I’ve been for the 2nd Amendment my whole life. Until last night.

I don't regard the right to stockpile automatic weapons as a civil right. I am a lawyer, admitted to the bar in New York, have studied comparative constitutional law, and I am telling you that the 2nd amendment does not guarantee a civil right to hoard Kalashnikovs.

 

He quoted an article.

 

Huzzah, I can agree with ATW about something. Quoted this part because you reference something that bothers me too. Since the 18th century, we've had a way of deifying civil rights, calling them human rights or inalienable rights, and sometimes God-given rights. We do this so much we don't often have much conversation about where the rights come from. To the second amendment supporter, it is a settled question that we should have these rights, and they won't go into how these rights are derived. I'm Hobbesian about it. I think we make a social contract to decide what rights we keep and which we cede. That makes what we write down on a piece of paper the only important thing, and of course we can change what we write. Gun rights folks talk about it instead as a right that will either be defended or neglected -- that even if our Constitution said no one should own a gun, we'd still have the right to, it was just being denied us in some national legal injustice. So where does the right come from? Does God give us a right to guns? Is it natural law that we should have guns? If it is not the Constitution (which has a process for amendments), from whence does it come?

 

Well that's fine, I'm sure some people don't regard other civil rights as civil rights....and that's why it is essential to protect them against people like that.

When it comes to "hoarding" of guns, if you look at the data, those aren't the people that are out killing people for the most part they are the extreme exception. So really it's just people looking for an excuse to take from the people and push anti-2nd amendment legislation they wanted to push for to begin with.

This guy could be the exception, but when you use exceptions to push for policy that will be almost completely useless, what are you really doing it for? It would be best if those people would just admit that they are anti-2nd amendment and that they are seeking to erode it little by little because only the most fringe authoritarians would support an outright ban.

 

Ah yes, reducing the number of guns merely creates the illusion of less gun crime. The rest of the world is a perfect example.

 

He's not, I posted the statistics.

Just look at other civilized countries and how they are dealing with it, and adopt their way of dealing with it.

You as a country have a problem with gun violence. Again, the 2nd amendment is not some God-given truth that could never be changed.

 

because he agrees or shared the experience? i'm curious OP's thought process on the tragedy and his desire to open this thread. A study if you will; a study where perhaps some of us can all learn from OP's experience.

 

From the OP's posting history, I don't think that he has been for the 2nd amendment all his life. I might be wrong.

 

Hearing Bobby talk the 2nd amendment makes it seem like it's a deity or holy book, absurd to hold a 200yr+ old piece of paper in that high of a regard and literally defend it over corpses.

 

So you think this is a "I Told You So" and if "This Guy Can Do It" you can too?

 

I wonder why we don't have more stringent border security north of the border as the draconian empire known as Canada doesn't value human rights since they don't have a "2nd amendment" equivalent clause.

You would expect a massive influx of refugees from such a gross violation of civil rights.

 

Most Canadians died during the great war against home invaders, AK47s would've prevented this. But you won't hear this because of liberal media systematically avoiding the topic.

 

Sen. John Thune blames shooting victims for failing to ‘take precautions’ and ‘get small’ to avoid gunfire

 

Wasn’t the 2nd amendment drafted mostly to allow citizens to form militias to fight the red coats?

People act as though the 2nd amendment is some sort of bible but refuse to have a serious discussion about the needs of citizens then vs now. Personal Home protection... of course. Hunting... of course. “Sporting” that requires guns that can shoot 1000 rounds in less than 10 minutes.... umm no. Freakin learn a new sport.

 

you haven't been paying attention. canadian culture has been infecting america for years. it honestly might be too late.

bro that headline is like classic fake news yellow journalism. the kind of bullshit that would make me, if i were famous or a politician, avoid all media and interviews. upon close examination, this is a classic russian social media tactic. disgusting fake headline, share on social media, outraged smart phone zombie finds on their social media feeds, zombie proceed to like & share with more zombie friends, outrage grows & intensifies, eventually "spreads" to other platforms including sports, etc...

i have to ask, @el gnomo are you a willing or unwilling russian agent?

 

BTW, since we're talking about banning fully automatic weapons, I think it's important to point out that since 1934 there have been only 3 incidents involving a legally owned fully automatic weapon.....and one of those incidents was a cop murdering someone.

Essentially what I'm saying is that the regulations for class 3 weapons is already working. Now we can talk about banning slide fire modifications, something I'd support, but this incident isn't evidence that a blanket weapons ban is needed.

 

take your facts and shove them up your ass you mass murder supporting scumbag

 

Many of us Americans take the constitution very serious, and yes, literally defend it over corpses. Nobody has stated its a perfect form of government which is why it allows for changes. Babbling on about how awful America is for their gun violence solves nothing. For a topic that has been heavily debated for decades, very few have actually tried to bring forth any real change. Fact is guns are here to stay for a long while and even if we should outlaw them, it will take a massive effort to collect up all the guns. We will likely see a civil war or massive bloodshed and revolting before the leftist pipe dream of removing guns.

This is not a pro or anti gun comment. This is a fact of nature. If we ever want to see significant gun control, the anti gun crown has to be very pragmatic about the issue. Calling for gun bans, gun registry, banning pointless weapons, and other idiotic ideas only entrench the gun crowd.

Case in point: 35 people each day are killed by guns. But yet we only talk about gun control when that number only happens in one location. Its quite idiotic to talk about gun control during these tragic events when these psychopaths are out to kill people with any means, not with just guns. This is what alienates gun owners.

If you want to have a sensible talk with gun owners, talk about the 35 deaths a day, not about the criminal who is going to break every law to just increase his body count.

 

I agree, it's time to get serious and discuss how we stop Toddlers and Toddler Ideology. In 2015 Toddlers killed more people than Terrorists. Clearly Toddler Culture calls for violence against everyone. If you're not a Toddler you're an infidel. http://www.snopes.com/toddlers-killed-americans-terrorists/

 

Who's asking for a repeal of the 2nd amendment? This is just a delusional attempt at keeping a dangerous amount/type of weapons for no apparent reason.