Hard to say, Cavs didn't give him much burn. If he's bought out and I'd absolutely add him to at least see.
I guess if all you look at is points and rebounds... I appreciate all around gameplay and that he led a franchise with Mike Miller as the 2nd best player to 3 straight playoff appearances. A franchise that had been a laughing stock before Pau Gasol. Kevin Love never did that. He might have been able to if he had stayed, but that would be making assumptions.
Well then I'm sure you can appreciate Kobe leading a team with Smush Parker, Chris Mihm & Kwame Brown to the playoffs in a WAY harder conference, correct?
Not really. That's what superstars are supposed to do. As a Rockets fan, I spent half Dream's career watching him drag garbage to the postseason (nice way to completely exclude Odom contributing 15/9/6 a night and 19/11/5 in the postseason...team doesn't suddenly look so bad with a 2nd option giving you that ). I saw Harden drag a team without anyone as good as Odom to the playoffs his 1st year here. Now getting to the FINALS with this supporting cast....appreciate that: http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/CLE/2007.html
Gasol had more success carrying leading a team than Kyrie or Love ever did. He took teams to 1st round exists, same as Kobe post Shaq until they were paired together. If a guy leading teams to the playoffs in a conference you think is so tough isn't impressive, then surely leading your team to the lotto isn't (and Kyrie was in the east).
So many different elements go into a teams success. I think Gasol has always been a solid player. But he is NOWHERE near a franchise player or has he ever been. He's a solid player who can give you allstar numbers on occasions. Kevin Love is a franchise player. Kyrie Irving's a franchise player. Chris Bosh & Dwayne Wade were franchise players. Lebron has had more "help" than anybody you compare him too. Hatred for Kobe is making ppl crazy I see.
This is funny. There is no rational argument to label Kyrie, Bosh or Love as a franchise player but not consider Gasol to be one as well. And why did you leave Odom off when you mentioned the "horrible" Kobe cast? A 15/9/6 sidekick is pretty good.
Lol. What's your rational for making Pau Gasol a elite superstar again? The knock on Gasol has always been he is soft in pressure moments. A "soft" franchise player? Maybe that's why Memphis traded him Lamar Odom? lol. So this is the supporting cast for championships: Lebron: Chris Bosh/D.Wade/Ray Allen Kyrie Irving/Kevin Love Kobe Bryant: Shaq Pau Gasol/Lamar Odom/Metta World Peace
WTF? Gasol is 2x better than Love, saying he is "solid" doesn't come close to how good he is. Gasol was able to lead absolute crap to the playoffs, Kobe at least had Lamar Odom and Andrew Bynum (putting up double doubles every night), only good player on Gasol's team was Shane Battier. And a guy who has help won't put up crazy numbers, Lebrons stat line is due to him having very little help. 3 stars and garbage means a ridiculous effort nonetheless its not like Wade and Bosh were scoring 50 pts a piece during their last run they didn't even get 10 pts combined on their last game! OTH Kobe is the only superstar who had 40% FG and still won a ring. That's what you call babied.
So? What were Odom and Gasol's stats during the run again? Its really funny seeing Kobe fanboys defend their idol. The "soft" knock on Gasol is just BS spread by Kobe fanboys, Gasol has been in so many pressure situations since he was a kid, dude is the captain of the Spanish ball team how can he be soft under pressure when he represents his country in the Olympics? His team always got swept because they play against the Spurs with TD in his prime, even post Shaq Lakers would get swept. Kobe was the one who is soft, he ran Shaq put of town then started crying when he couldn't do it alone, even lost it when Bynum wasn't traded for Jermaine O'Neal. At least Gasol sucked it up and went to war despite knowing he would lose, Kobe made his own bed them didn't want to lie in it.
What's your rationale for making Kyrie, Love or Bosh elite superstars? You said LeBron had more help than anyone. I noted Gasol was better than some of the players he had. That's a good attempt though/ Why did you leave Lamar Odom off when discussing the "bad" Kobe teams? I've only asked you three times. No one would trade a prime Shaq for Wade, Bosh and Allen, not to mention the rest of the rosters. No one would trade Irving/Love for Gasol/Odom.
Huh? Kevin love went a whole season averaging 26pts & 12rebs. Before that I think 21pts & 15rebs. Gasol has NEVER even put up a 20&10 season. 2X times better? What on earth are you talking about there. Odom & Bynum aren't even worth mentioning as superstars so I won't even waste my breath. Any team with Wade (HOF), Bosh (Franchise player), Ray Allen (HOF 3pt shooter) will be dominant over role player That's just a terrible bias assessment. Again. Lebron has had the MOST help of any superstar. Wade, Bosh & Ray Allen sacrificed their games for the betterment of the team. They were all once superstars but had to adjust their games. But if Lebron was a no-show then they took over for him (like Kyrie does now). So you had 3 FRANCHISE players on one team, yet Kobe was "babied"? lol. Lets not forget Kobe stayed with the same team. I'm sure he could've "taken his talents" elsewhere to form a "superteam" with his friends. True competitors don't do that though
Better than who? Statistically Gasol is solid but his numbers don't match up to guys like Bosh or Love pre-Lebron. These guys were dominant. Keep lying to yourself if you wish Because he's nowhere near being a superstar. You keep mentioning him as if he was a franchise player, which he is clearly not. He's not Pippen, Mchale, Dumars or any of the sidekicks the elite superstars had. It's freakin Lamar Odom lol. You can't be serious You're delusional bro. Only in your world would a GM trade 2 role players for 2 superstar caliber players. I don't know if you realize how dumb this looks
Love's stats are hollow stats, by your logic is he better than Tim Duncan? I don't think Love even had a single 0.500 season his entire stat in Minny, whats the point of his stats if he can't make his team win? Compare Love's minny without him vs Gasol's Grizzlies without him and Minny's roster looks better, but Grizzlies were able to consistently make the playoffs while the Wolves were perpetually in the lottery. You think Rubio is worse than (old and about to retire) Damon Stoudamire? What about Pekovic compared to Slowmile Swift? C'mon dude. Bosh, Wade and Allen's reputation as superstar happened because they had a long period of excellence, we're just talking about Lebron and the ~4 years Lakers had Gasol, Kobe, Bynum and Odom all together. You keep mentioning stats, well if you look at stats, Bynum, Gasol and Odom performed much better in the playoffs than Wade and Bosh did, that's a fact. Lakers were up against a Celtics team with their own big 3 and prime Perkins and Rajon Rondo, yet Lakers were able to win more titles when they went head to head. Obviously they were stacked, otherwise Celtics would've won 3 titles instead of just 1. Its not like Kobe put up historic numbers in the playoffs either, like I said that was the year Kobe shot just 40% FG in an entire series and yet he still won a ring. Since when did Lebron have that luxury? Shoot 40% and still win a ring now that's getting carried! It's ridiculous how Kobe fanboys try to paint Lebron as the one who is babied talk about projection LMAO. I'm not sure what you're trying to prove by keeping on harping on Lebron's teammates, is there a law against having good teammates? MJ btw played with the 2nd best wing player in the league every single year he won a ring and Kobe's 3 titles he won with Shaq who was clearly the most dominant player in the league at the time. Lebron proved how good he was alone, 2 times he brought a sorry ass Cleveland teams to the finals by himself. First one when he was starting out, the year he left that same roster was so bad they got the number 1 pick. Second time, both Irving and Love were injured, and with just himself he still took GSW to 6 games. What has Kobe ever done by himself? Oh yeah, he reached second round against PHX and then quit on his team when they got blown out. And that wasn't even by himself, he had Odom who was playing at an all star level as well at the time and Caron Butler too. Revisionist statement? Kobe was all about ready to jump ship when the Lakers weren't as good as he thought he would be: http://www.latimes.com/sports/laker...-trade-2007-chicago-bulls-20150223-story.html The only reason he stayed was because the Lakers got good again with Pau and Odom and Bynum. How will Kobe form a super team? Nobody wants to play with him because he has a big ego and doesnt want to share the ball! The only stars who criticize Lebron for leaving are guys like Kobe and MJ who were always in good teams, obviously if your GM was amazing and surrounded you with crazy good players why will you demand a trade elsewhere? Your claim of Lebron being the most babied superstar is just dumb because Lebron was the MVP every year he was in Miami, his 2nd year he was even almost unanimous choice except some Kobe fanboy writer voted for Melo. How is someone who is babied become an MVP? If Lebron had an easy time every game why will people vote him the MVP, when often times the biggest factors in MVP are statistical leaders who are on winning teams? You mean to say someone who is babied will put up ridiculous stat lines like 26-12-8 while playing the most minutes in the league? In comparison while Kobe has 5 rings how many MVPs does he have? That's a 4-1 discrepancy between the two, we all know who is babied and who isn't. This thread is about Korver to the Cavs and not Lebron vs Kobe, but to compare the two is a joke as Lebron is so far above Kobe it's not even funny. Lebron is already at least top 5 in NBA history, Kobe's probably not even gonna reach top 10.
Guys like Irving, Bosh and Love never took a team to the playoffs like Gasol did, in a conference you claim was tougher. Bosh got to the postseason in the East but you seem to be more impressed with what happens in the West, at least when it's convenient. But he's not garbage either. You tried to make it appear that Kobe played with a horrible team when he had a very good 2nd option that you conveniently left off. He's good enough as to where having him alongside you means your team isn't crap. Making the playoffs with Odom alongside you is nothing to brag about. Yes, you are delusional.
What are you arguing here? Before going to Miami Bosh averaged 24pt/10rebs and was arguably the best PF in the NBA. He was elite in every way. Gasol in his best season was never even a 20/10 guy. The gap in talent is HUGE. Your argument comes from a place of hatred of Kobe Bryant, which is why you're not making sense He's not garbage. But you're comparing Odom to players that are superstars & elite at their respective positions. If you're arguing Kobe had more help than Lebron, and use Lamar Odom as proof of this, you lose any credibility you had. Lamar Odom is not Kevin Love, Chris Bosh, D.Wade or Ray Allen. Stop it When comparing championship rosters it is crap
Honestly this isn't gonna work it's just a waste of time trying to argue with the guy. He's obviously a kobe diehard fanboy, when a dude comes up and tells you a guy with 4 MVPS and led the league in minutes played for both regular season and playoffs while compiling a historic stat line is the most babied superstar whereas the dude who just has 1 MVP and has never achieved anything on his own without a dominant big man and won a ring shooting at an abysmal 40% FG is GOAT you know there's no changing that poster's mind. I personally refuse to waste any more brain power trying to argue with him because he'll just regurgitate the Kobe fanboy arguments we'll all hear before. Bottom line has Kobe ever taken a crap team to the finals? Has lebron ever taken a crappy team to the finals? Yes? Two times? Case closed.
That LeBron played with more help than anyone else. Isn't that what you claimed? You claim players like Kyrie and Love are elite. If they are elite, then so are guys like Gasol. Bosh was never arguably the best PF in the NBA. There was never a point in is career where you would have taken him over Duncan, Dirk or KG (until one of those 3 got old). Gasol in his best seasons took the Grizz to the playoffs 3 times. I thought you were impressed with getting to the playoffs in the West? Let's stay consistent here. And guys like Kyrie and Love have never even led a team to the playoffs. How elite are you going lotto every year? As far as Odom, when you listed the "bad" Kobe teams you made it appear like he played with utter crap. He had a very good player alongside him (Odom). He had the luxury of having that same very good player come off the bench when he won titles again. Stop trying to downplay his supporting talent.
