Florida Night Club Shooting - at least 20 dead - impact on US elections?

Terrorist acts are often planned out for years.....but of course I know you want to believe he was just an angry gay man rather than realizing that his sexual preference is a completely irrelevant factor in this. We know he frequented a mosque that has produced a suicide bomber already and we know he often consumed a great quantity of "jihadist propaganda"....but yeah, you want to focus on the possibility that he was secretly gay because that is somehow relevant.

Gay, straight, or somewhere in between, Muslims that have been radicalized are threats to commit terrorist acts. Sexuality is as irrelevant in this instance as what his favorite sport is because there's no link between those factors and terrorist acts. I'm sorry if you can't see that, but I doubt I can help you.

 

I would like to extend a special prayer to the Latino community; a large number of the victims of the Orlando massacre were from this community, and they are a special and valued part of our American culture.

Oramos por todos ustedes, nuestra Latino hermanos y hermanas.

 

But it's clear that his support of militant islam wasn't coherent. He supported opposing militant Islam groups.

It looks more like he already had a murderous rage and hatred, and then supported any possible group that was in the news to somehow find company in his violent and hateful tendencies.

That seems more likely than him being devoted to a radical Islamic philosophy which he felt led him to committing violence.

 

I don't think they are really separate.

He has for years supported militant Islamic causes.

He was a regular at the Mosque... he has had "issues" in the past with his suspension at school for supporting the 9/11 attacks.

He also had targeted other areas that do not seem to have an element of sexuality involved.

Islam is intertwined into all of this..... now, that doesn't excuse the fact that he ended up attacking homosexuals (primarily) or made statements against homosexuals..... but he believed in a radical form of Islam that advocated the death of homosexuals among others.

If you want to tell me that you believe he was a closeted homosexual, with self hatred after years of a family that was strict and thought homosexuality was wrong, and was a devout follower of a brand of Islam that taught that homosexuals should die...... and that coupled with mental problems caused this tragedy; then that is reasonable.

I am not buying what some have said, that this is simply a case of a man that was a closet homosexual that hated himself and took it out on the patrons at the bar.

 

Clearly using gay apps is an indication that you are about to commit a terrorist act. Don't believe all the talk about religion, it's sexual preference that leads to terrorism.

 

You're really pushing this straw man in the Hangout and here.

 

What don't you get? This wasn't about Islam. It was about being gay and not being able to bear it. It's a hate crime at the end of the day.

 

I didn't mean to say it wasn't related at all to Islam or wasn't using his incoherent allegiance to radical Islam as an either/or situation with homosexuality.

I'm going to pretend to know the definitive motivation behind this guy's attack.

 

I'm just making fun of the people that are pushing the narrative that this was about him being gay rather than about him being a radicalized Muslim....kind of like the person I'm responding to below....so no, it's not a straw man, people really are that stupid.

Of course. I mean, let's ignore the evidence about him attending a mosque that produces radicalized Muslims, the evidence of his wife knowing about the attacks and knowing it was terror related, his father admitting it was terror related, the FBI's conclusion that he was a radicalized Muslim when they investigated him in the past, the excessive amount of "jihadist propaganda" he consumed online, and his actual words and focus only on the narrative that his sexuality was the cause of this all. Brilliant.

 

Except the shooter at the time of the shooting was proclaiming his loyalty to ISIS. As far as I've heard, he wasn't shouting out about killing all homosexuals.

It could have been that his hatred of homosexuals caused him to gravitate towards ISIS at this time.

But radical Islam did play a role, though it seems like he was just hateful, and would latch on to whichever radical Islamic group was the flavor of the month.

It does not appear like he was a devout follower of Islam and became mislead toward a terrorist group.

 

Yeah...... growing up in a conservative Islamic household....... the comments about 911 that got him suspended from school...... the tips that he was supporting extreme Islamic causes....... the meetings with an imam in Orlando that advocated mercy killing homosexuals...... his now documented following of extremist Islam groups..... and him calling 911 during his rampage stating that he pledged allegiance to ISIS and was supportive of the Boston Bombers and other terrorist actions.

This clearly had nothing to do with Islam..... nothing to see here...... just like nothing to see with the Baylor situation.. right?

 

I don't know if you can ever rule out indoctrination when he specifically called out ISIS and is part of a Religion that have very negative view toward gay. At this point, it's ISIS and extreme religious interpretation. It might also include rejection and if that come to light, it still doesn't rule out the others. They are just all too interconnected. You could said something is more prevalent... but I don't think you can ever said it's not some kind of indoctrination.

 

Of course it is indoctrination.

He grew up in a very strict/religious household with a father than has openly supported the Taliban.

He was raised in a faith that strongly dislikes homosexuals.

He regularly attended Mosque and the imam at his Mosque called for the mercy killing of homosexuals.

He also followed extremists Islamic groups.

It was a powder keg ready to ignite, and it did.

How much of it was self hatred? How much of it was mental illness or being born slow? We will probably never know, BUT militant Islam gave him hero's to follow, an ideology and rationalization that it wasn't just "okay" but a good thing to kill 50 people and injury another 50.

 

um?

Strawman much?

They're not a crime, but they're pretty damn well proof that he's gay, something Bobby couldn't admit for no reason for quite a while.

Why are you injecting yourself into conversations I'm having with other people?

 

It's still not "proof" that he's gay, something you seem oddly obsessed about...

Also, it's not a strawman, it's pointing out that you are fixating on an irrelevant factor. If he used the app because he's secretly gay on top of being a radical Muslim terrorist then it's no different than if he used it as part of his attack planning. No different whatsoever.

 

You can't take somebody who says he is a member of Hezbollah and ISIS at face value. Jesus.

You can't say this was "Islamic extremism", point finale, after the dude frequented the same venue for three years! Was it Islamic extremism when he was cruising for men? At the same place he attacked.

Jesus. How the f**k did "he gets confused about who to pledge allegiance to at any given day" be warped to your ramblings about homosexuals? ATW, maybe you should read the convos you try to inject yourself into before you come up with vapid strawmen.

Way to reveal what you think. If sexuality didn't matter, you wouldn't be talking about mine as often as you do.

You're an uncomfortable old fogey about sexuality in a way that is quaint and a bit chuckle-inducing, but try not to confuse my words and mix them up with my identity when you clearly know very little about either.