Breaking news: Pentagon awards contract to United Airlines to forcibly remove Assad Read more: http://www.duffelblog.com/2017/04/p...airlines-forcibly-remove-assad/#ixzz4dyQidwCL
Look, I agree with you that a noncompliant person will make things worse for themselves. If the noncompliant person is making it difficult to require force, then whatever injury they sustain from physical removal is their own fault. But where I don't think we agree is that there was no cause to remove this man. He was a perfect passenger who paid for a service only for United to breach the contract. That's not fair and not deserving to be removed from the plane.
I can see that argument, but it's not for him to decide if he's being treated unfairly or rather it's not relevant if he feels like he's being treated unfairly. When the staff tell him he has to go, he has to go. He's perfectly within his rights to sue the hell out of them after the fact, but he still has to go right then and there. I think that's where we disagree. I think getting bumped from a flight for airline employees is total BS and I would have sided with him in a lawsuit if he had just done the right thing and left the plane when he was instructed to instead of forcing them to physically remove him (which is terribly unfair of him to put those employees in that situation). Once people start acting like that, I just have a hard time being on their side because then it becomes both parties being wrong..
You should read the interview of Royal Jordanian's marketing guy. They have some kid that just comes up with slogans and graphics. He was trolling the hell out of Trump with RJ ads earlier. Spoiler
To me, this was a clear case of "excessive force". Perhaps that's where we disagree. Although it sounds like you're saying that excessive force is "okay" or at least doesn't deserve your sympathy if the victim is in the wrong. I disagree. I don't want to live in a place where my life is threatened just because I might be having a bad day and happened to lash out. Everyone acts like ******* sometimes, they shouldn't be killed for it.
I'm always amused at people playing MMQB when it comes to stuff like this. As if there is some magic spell that can put a person in suspended animation and lift them ever so gently out of their seat, off the plane, and into the terminal. A fight is chaos. It's like trying to referee a car crash. That is why resisting is a bad move. Even if you're in the right. Don't struggle. You will cause harm to yourself and likely others, and you will make it much more difficult to pin the blame for any injuries onto someone else. Save the fighting for the courts.
This is the epitome of what is wrong with customer service in this nation as a whole. If I paid for a Big Mac at McDonalds, I would stand and wait until I got the Big Mac, especially if I saw customers who came at the same time I did get theirs as well. It is my right to say I'm not given the service I paid for, and it is my right to act as my own advocate.
Once again -- where are you getting this idea that because he is 69 years old, or hypothetically pregnant, or whatever, that they can somehow be removed by any means other than what the passenger makes necessary...? Where is this magic button security could have pushed to get him out of his seat?
The fact that he ended up bleeding doesn't mean that it was excessive force. Necessary force can absolutely wind up with people bleeding. Again, put yourself in the position the employees were in, they have to remove a person from the plane who is flat out refusing....how do you get that guy off the plane? I mean, the best way would have been to go get a cop to arrest him and potentially just use his taser on him before pulling him out of there, but if you don't have a taser, it's going to be difficult.
Unlawful commands? Cite source please. Even if UA had no legal right to revoke this man's ticket, I don't think it is up to the police, in the moment, to discern that. They have been summoned and based on the evidence at hand they are detaining/removing this person with probable cause, or whatever is necessary for them to follow through with their jobs. If it turns out later on that UA had no grounds to do what they did, the court will slam them, not the police. Once again -- if you are told by police to do something -- do it. Don't fight. If you're right, the court will make it up to you.
You're a good poster wekko, damned good poster. But if you come into my house, and I ask you to leave, and you don't, I could forcibly make you leave. He was asked to leave, he refused.
Perhaps you would throw a fit over a Big Mac and cause a scene, certainly there are many people that would do just the same thing, but if you are told to leave and you didn't, the cops would come and you'd be removed from the premises and issued a criminal trespass warning, if you went back, you'd be arrested for it. The place to act as your own advocate isn't at the counter of a burger joint.....and the fact that people don't know that is kind of what is wrong with people these days.
