damn that was a lot of adrenaline this episode phew. Perfect way for Ramsey to die I just kept hoping Jon would came that ****er suffer and it was fitting that he died by the way he killed so many
LOL at people b****ing about it being predictable. This HAD to happen, and it was done perfectly imo.
What an emotional episode. Never have I relish the thought of somebody getting eaten alive as much that Bolton b*stard. One of the cruelest mf'ers ever on a screen.
It was an option to return. Rushing achieves nothing. Tormund even said, "Don't." Doing what Ramsay wanted you to do is not an option, if you want to have a chance in hell. Foolish move that could have repurcussions with Sansa, Tormund and Davos. Retreating holding your dead brother, and making Ramsey charge you instead, as planned, has cinematic value, too. anyhoot: We're not really discussing the probability of survival. We're discussing things moving forward. As durvasa said, some of us believe that Sansa might have a case that Jon acted against the group's better judgement, and Jon's very own plan, too. Tormund agrees with his "Don't" exclamation, before Jon charged. Davos seemed reluctant, albeit fiercely loyal, to order the charge. After all those killed, men needed for Jon's bigger war, they might say he is unstable in battle now...and Littlefinger is there to chime in on the discussion, too.
I for one think Jon's supposed blunder on the battlefield will help him tremendously. Sure, he doesn't have an army anymore, but his against all odds suicide attack will be the stuff of legends in the North once words get out. People will flock to serve such a fierce leader. Sure, Littlefinger may have The Vale and perhaps even Sansa through his trademark manipulation, but neither are fit to rule the North and won't be able to unite the different houses needed to attack King's Landing and finish what Robb started. The point of this scene from the writers' perspective was to establish Jon as a bonafide warrior the people would be willing to follow as the true King in the North. Again, look at the parallels in this episode. Jon and Daenerys both singlehandedly led a charge to defeat enemies in the battlefield. They are now unquestionable leaders of their people and on the march towards perhaps a shared destiny until they meet.
Ramsey was expecting him to retreat, with or without Rickon. Ramsey is not honorable, he has no issue shooting Jon in the back. After shooting Rickon he smirks and orders the archers to fire, Jon assumedly survives at this point by doing something Ramsey does not expect and attacking alone rather than collecting Rickon and/or falling back into the area where the arrows are falling.
I was entertained. Were you not entertained? Complaints about predictability? Really now? After all the b****ing for the last 3 episodes? Give some people an inch, they take a mile. Snow's rush wasn't a blunder. It was Snow being as authentic as any other Stark. As for Sansa, she had to withhold info from John because she needed Ramsey to be baited into moving out with his superior forces and toy with John. Otherwise Ramsey would've just stayed in winterfell wearing his pjs and defend with a capable 6,000 troops. This. Charging forward was the safer move against the arrows, which was instant death...but he left himself open to that cavalry charge.
It's boring though when it's so obvious. We all knew he was going to end up "dog food" from an earlier episode. Jon was secondary in this episode. I think the writers had him do that to show Sansa's intentions. Sansa's a parallel character to Dany. This episode brought it up front and overtly showed their diverging paths. Both sold/married off for an alliance/power. Raped on their wedding nights. Both possibly carrying "monsters" inside them... Now Dany has people she trusts and forgoed the option of burning a city to the ground in her revenge against the masters. Sansa on the otherhand feels alone. She had decided to sacrifice Rickon & Jon, her burnt city, to get Ramsay. It wasn't a lucky last minute save by the Vale's forces. Especially with how Sansa harping on about Ramsay's cunning. Jon & his wildlings were expendable and were used to whittle down Ramsay's force.
Not happy about Rickon. Man in this show the good guys take a lot of losses but great episode. I love this show hard to choose between this and Walking Dead both tops for me.
The Army was getting slaughtered no matter what, they couldn't make it more obvious with the subtle 'they have greater numbers' line every chance they could. Jon offered to give his life to spare theirs. Jon went 1 v 6000 without any of them by his side. Jon is the exact person a soldier wants leading them. That was my thought as well. Of course it was a game to lure Jon out. And Ramsay's plan the whole time was to light Jon up with a huge volley once he was on in the open. He didn't once think Jon would singlehandedly charge at his position.
I think the main point of interest in discussion is not the physics of his choice, but that now he doesn't really have any men left, whereas the Lord of the Vale sent his cousin Lady Stark an Army, and Littlefinger is there, and Brienne is loyal to Sansa, too, and might have the Tully Army. This might come down to Team Sansa v Team Jon As for the physics, the arrows were in flight before Jon's horse started running. The arrows were meant for Rickon, to ensure he was dead. Jon's horse was standing behind Rickon's position. 4-5 arrows hit Rickon, arrows hit in front of Rickon, and arrows landed a little behind Jon's position. If the horse can run out from under a high-angle salvo by going forward, the horse can out-run them going away, too. It's the same distance. Ramsay ordered the salvo to make certain Rickon was dead. It wasn't to kill Jon...that gains little. He needs to kill the Stark heir for certain after toying with him from 50-75yds away, and 4-5 arrows indeed hit Rickon.
Great show to watch even of people say is predictable. I have to say the giant wad very inefficient when the wall of guys wad around him. Could have easily swiped Masses of them out of the way. Instead of picking them up one by one. Horrible fighting ability lol.
For Jon this is more about the North. I'm sure Jon would be happy to leave Sansa in charge of Winterfell, he just wants the realm united to face the bigger threat. He's not a man of politics and games, I doubt he cares much about that... I doubt there will be much clashing with him vs Sansa as to who should rule over Winterfell. He's a b*stard and he's never claimed to be anything else. The remaining starks, it's clear who will be the one that wants any kind of power. Bran is becoming some mythical wizard, Arya was trained to be an assassin, and of course Jon has seen the true threat...I don't think any of the others will fight her for that title...now Baelish...we know he will. But yes this will add to his legend now and yes he shares some destiny with Dany almost certainly.
You knew the giant was going to die because it's Game of Thrones. SOMEone has to die (besides Rickon). Jeeeeeeez, you posters with your, "Ho hum, how predictable." Did you predict movie-quality CGI dragons attacking a ship? (And please don't say anything like, "Well, the quality was okay," because then I'll know you're big-time trolling.)
I agree with this. Just like Sansa warned Jon the night before, Ramsey is a master game player. Jon's main strategy was to get Ramsey mad a make him do something stupid on the battle field. Instead it was Ramsey enraging Jon and Jon doing something incredible foolish on the battlefield. Whats worse is that Sansa warned Jon the night before the battle that they would not be able to get Rickon back alive. She told Jon that Ramsey would never let him live and to prepare himself and not let it effect him in battle. What does Jon do? He witnesses Rickon die and flushes all of the battle plans down the drain. What Jon did was the human thing to do but not the smart thing to do.
The long sequence where we were following Jon's third person perspective through the fight was one of the best war scenes I've watched. Like combining Black Hawk Down's opening with Peter Jackson, complete with the spooky ghost cavalry at the end. To those complaining about Jon being baited to start the battle, how else would a start have occurred? Bolton's men outnumbered Jon's 2 to 1, and the first move was pretty much on Jon since they were trying to advance on Winterfell. Even if there were trenches and other strategies, it was not gonna start with Ramsay charging because he had no need to other than boredom. I do find it intriguing that the legend of Jon Snow being an elite warrior is spreading around. Most of his feats have been more leadership based than combat heroics like, say, Barristan.
