What the hell did I just read? There is just too much here that I shouldn't even bother. Talk about a subjective take on what a superstar is. What about the NBA finals team where James Harden was the key facilitator in only his 3rd season in the league when he shot 49% with an EFG% of 58%? The fact that the three point shot is worth more points than the 2 point shot makes a case that eFG% is even more key in the modern NBA where James Harden is on par with the likes of Lebron James, and has a much higher eFG% than Russell Westbrook (is he NOT a Superstar?), and higher eFG% than Anthony Davis (guess he's not a superstar either). Even despite the fact that the ball is in Harden's hands more than any other player in the league he still has a top 10 PER which is insane. His PER is only slightly lower than Kawhi & Whiteside who play much less minutes, and don't facilitate the ball at a high enough rate to collect high rated turnovers. You want to keep going.... We probably should at stopped this argument at the point where you should have realized that James Harden himself went to the NBA finals and even as a 6th man still was the 3rd highest player in the team in usage. So that debunks your argument right there smack dab in the face. The definition of a "Superstar" is subjective in nature to start with. Obviously you don't want to touch stats as a guage to whether Harden is a superstar or not. Just wait till AElliott gets here to chime in on that one. Now you want to talk about how stars are only title teams draft and groom their superstars???... Really.... -Lebron James - Heat/Cavs -Shaq- LA Lakers/Heat -Drexler - Rockets -Pau - Lakers -KG & Allen - 08 Boston Celtics -Jason Kidd - 02/03 Nets Bosh- Heat etc. etc. Team's trade for and sign stars and make it to the finals all the time. I don't mean to offend, but this is a stupid stupid argument you are trying to have. There are alot of things to complain about with Morey, and there is a case to be made that maybe he shouldn't have went after Howard, but the Harden trade is a no-brainer, and 99% of people here still would have made the Howard signing.... hence the F-ing parade the city of Houston threw Dwight in 110 degree heat when he signed here.
Tell me, then,,,I'm in Houston and we could meet in a dark parking garage. Then I could start my own Source of a Source thread....thus protecting your identity. Do you still smoke those strong Newports.
I was talking FG% and you are just trying to use different number. Did Harden have FG% above 45% on his last season in thunders? yes. He was qualified for superstar that season. Did Harden have FG% above 45% this season? No. He is not qualified as superstar this season. Check out every single player this season, all true superstars has FG% above 45%, Curry, Durant, James, Westbrook, Leonard, Aldridge, Wade, Paul, etc. Not true superstars? Anthony, Wall, Love, Harden, Lillard, etc. Not all players with FG% above 45% are superstars, but all true superstars have FG% above 45%. Heat is built around Wade, Lakers was built around Bryant. Rockets was built around Dream Celtics was built around Pierce Nets was built around Martin. Every single team you listed is/was built around player of their own development in their seasons reaching NBA finals, which is exactly my point. I really have no idea what you want to argue about. I am tired of replying for this kind of arguments, again and again. so I will stop here in this thread.
Funny stuff, I guess that eliminates Kobe Bryant, Allen Iverson, Jason Kidd, Vince Carter, etc. etc. as superstars since their CAREER fg% is under 45%. Kobe Bryant... Role player. Nice. Also it's crazy to judge fg% alone and not mention Efg% in the current NBA. Or at least mention the 3 point shot, the free trips to the free throw line, assists, and turnovers... there is like... a larger story to be told than FG%. The volume of 3 point shots matters because at the end of the day it's about how many points you get in vs the amount of shots you take. Efg% tells a more holistic story along with other relevant stats. I'm telling a much more inclusive story and you are the one cherry picking. The NJ Nets were built around Kenyon Martin... the guy who was averaging 16PPG and only made one all star appearance in his career. Of course the team WASNT build around (9 time all star) Jason Kidd at all. The championship Heat teams were built around Wade and NOT the other guy on that team Lebron James....Hahah... Nice one bud. So the fact that the Rockets got Harden at 23 years old with 3 years of experience (and a finals appearance) means they got a WORSE player than if they had drafted him two years before at 21?? The logic here is outstandingly bad. So you're saying if a team drafts star players when they are younger and considerably worse rounded and experienced players rather than acquires them during their prime they are more likely to win with said player? Again, the entire city of Houston didn't throw a freaking parade in 110 degree heat for Dwight Howard because he was a bad player. And I guess the Rockets SHOULDN'T have traded Steve Francis for Tracy McGrady also since they drafted Francis but McGrady was already a veteran they hadn't groom themselves... recipe for disaster. If only we would have kept Francis. Lastly, I'll say this- Even if Morey did what you are proposing he should have done, and tanked to draft in the lottery, Yao Ming retired in 2011. Go look at the draft history between 2011 and now, and tell me how many top 10 players were readily available for Morey to draft if he was to tank??... Anthony Davis MIGHT BE a top 10 player. Karl Anthony Towns MIGHT BE a top 10 player in 5 years. James Harden is almost surely a top ten player NOW, and surely was a top 5 player last year by all accounts. Say what you want about what Morey or our future GM should do now going into the future... but over the past 10 years when it comes to superstars to build around there is almost no question at all that Morey wins this argument dude unless you can envision a scenario where Morey almost surely could have gotten Anthony Davis. The closest I have seen to this argument having any relevance (although its highly unlikely) was DD's theory years ago that there were trades out there for Yao that could have netting the Rockets the opportunity to draft Blake Griffin.
Thanks for making this thread so interesting. Yes, the Nets was built round Martin. Once Martin left, they were not a title contender any more. Yes, the Heat has been building around Wade. they won championships with or without the player named Lebron James. Rockets traded Francis for McGrady because they were trying to built around a player named Yao Ming. btw, Rockets was not in NBA final, not sure why you put it here. What I said is the fact and history data about the difference between this team and those NBA final teams. you can agree or disagree on that. I hope you can find an exception, so far you have not. If you insist this team is constructed the same way as those NBA final teams, please disregard what I said.
Thread should be closed. Les isn't taking Daryl to interviews just to up and say X coach wants full control you are out Daryl.
OP hasn't posted on this thread since his original post. Thread reminds me of one of those kind drew threads regarding Bledsoe.
Morey isnt who we think he is as a gm he is a former stock broker who thinks nba players are assets. His basketball knowledge is basically equal to our knowledge. I dont know if he was an NBA fan growing up and dont know if he watched basketbal for more than since he was a celtic front office member. I do think analytics work but to a degree. You have to use it to see if certain superstars mesh like dwight and James. You do have to find players under contract value that makes sense. But what morey doesnt see is chemistry and how to put harden in situations where he can play off ball at points. Harden needs either a defensive stud at PG or he needs a scoring only point guard. You have to think of Harden as the point guard. He dribbles the ball for 15 seconds then makes a desicion of where the ball will go. You need a coach that will mold James into a different player more off ball who can set a system in place when harden excells with out iso ball. That is the only way we will succeed in the future.
Joe Lacob owner of Warriors will tell you over and over that his venture capitalist approach infused top-to-bottom in the organization is what makes them so successful. Morey does have a lack of basketball sense about on-court chemistry. Though I wouldn't necessarily fault his finance background, when it's the same thing making record breaking history with the defending champions (I wouldn't fault Rockets going another direction either, but do we trust Les any more )
Lacob comes from the asset class that invests in people and teams. Murray comes from the asset class that invests in K-lines. Sound familiar?
