

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    Exactly, when they are forced to respect the Rockets, it comes with an *asterisk*
     
    #33 Riz, Apr 5, 2019
  14. durvasa

    durvasa Member

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    I agree that there is a general bias against Harden, because of the unorthodox manner in which he plays, the way the Rockets system is designed, and also because of his reputation in the playoffs, where people tend to give him less credit for some of the numbers he's putting up in the regular season. For some, that bias is pretty explicit, and for many others it is more implicit.
     
    #34 durvasa, Apr 5, 2019
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  15. Newlin

    Newlin Member

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    It's a debate because the press NEED something to talk about. Clicks, likes, views, money.
     
    #35 Newlin, Apr 5, 2019
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  16. durvasa

    durvasa Member

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    This is an unprecedented race. Whoever wins, a player is going to lose whose MVP case is arguably stronger than any player historically that didn't win the award.
     
    #36 durvasa, Apr 5, 2019
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  17. vlaurelio

    vlaurelio Member

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    any knowledgeable bball person especially one following the rockets should know better

    harden single handedly saved the rockets season from 14th seed to 2-3 seed in the WEST with all the injuries to its 2nd to 4th best players

    not the other way around
     
    #37 vlaurelio, Apr 5, 2019
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  18. BigM

    BigM Member

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    Moore: The Definitive Case for Giannis Antetokounmpo as 2019 NBA MVP
    https://myaction.app/V7endY71DV

    He posted his case for Giannis. Great read as well. I think he ends up voting for Giannis(if he has a vote) but he reveals his choice tomorrow.

    Anyways, he values team record but doesn’t really care who the teammates are, which doesn’t really jive with me but I get the point he makes.

    Either way, if MVP voters put this much effort into their selection and still came up with Giannis, I wouldn’t be mad. He is underrated on this board. Though Harden is underrated in the media and that really sucks.
     
    #38 BigM, Apr 5, 2019
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  19. Deuce

    Deuce Context & Nuance

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    He doesn't have a vote. He did have a vote in the Harden/Westbrook year when he worked for CBS and voted Harden.
     
    #39 Deuce, Apr 5, 2019
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  20. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Member

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    More El Chapo references. No wonder these empty suits think he's a cheating hooligan.
     
    #40 Invisible Fan, Apr 5, 2019
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