Yeah, it would be an incredibly heavy decision to trade Harrell away right now. His improvement and development has been astronomical, and his energy and hustle is contagious. Obviously I would be much more willing to part ways with Dekker, but I don't think that fits what Orlando is trying to do.
Did you just make this up? Ibaka is known for playing great in the playoffs...every year. Isn't that where you are supposed to "shine"? He is one of the reasons the Spurs always had trouble with OKC. They've beaten SAS twice in the playoffs with Ibaka as a big reason. And the one time they lost to the Spurs (when they won the title) was because Ibaka got injured against the Clippers and missed the first two games, which the Spurs won handily. He's not a Star, but he has shined in the playoffs. When has he "shrunk in every big chance?" I legitimately don't know, and wonder if I'm missing something, or you made that up.
@mightybosstone @heypartner Ibaka has basically averaged 18 & 10 the last 3 years he was in the playoffs. In fact, last season, he absolutely lit it up in 18 playoff games. He had a TS% of .629 and an ORtg of 129. I'm not sure where the narrative that he "shrinks" in the playoffs came from, but it's pretty much a lie. http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/i/ibakase01.html#all_playoffs_per_poss
Ibaka as a 5 would be interesting in our system. Can space the floor and defend the post and rim. Woudn't make our rebounding or defense any worse.
It's probably because he's only really effective at one thing, while being below average in other areas where the Rockets struggle anyway. I'm with you... it's a tough one, and Capela, Harrel, Dekker are all so young and up and coming you'd hate to part with any of them. I'm also with those ok with moving him, as you'd have to trade SOMETHING of value to get value back. And while Harrel has been GREAT at scoring, and despite the fact that the more offense offseason plan seems to have worked to a degree, one still will have to ultimately consider that the team just doesn't have enough defense and rebounding. So if you could move Brewer's contract with Harrel, and get Ibaka back, probably makes some sense. Alternatively, you'd be really betting on Ibaka being that difference maker defensively - which I'm not sure he is anymore - and his rebounding has declined. Pretty back and forth analysis there, eh? I'd personally be on the fence. I'd probably rather move Anderson, frankly. Ibaka is a solid 3 point shooter now (not quite as good as Anderson, but solid), and is more a 4 than a 5. I proposed Anderson and draft picks for Ibaka + Jodie Meeks... which is a move that would allow you to save $7 million in cap space next offseason, which if you can then make a further move to dump Brewer for no $ in return, would get you either definitively in the max cap room space, or very close, while retaining the ability to resign Ibaka, and keep Harrel. But no clue why the Magic would want Ryan Anderson... they wouldn't.
Yeah, and it started before the last 3 years that you mention. Don't forget the 11-11, Game 4 in 2012 versus the Spurs to help Harden shock Pops 4 games in a row from down 0-2, when OKC went to the Finals.
Ibaka is what you hope Montrezl turns into offensively yet, he will likely never reach Ibaka defensively. Including this year's defense which is much more lackluster than previous years. I know you guys wish he would develop into a solid pf but he's just a undersized center with a little range and some fun and exciting hustle. Ibaka gives you 250% of what Montrezl does. The only question to this trade is cost and cap ramifications going forward. Ibaka will make around 4/80-90 while Montrezl makes 1m per. As well as actual age concerns. We over value our players a lot around here, including me because I like trez a bunch. But he gets a lot of open looks from harden which makes him look very good offensively. Ibaka is very good offensively without the help. And world's better defensively, even if he's slumping.
I'm also reclutant in trading Trez, call me crazy but i kinda feel like he's a 3pt shot away from being an interesting starter. And tbh, i would like to wait for a star being available more, and trade him with Sam and/or Clint if that's required...i mean, i'd trade them for George right now (captain obvious), but for Ibaka as today eh...maybe like you're saying, if you can send them Brewer and not spending other good assets might be worth it regardless, but i don't see a package like Trez, 2nd rounder/s, KJ, Brewer being enough...someone is going to offer more.
To me Harrell is pretty worthless for our system. That's why I personally would be okay with him getting traded. He isn't a power forward in our system because he isn't a shooter. He play's center for us, problem with that is, he can't rebound and is well undersized in both height and weight. A center in our system who isn't an above average rebounder is worthless to us IMO. Just like having a PF who can't shoot 3's at a high clip. Harrell's shot has been developing some, but he might be years away from becoming a respectable 3 point shooter. And on a different page, unless Dekker' s 3pt shot improves, it would probably be better to utilize him as a trade asset as well. Not to say Dekker's shot is like Harrell's, Dekker has made over 45 threes this year on 32%. He's much closer to becoming a legitimate 3 point threat in the near future, but I wouldn't be opposed dealing him either for the right upgrade.
disagree here definitely. Ibaka has never been the type of player to get shots on his own. He doesn't have a back to the basket game. He doesn't have any go to moves nor can he handle the ball. Hes mainly just worked on improving his jump shots. Aside from that offensively he is not very good.
Kinda agree, even though i think Trez is already better around the rim (he moves better and has a softer hand imo), his shot in not there yet, and defensively he'll never be similar to what Ibaka is/was. Problem is Trez is just not a center though, no matter how much games we won with him starting there, he doesn't have the size, the instincts or the body to play the spot in this league...might still be ok with that role coming of the bench but that's it. His role is the 4 imo (which btw is his natural position), but unless he's able to develop a decent/good outside shoot he can't play there, at least in this team.
Harrell is actually pretty valuable. His worth comes in especially during small ball and the league has obviously been gearing towards this. He might struggle a little during those times where lineups are a little bigger but it's not like the other bigs aren't either. Each one of our bigs strives and struggles in different situations as far as lineups. That's been a plus for this team this year because the rockets are able to adjust, and plug different guys in these situations. To call Harrell worthless is completely false. His development has been a huge part of the Rockets positive season thus far.
Yeah. The difficulty with Trez is his rebounding and defense generally. Historically we've seen guys like Millsap, or Draymond... who have hustled, boarded and been solid defensively from day one, then work their way into being great offensive players. Not sure how feasible it is the other way around. I feel pretty good that Trez could develop a 3 point shot, and some offensive playmaking moves as a dribbler (some, not a ton). I have MUCH less confidence he can get there on the boards or on defense. Which would make him just this year's version of Landry, or PPat. Fun, likeable, solid bench players that some will b**** about if moved, but who really ultimately won't be missed all that much, so if you can move them in the right deal, you of course do it. Yeah, and I think this is probably why we won't see much of anything from DM until right at the trade deadline. Because its questionable to include any of Dekker, Harrel, Capela in a deal that doesn't obviously move the needle. But in a deal that does - well then you probably are ok moving Harrel and Dekker together. That said, I don't think there will be any of those deals available either, but you never know.
Worthless in our system. He's a excellent finisher, good athleticism and energy. That being said he can't rebound nor shoot which means ideally he shouldn't have a place in our roster. He, like Nene, are playing out of necessity. Both are flat out bad rebounders for center and that is a major detriment to our success. Harrell, on top of the rebounding problem he has at the center position, has a major size problem on defense. Harrell just can't guard most centers. That's why Anderson guards centers so often, which might actually be more fitting for him if both he and Harrell weren't such bad rebounders.
The system isn't that relevant here. His role would be the same in whatever system he played on based on his skill set. Well that's assuming in any other system the coaches are smart enough to utilize his skill set correctly. The players make the system. Not the other way around. If he was completely worthless like you say he wouldn't be showing any value and he has had a very solid season thus far and shown significant growth. can't rebound at all? yeah I'll disagree again. Are you fixed on the notion that you have to get double digit rebounds every night or that means you can't rebound?
If the higherst Orting on the team (128) and 67% Trueshooting is worthless, I would love to know what non worthless looks like. Harrell has been extremely productive in his minutes.
He doesn't have the facilitator like harden to get him the looks he gets this year and is quite efficient. I'm not talking about the post game. We want Montrezl to become Ibaka offensively. Good jump shooter with hopefully range to the 3. Ibaka has that in spades already. Also, not to mention he fits better in this system, because he has the height and length to adequately play center. Right now we are forced to play trez at the 5 and it hurts us defensively. OK same premise. We want him to develop into Ibaka offensively as a 4 for our system. Ibaka is already there plus defense. Brewer/montrezl/1st is great value for us if we could acquire Ibaka for that. He would likely take capela spot in the starting lineup. The anderson/capela/ibaka trio would be a good rotation and you could have any 2 on at the same time. All would likely average around 25 minutes
I was thinking there is a shrinking narrative that big guys who are 6'10 look like 6'8 on TV..... I remember someone saying that We had our fair share of smaller PFs
