Ocasio-Cortez tweets and other news

No I understand. It’s absurd because it won’t happen and AOC is just throwing meat to her base. Is it better than using xenophobia to feed to its base, absolutely.

I’m just tired of populism and lurching from ideology to the opposite every election cycle. I’m a moderate democrat who is beginning to see AOC like Ted Cruz under Obama.

 

Not that it matters, but I don't think those are good examples. It would be like calling police and firefighters an aspect of socialism. The VA is a better example imo....anyhow carry on!

 

I think this applies to how more moderate liberals and conservatives see AOC.

 

I'm not sure what example you are talking about, but I'm pretty sure I can guess. For whatever reason, modern Socialists have adopted the tactic of pretending that any social program is Socialism. This is simply not true. Many even point to the Nordic Model as an example of successful Socialism and this is flat out inaccurate because that's a capitalist system. A capitalist system having social programs is not Socialism, it's capitalism.....so there's honestly no program in the US that can be pointed to as an example of true socialism.

Actual Socialism seeks to overthrow capitalism and replace it with Socialism....and that's certainly true with AOC. She sees the overthrow of capitalism as a long term goal. Someone like Bernie Sanders isn't actually a Socialist, he's a Social Democrat. He wishes to create a welfare state supported by the capitalist system. Completely different.

 

The point was that a combination of capitalism and socialism made modern America. Police and firefighters are an aspect of socialism.... like teachers and professional soldiers.

The truth is you didn’t build that and that bothers people. That’s how civilizations work, especially modern ones.

 

The concept of the public good was always accepted within capitalism, being in its very foundation, Adam Smith's Wealth of Nations. Capitalism is a pragmatism, not an ideology (like socialism), although admittedly many do come to simplify it into that.

His view of public goods (though he didn't give it a name, he just described what it was and people later gave it that name) is the same one today, the idea is a set of goods and services from which the purpose is to maximise the means of production, e.g. without some way to enforce private property rights, private property would become meaningless.

Articles apart from the means of production, such as the police, were never even part of the argument in the late 1800's and early 1900's, because after Marx and Engels created socialist theory, claiming ownership of institutions that had pre-existed them, in some cases by millenia (seriously, professional soldiers? Rome had those) would have been ridiculed for its absurdity, something that is still true.

The argument was and is about who owns the factory, the farm, the store, but when all those fail, claim ownership of the police, the army, the fire department and call other people delusional

 

No, you're just someone who can't read.

This is marginal tax on income for money above $10 million. Sweden has a very similar marginal tax of 60%, for a bracket that starts at lower incomes. The Scandinavians live life with common sense and have a strong culture that binds them together - not something you see in a new , highly diverse country like America.

If someone makes 42 million, they get $10 million taxed at 37% and the other 32 million taxed at 70%. If someone makes $12 million, only $2 million are taxed at that rate. This impacts maybe 2,000 Americans. Think about your pointless outrage.

In retaliation, you'll find wealthy individuals will look for loopholes like they use on investment schemes already, move their offices to Panama or the Virgin Islands, and a whole host of other things for the govt to look after. But because they are so few, it will be easy to monitor them. It is a no brainer as automation sets in.

The immigration viewpoints are delusional , not the tax ones.

 

fox news freaking out over AOC...

 

You'll notice I said "modern america". Thanks for the history lesson though.... We have a mixed economy in modern american and it's disappointing to sees a bunch of conservatives who benefited from public social services all of a sudden get cheap.

BTW... we have a professional army who is paid using taxes and get benefits after their service is complete.

 

Sweden also has a generous social system and it's populace support that. America simply doesn't support that level of government support or level taxes. Conservatives literally **** their pants over ACA and I'm supposed to believe this type of tax increase will fly?

 

I took Trump seriously.

There is a big big difference between the left and the right today. Trump plays off of innate fear - namely that of the foreigner -that's why his trade wars, immigration stances, and America First policy drove him to the top - his initial popularity was driven by his Twitter birther campaign remember?

AOC has no such fear to really tap into. The democratic coalition is far more fragile. While moderate conservatives can hold their nose to Trump because he still gets them tax cuts, AOC will never cow-tow to the neo-liberals in the party who care more about economic and foreign policy than truly advancing a progressive agenda - and because of that, she will lose them. The left is far weaker in the US than in other countries - because most Americans don't yet seem themselves as exploited workers the way it is in say Venezuela.

 

And what would be the marginal tax rate right below 10mm. Any idea?

 

"Sweet Lou 4 2, post: 12163704, member: 28838"]Most dems are moderates and unlike the right arent tribal or have a stick with the team mentality.

Huggh, in the Politico article you sure see the stick to the team mentality as the established Dem attack AOC

This is why someone like AOC will never rise to power ... All she will do is isolate herself once the honeymoon is over.

She has already risen to power by changing the narrative. lol that she would get more power by being quiet and remaining unknown nationally for years like about 500 US reps who keep quiet and are unknown for the most part outside of their districts or perhaps states.

She is popular mainly because of the current political environment and the rights attacks on her is helping her get publicity and sympathy.

She is popular due to her stands being popular. -- and also her charisma. Most democrats are in favor of $15/hr, Medicare for All, free college etc. AOC like Bernie Sanders has enraged the establishment Dems by showing that there is strong support in America for the policies establishment Dems with their allegiance to the donor class repressed.

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You do realize the the country doesn't have unlimited resources? That money doesn't just get generated by how many immigrants you have? Also Trump is already talking about offering citizenship to H1-B visa holders, who are foreigners. Most people don't fear foreigners defacto. They actually look at it as a problem when it is at a crisis level.

As for AOC, she knows how to get support by saying the right religious phrases. I say religion as in the church of progressives. You just have to virtue signal, and people are willing to throw logic out the window because you are seen as politically correct and morally good. This emotion pull is enough to blind people from her lack on knowledge and terrible policy plans. Bush did the same crap with evangelicals. Different groups, same idiocy.

 

Trump cut legal immigration in half and went after h1b making much harder

As for throwing logic out the window that's Trump's domain on everything from the environment to foreign policy.

 

Very misleading. Do you even know how massive the application volume is on that visa and how people abuse it?

 

I am just stating the facts. He has cut legal immigration from countries like India but not Europe. This isn't helping our country compete

 

This is factually inaccurate.





The majority of the left have moved pretty far to the left while the right has remained fairly consistent. There was a time when most Democrats were fairly moderate, but today it's increasingly difficult to find a true moderate Democrat. For the most part instead of truly being moderates, they've merely re-defined what a "moderate" is in order to suggest that they are still it and everyone else is "far right".