Agree with most of this. I think the question I always have is the "at ease" feeling that people want. Because it seems like most people are looking for a Lidge/Wagner that will put them "at ease". But the reality is, there are only ~3-4 closers that have that type of reliability at any given time. And I don't think an MLB team requires one of those potential HOF-type guys to win a WS, much less a division.
He doesn't "suck" but he has been extremely average. He reminds me way too much of Chad Qualls. I'm gonna call him Chad Jr.
The great thing about today? Lance with a freaking awesome performance. We're fortunate to have the opportunity to watch him grow into a stud right before our eyes. We knew he had the stuff but now we're seeing him command it at will at home and on the road.
Nobody said they couldnt win without a HOF closer. Im just saying that I feel as comfortable with Sipp pitching as I do with Giles. If that doesnt tell you anything, then I dont know what will. The whole at ease factor comes from having confidence in a pitcher and his production level in the given year. His body of work in the season up into the next time he pitches puts me "at ease". We dont need to even go back to the Lidge/Wagner days. This year alone, Harris puts me at ease, Devo puts me at ease.
Kimbrel is elite. There aren't many guys like him. And there are none who will be on the market prior to the deadline. Andrew Miller, Wade Davis, Jansen, Holland, and Betances aren't going anywhere. Neither is Aroldis. Knebel of the Brewers is having an elite year but the Brewers lead their division so I don't see him out there to be had either. The pen could use bolstering though. Maybe just add a guy like Hand, Rivero, Wilson, or Raisel Iglesias?
I like this comp a lot actually. Qualls had movement, good velocity, and always could get ahead of batters in the count but could never put them out before giving up a few hits.
Yeah it's uncanny sometimes. I guess you could compare him to Lidge too. Always felt like Lidge was an elite version of Qualls until he fell off, and then nearly won the Cy Young once we traded him...and then fell off again...and then... well I digress. Giles is basically something in between Lidge and Qualls. His stuff is better than Qualls, but I'm always waiting for that 2 out walk that puts the other team back in the game.
Sure, but put Giles in the 7th or 8th exclusively, and he'd probably give you the Harris feeling (the same way Giles did in Philly). Just like Harris did last year until he was the closer. Just like Gregerson did for his entire career until he became a closer (and even then he held it together for a while). The question is, how many guys in the league put you at ease when they come in to close games? I believe that # is extremely small. As a sidenote--that's just one reason I think the Qualls comparison is extremely unfair. Giles has been nails, to use your words from earlier, when exclusively a setup man in the past. If the statement is, "Giles as a closer is similar to Qualls as a 7th inning man his 1st time around"? That seems reasonable, but is saying something very different.
Haven't found a K zone look at that pitch yet...which is surprising given how important it was. For now, I'll assume the fact that the Mariners Strike Zone twitter handle didn't post it means it was in the zone? https://twitter.com/MarinersUmp
Rewatched the final out but on the Mariners broadcast and their pitch FX had it right on the bottom left corner of the zone. Didn't hear any complaints from broadcasters either. As for Altuve pitch, it was low but Altuve also bent down a little so I wonder if that influenced where ump saw ball cross.
Good stats to research are Giles non-save and save situations, home and away. Seems he mostly falters on the road regardless of leverage. Home is beast.
Being at ease with Giles has to do with command and control. Far too often he has neither and because of that you have no idea what you're going to get each time out.
Relax guys. We have an assigned order to end games with (Harris Gregerson Giles) because it helps the team to sequence relievers by velocity and stuff. Harris lulls you to sleep and induces weak contact, Gregerson gets you missing on his snappy slider, and Giles comes in to blow you away. If you pitch one of the those guys after Giles all of a sudden their fastballs aren't too impressive. And we've already seen Harris and Gregerson choke the 9th away just as much. In the end there's no question who our highest leverage, put 'em away pitcher is. Come playoff time, you will see Devo pitch a few ninth innings if that's where the good hitters and messy bases are gonna be. He's not our "closer", he's just our best reliever. Having a bullpen that allows for that kind of versatility gives us as much potential as any of the other bullpens out there with the supposed "top closers" in the game.
I'm still somewhat confident in Giles. We don't have another closer besides that versatile guy whose role lessens by moving to closer.
First and foremost, "Giles is nails" have never been my words. Why would I mock it if they were? Your argument for giles being a good setup man in the 7th or 8th and putting us at ease is null cause of his defenders constantly saying he needs to be put in a closing pressure situation to be at his absolute best. Well, weve seen him at the closer position now and its not good. Giles was brought here to be the closer and thats what we traded for, giving a **** ton of assets to get him. The year he was brought here and lost out on his opportunity for the closing gig to Gregerson out of spring training, he was upset at it. He wants to close and we want him to be dominate like he should be, but everything doesnt pan out the way youd like and this certainly has not. Hes just not a closer like he thinks he is.
This is EXACTLY the point!!! I've been on record saying that I feel this way EVERY time Hinch puts the ball in his hands and it's been that way since he's been here. Where are all the people who defended Giles and said I was crazy for feeling this way (AND YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE)!! I point examples of why I feel this way and have shown stats to back up why my uneasiness and the same people who think I'm crazy feeling this way have excuse after excuse for him. They don't say $HIT after a performance like last night, but they do POP OFF with the passive aggressive comments when he does well. He's certainly shown this yr to be more effective at home then on the road (he's flat out GARBAGE on the road). I'll close with this. He better get his $hit together, because I don't see the 'Stros acquiring another closer. Fortunate that we have Devo to turn to. There might not be a starter out there to acquire, but maybe the move is to bring in another great arm in the pen (like the Indians did last yr acquiring Miller). Anyway it was great to get the W last night and to finally get LMJ back!!
Giles sucked last night... I'm certainly glad he's much better in close games and actual save situations. For those simply never "at ease"... it's still clear that the first impression scars from last season weigh heavily. Giles is going to have to nail down a ton of meaningful games (i.e.- playoff games) for some to be convinced. Unlike most closers, he's actually still not a finished product... which is a very good thing considering the Astros have him locked up for the future. He's "pitched" more this year than he has at any point in his career. Some also forget the adventures Wagner used to have in non-save situations. These guys lose a touch of mental edge, and they're nowhere near as effective. Lastly, whoever hit on him getting sporadic work... and how it effects his outings... is dead-on. Giles is best when he gets into a routine with semi-regular/very-regular work. This tremendous season has afforded Hinch to not have to use Giles as much as last year... but with inconsistent work comes inconsistent results.
