I’ve been for the 2nd Amendment my whole life. Until last night.

....that's just an obvious statement. An airplane would have been a MUCH deadlier weapon than pray and spraying with automatic fire into a crowd from a quarter of a mile away. How do you not know that?

 

I've yet to hear a compelling reason as to why a civilian should be allowed to own a semi automatic weapon, let alone fully automatic or components that act as such.

 

This. It is a cost of "freedom".

 

Yeah, you've said it 1,000 times, just like you do everything else. Repeating vague talking points over and over in a thread isn't intelligent discussion, it's you not having a life and having zero substance to fill your thousands upon thousands of posts on here with.

We're far past the point of no return on this problem, the best hope at this point is promoting heightened awareness of mental problems that lead to these types of events and chipping away at the access of firearms for people who have no business purchasing them due to criminal and mental histories.

 

I've yet to hear a compelling argument why a person should be allowed to vote without showing photo ID and yet......

 

Sadly doesn't solve the problem though, no kind of background check will prevent a sane shooter from acquiring guns. Background checks mainly seem like pseudo safety measures to me.

You have to tighten regulations for EVERYONE, everything else is half-assed and doesn't address the issue. Said it before, I'd maybe be okay if people were able to own a single gun (due to criminals already having far too easy access, in Europe for example it's simply not necessary). But semi-autos, assault rifles, shotguns, an absurd amount of ammo, multiple guns? Just ridiculous and there's absolutely no "self defense" explanation.

 

Have I really lost the argument though? I mean, I know that this is a board dominated by fringe left posters, but that's why you guys always end up shocked to find out that your views are the extreme minority despite patting yourselves on the back here and deciding that you are right.

It's honestly why I even come here to begin with. In the real world most of these issues are pretty straight forward and there's no much debate needed. Here I can see people taking laughably awful positions and convincing themselves that they are right. You can get hot takes here you'd never find in the real world....or at least not outside of liberal echo chambers.

Comments like saying the 2nd amendment needs to be repealed would get you laughed out of most places, here, that notion is defended . It's just an odd situation with you crazy kids.

 

Think this confirms he's a troll, no one can be this delusional and out of touch with their own surroundings.

 

We need to try federal regulations instead of a patchwork of state laws.

 

I don't think anything that I mentioned will help much at all, there's just not a lot that can be done in the current political environment and obsessive gun culture that exists in the US. It's cynical, but it just becomes more and more evident every time one of these events happen. The Republicans refuse to ever even give an inch on this issue and instantly resort to screaming about freedom and civil liberties just like Clutchfans' village idiot is doing in here right now. There's a culture of ignorance and pride in ignorance in this country that has a strong hold right now, it's the same reason a large portion of people don't believe in global warming despite the overwhelming evidence, not to mention electing a freaking reality TV star as president.

 

Truer words were never spoken.

Although I would change it from plural to singular. The irony is hilarious and tragic. But mostly tragic.

 

2nd amendment

 

Obvious statement from the keyboard pilot with zero pilot training. Care to elaborate on the level of difficulty to pull something like that off? Given the countless variables such as local airpspace laws and security features, location of target, speed, angle for approach, mass of the plane needed to create maximum damage, etc? Or do you suppose he can just hijack a commercial airline a la 9-11? LOL

No you can't. It's alot easier to just say "But but but... He could used a plane and killed more people!"

And nothing to back it up.

Seems like Vegas shooter was pretty successful with some guns, hammer, and 32nd floor suite. Let's stick with the topic since you have nothing to offer on your diversionary hypothetical Kamakazi scenario.

 

Yes, you have lost the argument. I don't think I would be considered a fringe left poster by anyone, and contrary to many here, I often agree with you, but from the perspective of someone who is not entrenched in American politics, the way you guys deal with gun control is incomprehensible. And the 2nd amendment is man-made, over 200 years ago, when the world was different from what it is now. Laws, and yes, constitutional amendments, can be changed. 2nd amendment is not some God-given truth that could never be questioned or changed. You do have a problem with gun violence in this country (am currently in the States). I love the USA, but it is completely obvious to anyone who wasn't brainwashed by the NRA and its lobbyists.

 

I think I misspoke, it's not a "right vs left" issue, it's an issue that is authoritarian vs libertarian. These days those on the fringe left have become so regressive, so authoritarian, it's easy to make that mistake but it's not accurate.

When the first thing you think of is how you can use a situation to take from the people, you are an authoritarian and you are the reason the Bill of Rights and the other amendments to the Constitution exist. Those who constantly seek to take from the people are the enemy of the people, even if you think you have the best of intentions.

One could point out all of the problems the first amendment has caused....is that reason to do away with it? Of course not. You could point out positive aspects of eliminating all rights...doesn't make it the right thing to do. Protecting the rights of the people is always something that can be exploited by those who intend to do harm so no matter what it is, you have to weigh your principles against making things easy. When authoritarians win and the people lose, it's never a good thing in the long run.

 

I am a libertarian.

Security is a prerequisite for liberty. To keep its citizens safe is one of the main functions of government.

It's not like all the other Western countries in which people don't stockpile guns are authoritarian dictatorships because of that.

Complete liberty to do anything, including hoarding assault weapons, undermines security and safety.

I'm ok with getting frisked by dumbass TSA people because it makes me feel safer when I get on a plane.

But when you have an epidemic of mass shootings (and non-mass shootings), that is not liberty. It's lunacy.

 

@TheRealist137 is this the first time you've 180'd a lifetime "belief" over an event that you had no connection to or influence in?

 

If you are arguing for the removal of civil rights then you are doing libertarian wrong. Trading liberty for the illusion of security is foolish and frankly against libertarian ideals.