I think most of us dont doubt it was a Russian actor of some sort. Hell, they probably had access to the system a long time ago and a different party also compromised the system and released the info to wikileaks. The difference is the left wants to go to war over something Russia and everyone else has been doing for years ... because their dirty laundry got exposed. The left is so narcissistic they continue to blame Russia for Hillary losing when it was their corrupt and unethical behavior being exposed. You should be lashing your anger out on your own party instead of saying "Im upset at them to, but but but but its Russias fault "
You keep saying the left is blaming the Russians for Hillary losing. I think there are some on the left who have said that, but most that I've seen have admitted that there is no way to conclude that it changed the election. As was pointed out, people have already cleaned out the leadership from the DNC, and the analysis of why Hillary lost is underway, and has been examined again and again in the media. I also don't think the left wants to go to war. I haven't seen a large movement pushing for going to war. But it is interesting to see some of those on the right tremble with fear at the thought that standing up to the Russians for their espionage against the United States might lead to trouble.
You're speaking out of both sides of your mouth. You are saying there is no way to conclude it changed the election but on the other hand, but we should retaliate for interfering. There is no conclusion to make. Hillary lost Penn, Mi and Wi and that had nothing to do with Russia. The allegations state Russia released the DNC's unethical behavior. People were swayed by the unethical behavior findings, not because of Russia or wikileaks. You can call exposing unethical behavior as interfering all you want. Im not going to blameshift the responsibility of this unethical behavior. This is 100% on the DNC, regardless of who exposed it. Acting on allegations w/out proof is what causes wars. Wars are most often fought for economical reasons. We dont need to be backing Russia into a corner and having them side with China if we can instead convince Russia staying in their lane is their best interest. The reality is the west provokes Russia just as much as Russia provokes us. The left fears Trump will actually build decent relations with Putin and expose Obamas terrible foreign policy.
Nobody is blaming that on Hilary's failure. The only reason Special Ghost and the other idiots won't admit it is because the second they do nothing stands in the way of them being treasonous dumbasses. That is the level of stupidity they are approaching. Even if Russia were to launch a nuke tomorrow, they would salivating at the though of Obama leaving office and pinning something on him...and this is coming from someone that has voted independent and republican almost every time. For example, reply to him saying "Hilary lost b.c the Donald was better, and now lets talk about the problem with a foreign nation ****ing around with our country..." He won't address it, not because he is that stupid, but because he knows what it would entail.
Jesus christ that is stupid and hypocritical. There was less proof with respect to Hilary these last couple of years and the scandals you guys have been masturbating to...and now three intelligence agencies have come to the same conclusion you want to showcase the pinnacle of ignorance for the internet. There is proof of Russian hacking beyond the DNC btw doofus. Congratulations.
Does it not get old repeating the same old crap? The left have no interest in going to war over this. If there is one someone that is interested, it might be the McCain and his buddy camp. I expect you to know this, but for some reason, you stick to something that just isn't true. It's crap and how many time you repeat it doesn't make it true. Why must you keep on repeating this? And again, the left isn't blaming Russia for Hillary lost. Maybe there is a few here and there. Why must you repeat this also? Why aren't you capable of looking pass your failed above beliefs and toward the real issues that many of us on the left and right are concern about? What are you so afraid off that you can't even consider going that route?
Special Cadet has been repeating it for 10 pages now, I want to see how much longer he can go. Anybody know if its an old age thing with him...because in that case I wouldn't hold it against him.
Ok, so Obama has responded. Are you on the left satisfied now and we as a country can move forward with Trump hopefully to improve relations with Russia? Or do you feel not enough has been done? I'm curious.
I think you are still confused as to what the aim and end game is here. It is to prevent a foreign entity from infiltrating our networks and carrying out malicious attacks. I'm not on the right, but as you are and seem to be posting as such I can understand if you still fail to grasp this and want me to repeat it over several pages.
LOL. Pavlovian response here. I am simply asking you a question. Are you satisfied with Obama's response? Is that enough for you?
If we are having a serious conversation, I am not. I am more optimistic at what McCain and Graham will be able to accomplish. I think the attitude amongst congressional members is good, and sending a message about how these attacks will not be tolerated in any sort of way, and will be met with equal or harsher retaliation is the way to go.
So you aren't so much interested in what exactly happen? You are satisfied to be in the dark on this? I'm hoping Congress can get to a good bottom and shine a light on this. We know, learn, change, take any action necessary and proceed on. That's all. Simple.
I agree somewhat, but there is no indication that Obama hasn't already "sent that message" privately in the past. Putin and Russia either didn't take it seriously or it didn't happen. Either way, escalation is a dangerous path to lead down, and we are hardly in a position to point the fingers at other countries. Ever hear of Stuxnet? Or how about that time our State Department sent money to a group in Israel trying to oust Netanyahu? I think Trump has it just about right. Come January 20th, we reset (for real this time) our relations with Russia. Then, we see what happens. In the meantime, spend some god damn time and money on ACTUALLY protecting ourselves from this sort of attack instead of just paying lip service like we have the last 8+ years.
LOL. Another pavlovian response. WHERE did I ever state I have no interest in what exactly happened? I simply asked you if you were satisfied with Obama's response. A question you never specifically responded to. I would agree with you on this. Unfortunately, there might not ever be a "getting to the bottom of this" moment. You do realize this don't you?
LOL back for same reason. And I simply asked an honest question. I don't read mind. I did answer it. So to be clear, no I don't care about Obama's response without understanding what actually happen (yes, I read the report - it was nothing much new). I thought it was a bit pre-mature without Congressional work completing. Maybe there is much more to it that we aren't allow to know and they have much more information that they felt like they can start to response now. Don't know. I'm hoping, as I stated, that Congress shine a light on this. Maybe it ended being some lame public report with the good stuff hidden behind secret stamp - and if so, so be it. But I'm hoping we get much more than that.
Your "question" was framed in the manner of making an accusation. An accusation that had no foundation based upon anything I have posted here. It was made with a HUGE assumption on your part about me. No, you don't read minds...you just jump to conclusions. The report was pre-mature? Interesting. Who is in control of when that report is released? Where is the "report" and response to the hacking of the OPM? Apparently that wasn't nearly as important. (By the way, I have family members who are affected by that hack...nobody seems to give a **** about that though). My question was simply an inquiry about how you feel about our current leaders response. It appears you don't care much for it at this point. I also see very little criticism of Obama's administration for their handling of cyber security over the past 8 years. Where is your outrage about these things?
You seem to actually be making a point, I may have confused your response with Special Cadet, who seems incapable or reasoning at all. To answer your question... With Trump playing Fredo... no way. Why would the Russian govt care when our new president elect seems to be in their lap and is odds with his own party and congress? Trump may hit the reset, but that doesn't make it ok to splinter our branches of government and ally with a foreign nation. Who knows if it will be successful, but what he is showcasing is extreme immaturity and weakness from inner conflict. What Russia did was wrong and has to be addressed, that isn't even a question at this point. To sing kumbaya like Trump is doing is showcasing our weakness and making it ok in the future. A very dangerous game. I have criticized Obama a lot, but I have also given him a benefit of the doubt with a congress that met with the sole purpose of being at odds with him over everything. They had no interest in accomplishing anything with the executive branch. If the dems do it with Trump, I will criticize them too. The problem with Obama was that he was too willing to reach across the aisle and appease the republicans, which is an ok stance. If he was less concerned with what everybody thought of him, he could have accomplished more.
WRT your analysis...I think its a bit premature to assume Trump and Congress aren't on the same page. Yes, there are a few hawks in Congress who prefer harder sanctions. There are probably others who don't feel exactly the same way. Congress isn't some monolithic branch of govt with one mindset. Meanwhile, criticizing Trump is certainly valid, however I wish folks would actually allow him to take the oath of office and actually do something before criticizing. There is an old phrase attributed to Teddy Roosevelt "Speak softly but carry a big stick". Perhaps Trump is trying a form of that right now. Will it work? We'll see.
To your latter point, absolutely, which is why I am only criticizing him for what he is doing right now. He could very well be successful once he takes office, but I still don't agree with what he's doing right now. There is also a possibility he and Obama are playing good cop/ bad cop, so I agree with your assertion on speculating as well.
