It's relative though - because his ceiling was so high(he's an all time great PG), a declining Chris Paul is still better than most NBA players and let's not forget that CP3's skills are things that don't necessarily degrade with age. His bball IQ is still through the roof, he still is a good shooter(and very clutch), and his athleticism at the point was never predicated on speed and power - quite the opposite, his handles and his ability to change up speeds constantly(similar to James Harden) is what makes him so slippery to defend.
You guys stop mentioning Giannis. It's making me think about how perfect he would be for us and I know we will never have a legit shot at acquiring him.
Interesting read until OP said Harden was clearly 2nd best. That makes no sense at all. CP3 could never average 29 points and lead the league in assists per game. That would never happen. CP3 averaged more assists per game one time in his career than Harden did his only year at point guard. I love his game, but he's no James "El Chapo" Harden.
No one is saying that next tier aren't great players. Just saying WB isn't in the first tier. Nothing to be ashamed of, he can still lead a team of Kanter, Adams, Oladipo, Roberson, Gibson, Sabonis, Donovan to 47 wins. That's great. I think what's becoming extremely obvious is that you don't value defensive talent correctly. Davis has never had a team with that level of overall talent. He would also get 47 on that squad. And he has made the playoffs and lost in 5 before. So who was Westbrook guarding? Please let me know. I'll give you a hint: it wasn't Gordon, because Donovan is smart.
not sure were talking about the same thing here. but regardless it is as argument for why I would choose wb right now bc that's not something Giannis is ready for yet or has learned and at this point Giannis taking that shot next season is a guess. huge guess. we've already seen wb make big shots time and time again. never disregarded the defense. i dont know why that matters unless your arguing who is better. I'm merely stating my reasons why I'm taking Westbrook right now.
James turned the ball over way too much. CP3's lack of turnovers are going to make the Rockets offense more efficient if he can maintain the same pace as we had before.
The truth is what everyone, including the media, has been saying: if someone not in the first tier is the MVP, something is wrong with the MVP award. Russell is not the actual MVP, he's just the player that had the greatest marketing value to the media. An inefficient 30 A beefed up 10 and 10 assists Garbage defense 6th seed 1st round exit Possibly the worst MVP of all time, so it makes sense he could fall into that second tier.
Probably around 4th for last season. Harden, Kawhi had more impactful seasons. Lebron, Curry, Durant, Giannis, WB, Thomas were all incredible, but none took their teams to greater heights than they should have been. But this discussion is about the immediate future. Not the long term future, not the past. We're talking about 2017-2018. Which means Westbrook is Westbrook and Giannis is going to improve. Even a little improvement is enough to overtake WB imo, and in all likelihood, that happens. Which is why no one would give up Giannis for Westbrook in a trade, even if they were both expiring contracts.
But that doesn't make Chris Paul "better" overall, it makes him lest apt to turn the ball over. That's it. Harden > CP3
Makes him a much better option to run the PNR in a DanToni offense. Chris Paul averaged 25-11 in the playoffs. What was Harden's numbers?
so 4th is still not 1st tier to you. I guess were going to have to disagree then cause I wouldn't take giannis over wb for this coming season. I more base my decisions on what has been done instead of more along the lines of potential. He just had his first year of receiving any significant rewards. Ill let him jog a bit more before i really run with him.
EGO is very good, but definitely a tier below Klay offensively, and well below defensively. That's why this is tough. Klay would be the second best player on most teams.
29 and 9. Not too shabby. Also, quit lying. CP3 went 25 and 10. That was for 7 games. Harden did it over 11 games. That's because he won a series... against the MVP of the league.
The performance of 1 season doesn't determine tiers, obviously. Lebron can relax in the regular season and remain in the first tier, because everyone knows what he can do come playoff time. MVP is about what someone did just this past season, not who the best player is. To each their own of course.
Over achieving in the regular season vs average expectations of the roster in general + how much defense provided + how much efficient offense did you produce/create.
Ppg and assists don't come close to telling the whole story. I mean Marbury was technically a 20-9 guy and got kicked out of the league. Do you think he was equal to CP3? Every assist is not made equal. Some people hold the ball and will only pass if it has a chance to generate an assist. That guy could average a ton of assists but actually hurt the offense. Not saying that is Harden(even though he does that sometimes). Harden is obviously a huge plus on offense, but just because he had more assists does not mean he is a better passer than Cp3(in fact he is not even close). It's not about how many points or assists you get, it's what was your impact on your team's offense? Harden and CP3 both rank among the top in the league at this through different ways. One is better at scoring and other at running an offense. Difference is Harden is a minus on defense while CP3 is a plus, which makes him the overall better player. Harden is still a superstar and his ability to iso and close out games is vital especially in the playoffs when offenses break down. But throughout the course of an entire game, entire season, CP3's overall impact is greater and it isn't even super close.
