Black lives matter vs. All lives matter (an experiment)

You're arguing against yourself without realizing it. People take issue with All Lives Matter because it does exactly what you say, it drowns out the plight of black people. Black Lives Matter is about black lives. Saying Black Lives Matter does not insinuate that only black lives matter. I've already given you an English lesson on this, hopefully you were paying attention. BLM does not want to dilute the message by using All Lives Matter. What if during the Holocaust people from around the world created a "Jewish Lives Matter" movement, under your logic, you would criticize this movement as well, which makes you kind of a dick.

 

You say you're not being obtuse and then offer me this gross oversimplification.

That you don't affirm that black people aren't being handled by police fairly and are victims of systemic racism more broadly is the source of the conflict. Black people (and a good number of white people) know it to be true from personal experience, by anecdote, and from statistics. That you refrain from admitting that it's true is why they are out protesting, to try to force you to recognize it. Now are some of the demands for 'justice' they make for what turns out to be justifiable use of force a bit irrational and overreaching? Yes. It probably wouldn't happen though if mainstream society recognized legitimate manifestations of systemic racism (including btw the 'due process' of law) so that they don't have to reach for the extreme example and assume the worst all the time.

This is the affirmative action argument all over again -- blacks asking for some negation of racism inherent in the system, and conservative whites saying they don't see any systemic racism and any attempt to defend against it is itself racist. How you can live in the USA and not see it though, I can't get.

 

His videos have as much relevancy as this young man's attempt to walk in a woman's shoes for a day.

 

Do they? Or do they want to take advantage of this issue to increase their political power? ('they' here is the leaders, not the followers).

Because, if that is really what they want...what's the problem with All Lives Matter, again? I think, to a very large degree, the 'Black' is important mostly for political purposes. And, I think it gets in the way. Are they 'whites' out there who don't agree that there is still discrimination, or worse, that that is all fine and good? Yes. Are they the majority? No. Are they the ones who would actually advocate change? No. I think creating the devisiveness through the emphasis on Black lives matter works against the goal as you describe above. However, it works FOR any political purposes the BLM leaders probably want.

At the very least, casting aside those who say All Lives Matter as ignorant or obstinate certainly hurts their cause. So, if they really want change, they should at least undertand that. To JuanValdez' point, part of the intent is to tell white people they are racist. Ya, that's going to be constructive. Particularly when a large number of them...aren't. And those that aren't are the very ones they should be embracing, not pushing aside.

 

Pompous Ass much?

All Lives Matter doesn't drown out the plight of ... anyone. Nor did I say anywhere it drowns out the plights of black people. (I guess you were too busy giving English lessons to actually read what I wrote, thereby invalidating said lesson). It indicates that everyone is equally important. Yes, Black Lives Matter is about Black Lives. Hence part of the problem (along with it inherently telling whites they are racist, as JuanValdez pointed out). Where is the concern, for example, for unarmed whites, which are killed at higher rates than unarmed blacks? If BLM is indeed for all lives, why no mention of that??

Fair example of the Holocaust, although interesting that you had to go to such an extreme. The difference being, perhaps, that Jews don't make a point of telling everyone else how racist they are, or shooting police, ... or being pompous asses.

 

Look at the Trayvon and Michael Brown cases. Lots of blacks disagreed on the rulings on the basis of victimhood. I had a black friend tell me that case should be handled "extra carefully" since it will be used as precedent on later cases, with an implication on black people. (We didn't have a heated argument about it or anything. Great guy. Last I heard he was working in medicine.) And, let's just face it, they've stoked an anti-cop atmosphere. You can say what you will about them not really endorsing that kind of message officially but they should be responsible enough to recognize they contributed to that and that they should do something about it. I don't see a shred of culpability on their part.

Like I said, I get that. But you aren't addressing my point at all that BLM's also sent a message that these blacks couldn't possibly be criminals at all; "Let's just ignore due process and incarcerate these cops on the basis they shot a black guy and blacks are being systematically discriminated."

 

I just read through this entire thread as well, trying to keep up with things as I've been out/ill.

What could have been a thread to educate individuals who are unfamiliar with the goals of BLM turned into debates about word choice and a blatant disregard for the obvious inequality, as well as lack of social equity, that African Americans, especially young males, who categorically-identify as African American. experience throughout the course of their lives. This is sad to read from page to page. Sad.

I don't understand why it's so difficult for some to understand how "All Lives Matter" is a slap in the face for African Americans. The point was never to claim that African Americans mattered "more" than anyone else. As one poster wrote, it was a suggestion that African Americans matter, as people, too. BLM has its own internal issues and "bad seeds" like any group of people, but its message should have been interpreted more clearly. However, I don't know if the masses would "let" BLM succeed. Clearly, there is and has been an issue with African Americans having a strong voice and speaking out about injustice, so there's a chance that BLM would never succeed in our current America.

When people try to ignore the treatment of African Americans by law enforcement, and more importantly, society as a whole, they are doing a disservice to themselves and the African American community. This isn't how you alleviate a problem.

 

No, you could have never had any sort of serious discussion as the entire thread was naively based on a video that was clearly a hoax.

 

Exactly, based cheetah.

 

One of the issues is that we patronize black people by calling them African Americans. Why do we not refer to white people as Euro-Americans? Because the fact remains white people in America are not European anymore than blacks are African. Black people are just as American as white people ... why must we single out their ancestry? African American is a racist term at heart.

 

I didn't bother to answer this because I didn't really see this as worthy of a response. I thought he glossed over a lot of my points and it was totally stupid but I'm guessing he ignorantly doesn't see it that way and considering we're starting this discussion again, I have to correct that:

I don't really know where you're going with this but whites could be gone as a group because of racemixing. And it's only being done in white countries. Whites aren't moving to non-white countries for the most part.

I was asking what definition you were using when you called me racist. For the record, is that dictionary definition the one you want to use?

No. And they're practically homogeneous.

No I'm not. That's just the likelihood of it. There are lots of native tribes who still haven't moved past the stone age. It's smarter to think that civilization is more an aberration, particularly the level which white people have managed to get to.

I'm looking at groups. It's not just Mugabe responsible. He's got an army of blacks. They're ****ing up that country collectively.

 

- You've flat out stated that races have different strengths. I wonder what you think of IQ and Race...I can probably guess based on some of your comments in previous threads.

When someone says that the Japanese are more industrious and disciplined than many of their neighbors is that racist? I don't really see any difference from saying there are many 3rd world countries that would be better off being ruled by whites again on the virtue that Western governance is less corrupt and more competent.

- You've made numerous comments disparaging black people and others. You seem to think the 'context' of the post shows your innocence, no one is getting the joke besides you. Any other person that makes a racist joke that falls flat usually apologizes.


"Oh dear. Black people threatening to deport themselves. It's hilarious these people actually think them leaving would be a negative for the rest. Whatever shall we do without black people patrolling inner city streets?" There is no context to this quote other than you replying to a story. How is this not racist? I've asked you sincerely explain yourself before but every time I ask you to explain what you mean you just deny to do it at all.

They were black and they were threatening to deport themselves. The people who patrol inner city streets are black.

- You believe in white genocide, which is usually the biggest sign. Why? Simple. People that believe that think the purity of their 'race' means something. Most African-Americans are mixed, it's an incredibly high number, if anyone wanted to claim genocide by miscegenation it would be African-Americans...but it's a silly idea anyways. It presumes superiority is being diluted by lesser races.


'But, I never said I was against mixed children' you're right, I don't think you have if that is what you're thinking. It seems to be implied but I'm not sure you've ever said you were against it. You have though (even in the post that I've quoted) seem to think that if there are less white people then that is a concern. Why is that? Why is that a concern? If White people become 60% of the country instead of 70% then why is that a big concern for you?

Well, obviously, if whites are replaced by other races then they were exterminated. Their stock was cut off.

I said this before, I don't have an issue with whites becoming a minority in the country if it was through normal means and by that I mean we had a sensible immigration policy and whites simply couldn't keep their numbers up whether it be by competence or choice to not have children. But that's not what's happening right now.

Foreigners are displacing Americans abnormally because of uncontrolled mass immigration. They're coming in, taking jobs, depressing wages for Americans and for them to make a family. And this is a phenomena unique to white countries. Whites don't want to move to brown countries for obvious reasons.

But don't take just my word for it. This is the same strategy cooked up by Islam extremists:

 

lol thanks for bumping this up, I almost forgot that bigtexxx got duped by a fake, phony video and decided to post it on the forums.

 

Not sure why anyone even tries reasoning with the usual race-obsessed posters around here. Their Alt White angst is well beyond anyone's reach. Just let them roll around miserably in their own feelings of white persecution and use your time more constructively.

 

I think it is curious that he actually believes he's not racist. I mean of course it would be easier to just ignore him but people like him exist. In fact I think there have been a bump in people like him or rather they are much more confident of letting their opinion be known. I don't think ignoring them really does anything, they just go back to their echo-chamber forum with their other fellow alt white nationalists and disappear. I think Dei likes having his opinions challenged, he's out of his echo chamber here so I'm glad to remind him of that.

 

Trump Lies Matter

 

I'm not quoting your previous post you've used to bump the thread because a lot of it is addressed below.

You don't see it as a problem because you believe in pseudo-science that is race realism, correct? If so then from your POV it makes sense to you to say "3rd World countries would be better off being ruled by whites" even with the atrocities that happened thanks to colonization you say that. It just shows an ignorance of history mainly.

As for the Japanese, actually no, it's not racist to say that. Since Japan is a country, you can attribute that to a country. As for the homogeneity of Japan, it really is irrelevant unless you think there is some kind of benefit to it. Since you haven't made that argument (yet) then I won't spend time talking about it.

Well here is the issue, you could have said this without saying 'Black' but when you said that you came off as wanting a certain thing. Also, not sure if you've been to inner city streets but black people do not 'patrol' inner cities.

There is nothing more natural than reproduction lol. I say that lightly, I know you take your genocide seriously. I want to explain something though....there is no such thing as genocide by reproduction. Listen to me, genetics don't work this way. It doesn't just throw away 'white' genes (whatever those are...) into the DNA trash bin never to be accessed again. You talk about liberals redefining a word, your group of people (Alt-Right, Race realists, whatever you want to call yourself) have redefined the word 'Genocide'.

Whites people can't be 'replaced' by reproduction, the result of two 'races' is a biracial child. Some of these people can pass for being white, some of these can pass for being the race of their other parent, some of these people just look really unique. In the end the genes from their white parent were not 'replaced' this is why genocide is defined by mass murder because that's how you effective end a group of people. Extinction.

As to this idea that all the white countries are being invaded...well, America never was a white country in the first place. As for Europe, I agree that many of those countries are too small to take in a large influx of people no matter their color or origin.

This idea that these people are coming in, taking jobs, that whole thing. You are blaming the poor person that is doing all they can to make a living for themselves, instead you should direct your anger at the person that hires them...you know...like Trump.

Yes yes, that was a pretty barbaric sentiment.(The video you posted) It boils down to basic human conquer and conquest. Crush your enemies. See them driven before you. Hear the lamentations of their women. I believe that we are past that stage of humanity though, that guy isn't. He doesn't really prove that there is a genocide going down either. He's just some dude shouting into the wind, it's pathetic really. I'm sure many of his followers believe that though, I'm sure there are plenty of people that think that will happen...but just like there are plenty of people that think they can kick all brown people out of America, me taking some extreme guy and showing a clip of him really doesn't do anything.

I think the sad part about it is, you are closer to that guy than you realize. You are both just opponents in the irrelevant race wars that most in the world care little about.

 

It's alright. My people control the presidency, Senate, and House.

 

Sports team. That's how you see this. It's a shame.