As JV accurately pointed out, Republicans have distilled the issue into wall or open borders because it plays well with low information Trump supporters. So if you're into simplistic sloganeering like build the wall then Trump's your man and if you realize that it's a complicated issue that requires something more thoughtful and comprehensive than sloganeering then you're more on the Democratic side of the err... fence.
It's really the decision between more border security in the style that was supported by Democrats including those in leadership positions and is currently being asked for by Border Patrol, and literally anything but that because we hate the president. This is childish nonsense from Pelosi and she's cost the government a lot more than the funding would have cost already as a result of her childishness.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy can't wait to see Nordic countries start doing great leap forwards. Didn't hear of any country orchestrated death tolls in Venezuela either, but there is still time - their economy is not so hot. Just saying it doesn't really make a great example for you.
Social democracy is a capitalist system....so I'm not sure what you think you were proving by linking to that. When it comes to Venezuela and their Democratic Socialism, as of last year they were up to 6 children dying of starvation every week and that's not counting infants under the age of 1 that died of starvation, in 2016 there was over 1000 of them per month......and this is in what was the richest country in Latin America before they decided to try out some "Democratic Socialism". Let's just say that I disagree that they aren't a pretty good example.
DSA is not a well defined political order ideology and so Venezuela can't be used as a comparison point. DSA like western europe, sweden, nordic countries, canada as their comparison points. I already said that Venezuela has bad economy. Your Trump tactics of using the worst symptoms of a situation to actuate your point are good for some compassionate types, but I am still 100% certain that premeditated homicide is worse than involuntary manslaughter. Willful genocide trumps bad economic choices. And this makes me come to a more certain conclusion that your original complaint (DSA is much worse than Racism) as pretty stupid. Anyways.. Thanks for helping me learn about another party within American political landscape! This was fun.
Venezuela was a democratically elected socialist government, hence democratic socialism. Western Europe, Sweeden, and Nordic countries may have political parties inside of them that are "Democratic Socialist" but they are Social Democrat countries.....which means they are capitalist countries. You not knowing the difference between those things kind of prevents this conversation to move forward.
Conversations without agreement on definitions and terms never move forward. Totalitarianism is not socialism. Capitalism can never be untempered by the people (social democracy) without creating oligarchy. Venezuela is a civil war. The people are undermined by oligarchs and corporate interest in a single commodity economy struck down by price collapse (not a simple anti-socialism story).
Well, Western Europe, Sweden, Denmark, and Norway are no socialist states. They are capitalists! Bingo. There is a difference between funding social programs, and socialism. I love how socialists in this country have no idea that this is the case and trot out rich capitalist countries as example. No, socialism can be seen in places like Venezuela for sure. When you give power to the government to control the means of production, this is what happens. Socialism has yet to be successful because it follows the same patterns and is inevitably corrupted because people can't be trusted to run such a system. Power dynamics do not change because of the name you give something. Furthermore, the other problem is a govt is not efficient and without profit motives and competition, your economy is done for.
So what is the Democrat plan? I mean I really want to see a solid proposal. They agree that the border needs more security, but so far have put forward no realistic plan. Also will they be OK with adding walls in places that need them, or do they think walls don't work? I am confused because places where walls were put up saw them work. I wish they would actually make a proposal at this point because Trump has a clear vision for the border and has worked with the Border Patrol on finding a solution. What have the Democrats done lately?
I agree, conversations without agreement on definitions never move forward. I reject the new definition of "socialist" that was created by socialists to hide what they truly are just as I would reject a "newspeak" definition of Nazi from Nazis who want to make that ideology seem more palatable. Venezuela is not a civil war, it is the obvious consequence of socialism.....something that has happened literally every time socialism has been tried be it by revolution or by democratically choosing it. Funny how socialists always need to spin the entire history of socialism to fool young and impressionable people into getting into it. Hell at this point they actively point to capitalism as successful socialism LOL! Anyway, we should just end this here, but the last thing I'll say is that Chile once had a socialism problem just like Venezuela does, then they had someone come in and kill all of the socialists and re-establishing a functioning capitalist system before handing over power....now they are the richest country in South America. The history of socialism is pretty clear for anyone not pushing a socialist agenda just like the history of Nazism is clear for anyone not pushing a Nazi agenda.....and it's also clear based on the responses I've gotten in the past day or so which of the 2 we currently have a problem with.
I agree the Dems have failed at a coherent plan, but Trump has hardly provided a clear vision. Saying wall and constantly changing the type and size is no clear plan.
Is there a big impeachment story in the air or something? Trump is rambling about another caravan heading to the southern border.
Saying "wall" over and over because it was a campaign mnemonic device for the most unprepared and unintelligent major candidate in history is not the basis of sound policy.
Shows how little trump thinks of his supporters. And how unimportant his vanity wall is if he has to make up reasons like this. Surprised he didn't say the "border rancher" also said he heard people screaming "Allahu Akbar!".
