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Obamacare Replacement

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by wizkid83, Feb 24, 2017.

  1. SamFisher

    SamFisher Member

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    Control of both houses of congress, the presidency - and it's all the left's fault.

    Why don't you take some responsibility instead of being a blame-parasite?
     
  2. Commodore

    Commodore Member

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    Start with basic questions.

    Why is an MRI so expensive? If we need one, why don't we shop around for a competitive price?

    Give individuals control of dollars, and remove governmental burdens to providers (of both care and insurance).

    Choice and competition drives cost reduction.
     
    cml750 likes this.
  3. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Member

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    Instead, I see the two different approaches...

    The Trump/republican approach is to focus on lowering taxes and costs first, and in the process, millions of people lose access to affordable health care coverage (and access to health care) while waiting for (if) health care costs drop enough that it becomes affordable enough. Of course, prior to ACA health care costs were rising dramatically, leading to ACA.

    The ACA approach, which focuses on increasing access to affordable healthcare coverage and health care for millions of people that previously could not afford it. Those millions included people with pre-existing conditions.

    A reasonable argument can be made that ACA didn't focus on reducing health care costs. That could easily be said of the Trump/republican plan as well. Seems to me starting with ACA and strengthening it by focusing on cost reduction would be a better approach.
     
    3Rings likes this.
  4. SC1211

    SC1211 Member

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    Garbage replacement bill. Does anyone on the left or right support this thing? Single payer was the way to go. Dems should have gone for it instead of trying to be bipartisan in 09.
     
  5. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Member

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    I suspect MRI costs are so high due to technology costs and profit motive of those involved in the manufacturing and delivery of MRIs. I don't believe programs like ACA have driven up the costs of MRIs. Especially since MRIs were expensive before ACA. I suspect MRI vendors are large and profitable.

    A similar question could be made about the high cost of pharmaceuticals. Again, I believe large pharma companies are profitable. I also wonder why so much is spent of TV ads when the people that watch TV are most likely not involved in their selection. But instead, people focus on liability costs and say pharma companies should be freed from fear of lawsuit...
     
  6. eric.81

    eric.81 Member

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    Call a doctor, give them your insurance information and ask them how much an MRI will cost you. Then call back and ask them for the cash price. The difference will be both staggering and infuriating.
     
    Nook likes this.
  7. Rockets Pride

    Rockets Pride Member

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    How so? Everyone assumed the Pubs have been done for the last 8 years, and Trump won.

    By the way, are you on ObamaCare or welfare? Just curious.
     
  8. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Member

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    No wonder the Trump/republicans were so prepared for the CBO. And who woulda thunk, the CBO analysis of the number of people losing insurance coverage was actually lower than Trump's own analysis!

    White House analysis of Obamacare repeal sees even deeper insurance losses than CBO
    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/obamacare-uninsured-white-house-236019
     
  9. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    So, Trumpcare, or rather Trumpdoesn'tcare is getting blasted.

    Shocker.

    DD
     
  10. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Member

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    I heard on npr about some study where healthcare professionals were tasked to shop and choose their own custom plans and ended up hating the damn thing because of its exhausting complexity and risky gotchas if an emergency were to happen. The researcher almost ended up dying because he decided to wait out a heart problem rather than going to the er.

    As I'm insured by an employer, I have all that decision making taken out of my hands. But being a terribly lazy stock investor and given that most Americans don't even invest or plan their retirements, complex, life alerting decisions like healthcare need to be simplified before that option hits prime time.
     
  11. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Member

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    Those 20+ million don't have the luxury of death panels. They get to die on the streets.
     
  12. Amiga

    Amiga Member

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    If health pros can't figure it out, how do you expect a typical person would be able to? Add in time restraints and in many cases, decisions made for you, not by you, how do expect to reduce cost? There is reality of the real world and there is fantasy that free market alone would take care of reducing costs.
     
  13. geeimsobored

    geeimsobored Member

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    here's my question: what does the government have to do with this? Most people are insured with private insurance companies that have their own contracted pricing and reimbursement agreements with hospitals. In theory, if someone is going to provide "choice" to a customer, it should be insurance companies who would have an incentive to do so in order to lower their own costs.

    If anything, the government did its part. As part of the ACA, the Obama administration published the costs of medical procedures that Medicare is charged by hospitals. The information is already out there today and no one has figured out how to do anything with it.

    In theory this is a free market problem that should be addressed by insurance companies. In reality, this is more or less impossible to do. Hospital pricing is too complex to ever create something consumable as a customer. If this was possible, insurance companies would have built websites and apps to do this years ago.
     
  14. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    Trumpcare doesn't have to be so different there are tons of people and countries around the world that have it working, maybe a bit flawed but better than us.

    Cut out lawsuits or limit the amount for malpractice - cap the amount procedures cost, allow US citizens to buy drugs elsewhere or for the government to negotiate better rates, and allow the government the ability to negotiate rates with insurance companies.

    Of course none of this will happen because all the republicans are bought and paid for by the insurance lobby.

    Oh and one last thing the head of the CBO is a conservative republican.....

    DD
     
  15. Bobbythegreat

    Bobbythegreat Member
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    When insurance alone isn't making something expensive enough, involve the government and you can be sure to make it even more expensive.
     
  16. Air Langhi

    Air Langhi Contributing Member

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    The democrats are also controlled by big pharma. The democrats did have a super majority at one point they should have passed single payer when they had the chance. How the heck did SS and Medicare get passed in this country?
     
    #296 Air Langhi, Mar 14, 2017
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2017
  17. Amiga

    Amiga Member

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    Here is a quite common scenario and another example of reality. You go to an ER that is in network. That doesn't guarantee that the doctors treating there is in network. In fact, there are ERs that is in network for said A with NOT a single doctors there being in network for A. What do you do as a consumer needing ER services?


    https://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/17/...n-comes-the-surprise-out-of-network-bill.html

     
  18. Amiga

    Amiga Member

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    The principle of free market is a conscious choice to choose with one of the choice being not to choose. That new shiny 4K HDR TV is too expensive? I'm not going to buy.

    The principle of health is you don't have a choice to not choose - actually you do, you can choose to suffer and die.
     
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  19. krnxsnoopy

    krnxsnoopy Member

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    Free market doesn't work for Healthcare. When you're bleeding out in the back of an ambulance you don't have the option to choose between different Healthcare options. That is a fundamental aspect of "free market".

    The biggest drain to society re: Healthcare is insurance companies. For profit insurance companies who offer very little in terms of Healthcare aside from meaningless extra layer of administrative tasks while operating to make a profit. Basically another middle-man thay doesnt need to be there. These companies are protected by politicians through lobbyists.

    We also need tort reform which will bring Healthcare costs down.

    We need to be on a single payer system. Australia's system is 2% of income goes towards Healthcare and virtually everything is covered. I'm sure everyone can afford a 2% tax on their income in exchange for whatever premiums they're already paying on there insurance... right?

    But Americans are too greedy. People making 20 million a year don't want to pay 2% of their income, even though they can afford it. They also want the best health care options available to them, FIRST.

    Logically 2% income burden is something nearly everyone can handle. And would not be a dealbreaker that'd bankrupt anyone. Too bad this country has too many greedy, selfish people in general. That and alot of ignorant stupid people who feed into whatever they're told at the expense of themselves lol.
     
  20. Air Langhi

    Air Langhi Contributing Member

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    If you make 200k 2% would be 4k. I am guessing everyone's insurance premium if you include you employee contribution is probably at least close to that unless you pick like the crappiest insurance plan.
     

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