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Honest Question...

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by CaptainRox, Apr 7, 2016.

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  1. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    Except why would she not want to associate herself with his campaign if she thought that he could actually win or if she fully agreed with his campaign?
    Prove what? Warren has criticized Clinton but hasn't accused her of breaking the law. As infuriating as it might seem to those out there who don't like Clinton(s) no malfeasance has been proven.

    I agree. Clinton should've buried Sanders long ago. That is both a weakness on her part and also a credit to Sanders.
    The only reason why I even bother to say SCOREBOARD is because the Sanders camp keeps on trumpeting their momentum and both dismiss the earlier Clinton victories as being low turnout and that Sanders actually represents the will of the people.

    If anything the situation Sanders is facing might be worse than many of us say.
    http://fivethirtyeight.com/features...ther-behind-in-votes-than-he-is-in-delegates/

    I will admit some pettiness here but I do find it annoying this narrative that Sanders is really the winner and that everyone else (Clinton, DNC, Super Delegates, MSM, Rich People, Corporations, etc..) is to blame for that he is trailing rather than consider that he might not be a great candidate who has run a great campaign or that his ideas might not be as popular as Sanders supporters think.
     
  2. Northside Storm

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    ...Has anybody here actually read a Sanders policy paper, or an independent review of his tax plan?

    That's an honest question.
     
  3. sirbaihu

    sirbaihu Member

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    Hillary's appeal is that she is not Trump or Cruz. Congrats to the Republicans on offering two piles of steaming garbage to the American people.

    Hillary seems about as liberal as Daddy Bush to me. Not psyched about her.
     
  4. Bobbythegreat

    Bobbythegreat Member
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    And Cruz's appeal is that he's not Trump or Hillary.

    Congrats to the Democrats on offering a pile of steaming garbage to the American people.
     
  5. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Member

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    Maybe I'm idealistic not to resent the overt greasiness politicians have with Wall Street. Of course nothing illegal has occurred with these banking speeches. It was "fine" when Cheney was CEO of Haliburton before being VP and how they ended up being rewarded with no-bid contracts post Iraq War.

    It takes a degree of trust on her claim that she isn't being influenced by these quarter million dollar speeches. That claim made in spirit is also the basis for the majority opinion of Citizens United.

    Yeah, I don't like her. Not many Americans do, and she'll only win it because the Republicans are repellant.

    I don't believe that. What I will not be surprised is the US keeping its streak of presidents with a war in the Middle East. Hillary credits the Libyan intervention for her highlight as Sec of State. Would she jump into a Syria after a red line warning?

    Her past actions and present posture makes these legitimate questions.

    I don't think she'll directly tangle with Putin over Syria or Ukraine, but she'll definitely take steps of containment and use him as a prop for being "tough on defense".
     
  6. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    Well worth repeating. Perhaps some here will actually read it. Like you, B-Bob, it sums up damn near perfectly why I will vote for her in the general election, should she get the nomination. Heck, it doesn't even mention the best reason. That would be lifetime appointments to the Federal courts, including the most important, the Supreme Court. Those who turn away from the Democratic Party if their "guy" doesn't get the nod are simply damn fools, in my humble opinion. Is she perfect? Far from it, but she would do a good job as President, in my humble opinion, and I can live with her judicial appointments. She may even turn out to be a better President than President Obama. I certainly hope so.
     
  7. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    I have and I will give him credit for some detailed proposals. That doesn't mean his proposals have much of a chance of passing nor that everyone supports them.
     
  8. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    I think in that case there was more of a quid pro quo regarding that but to my knowledge there hasn't been a serious investigation into Cheney's ties to Halliburton. I may be wrong here but was Cheney ever called before a congressional committee regarding those? On the other hand Clinton has been investigated and called before the Hill many times with nothing proven and admissions that at least some of those were politically motivated.

    I won't rule out she isn't influenced by all that money but again until it is actually proven I will weigh that with other factors.

    Yeah, I don't like her. Not many Americans do, and she'll only win it because the Republicans are repellant.[/quote]

    Likeability I think is in overrated factor in deciding who should be President. GW Bush was certainly more likeable than Gore or Kerry and we can see what that got us. I don't want to sound like personality should be dismissed but the idea that we should vote for the candidate "who we would like to have beer with" is one of the worst reasons to decide who to vote for.

    Of course they are legitimate questions and Clinton is more hawkish than I am. On the other hand though Sanders appears to be very weak on foreign policy. As noted in the debate he has pointed out some problems but offered no real solutions. The most telling point on this was in their discussion over the Palestinians. Clinton was very pro-Israel, note Sanders said he was "100% behind Israel", but both said that there should be a two state solution. The big difference though is that Clinton actually negotiated a treaty between the Palestinians and Israel in 2012 while Sanders cited living on a kibutz 40 years ago.
     
  9. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Member

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    The point is that we're becoming tolerant to a culture where conflicts of interests are taken commonly as it passes the letter of legality but fails miserably on the spirit.

    More power to you.

    Btw, she's already cashed the quarter million dollar checks. How many were there?

    I don't know if you're addressing or attempting to sway me in particular, but I have said on here that she's the most qualified candidate among the final four. While others have governing experience or more seniority in congress, the breadth and depth of her career seems to all be meticulous grooming on her part for the presidency.

    Finding someone, such as Ted Cruz, repellant on the basis of their actions as a public official is much different than "I don't want to have a beer with that b*stard because he looks weird so he'd make a terrible president".

    She's made gaffes time after time to show her out of touch with issues such as LGBT, immigration, her sometimes elitist demeanor, and some other things I don't recall offhand. As a centrist, those could be all A-OK but I'd respect her much more if she came out and said she was centrist rather than try to curry the progressive vote and while surreptitiously dismissing its ideals as unpractical or impassable.

    I don't think Sanders would saddle the American people with another boots-on-ground engagement. Hell, I don't even know if he'd maintain or ramp up the predator drone video game with BHO initialed as the high score.

    The man is older, though. Heaven forbid he encounter some peaceful accident before his successor signs the executive orders.
     
    #149 Invisible Fan, Apr 18, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2016
  10. Northside Storm

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    Your theory is that a Republican Congress that has obstructed EVERYTHING from a Democrat president forced to become a moderate will somehow stand down for Hillary?

    You're better off replacing the Republican Congress. Lots of Senate races in the balance, the Rs will lose hard if Trump is top of the ballot. Hell, even the House might be in play.
     

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