This is a very depressing and personal subject for me, unfortunately I'm able to say ****-all about it publicly. The most I can do is help them when campaigns arise and just not participate myself.
OBL was influenced by Qutb before he ever went to Afghanistan. He discovered Qutb's writings while in college, and the Grand Mosque Seizure further developed his disdain for the Saudis. This is why the Saudis were puzzled that he wanted them to hire him and his anti-Saudi militants to defend Saudi Arabia from Iraq. To my knowledge the Saudis (certainly) nor the Wahhabi clerics tolerate Al-Qaeda or the Muslim Brotherhood. They may all be conservative Muslims but their views are very different. Muslim Brotherhood - Pan-Arab (Sunni) state built through political unity (similar to Nasr's Pan-Arab state) Wahhabi - strict literal interpretation of Islam with many madrasas located in and near former soviet territories Saudis - wealthy benefactors of alliance between Wahhabi clerics and the United States Qutbists - Pan-Arab (sunni) state built through the destruction of existing Islamic/Non-Islamic governments ISIS (The Islamic State) - the young upstart whose name and ambitions are the literal goal of many Al-Qaeda members and Qutbists; this may explain the rift between Al-Nusra/Al-Qaeda and ISIS
Right, all wahhabists were reading Qutb. But there was no Qutbism movement until OBL. To put it simply, Qutb wasn't a Qutbist just like Jesus was not a Christian, you know what I mean? Qutb was considered mandatory reading for political wahhabists. OBL's request to defend saudi from iraq was the final straw, the final test of whether the royalists were acting like American allies or actually ARE allies with americans. When they refused to let him defend the border, he would decide to break from mainstream wahhabists - i.e. following the saudi arabian appointed grand mufti - or start his own movement as a new ibn wahhab. That's why there was ACTUAL chatter going on among wahhabist saudis about whether OBL should be the new boss. Given America is objectively considered the #1 threat to the middle east by almost all middle easterners, there were even moderates considering whether they should latch on to his bandwagon since in both cases they're stuck with an extremist. Of course if we're going into detail, Afghanistan is actually not the first place OBL was deployed to and his willingness to work with the American government is classic wahabbism and qutbism - to learn about your enemy from the belly of the beast. To them, Russians and Americans were all the same at that point. If you can find me any difference in ideology - even in the most minuscule of ideas - between q's and wahhabists, I'll have learned something today and would be greatly fascinated. There is absolutely no difference as far as I have researched since forever, except that Qutbists refused to remain under the umbrella of wahhabists whom they viewed as greedy money hoarders who are no longer interested in Islam, rather they are interested in extending their political alliance with an authority which resorted to the "infidels" to protect them rather than OBL's squad. They both share one extremely central theme - an obsession with anti-idolatry. Never associate anything with perfection, don't glorify anything, don't change anything from how the prophet used to do it. The brotherhood is a whole other story which waaaaaaaaaaaaay predates this stuff. They are their own animal. ISIS is also different. Taliban are different too. Sauds are absolutely NOT the benefactor of an alliance between the US and wahhabists. Wahhabists are the benefactors of an alliance between the US and Sauds. It's the Saudis who secured the original deal and established the country, not the wahhabists. Why on earth would the US make a deal with a bunch of desert bedouins who have no claim to the oil? All the wahhabists had was savagery and could activate large numbers of similar people by offering them the sauds' money. The Sauds could have wiped out the wahhabists easily if they wanted. A dime a dozen. You have to understand that at that time, wahhabists had no significance in the world, they were literally a bunch of ass backwards desert dwellers looking for a big break. Literally like the westboro baptist church. The Sauds had no IDEA what they were getting themselves into long-term. That's why the Saudi government is trying hard to protect the borders of its country right now while wahhabist clerics are saying all sorts of **** that can cause problems in the country. If wahhabists had the original deal, they would be the ones trying to protect those borders. The sauds are actually doing their BEST to educate people like Exiled but this is what happen, the clerics get to these kids and discourage them from formal education indirectly.
I could be mistaken, but the Sauds have been Wahhabis way, way longer than they have been in alliance with the British or Americans. In fact, the Sauds have taken in (as refugees) radical sunni clerics from Syria (perhaps at the behest of Wahhabi clerics). Though I don't know a whole lot about what these clerics have been saying in regards to the Sauds, as I understand it, Obama's bluff (the red line agreement) has been a political stiff arm to the Saudis who have done their best to equip the opposition forces aligned with these radical clerics. That being said, I don't think a fatwa against chess is going to be the undoing of the Saudi royal family.
several yrs back i had the misfortune of flying 'royal' jordanian airlines. the flight got stalled for 20min at the gate before pulling back, and all of a sudden they bring in about 30 workers (they looked like construction workers brought in from all over asia). apparently some other flight had gotten cancelled so these passengers were then accomodated on my flight. after all the economy seats were filled up (it was a relatively small plane), they put the remaining in business and this filipina maid coming from kuwait ended up sitting next to me. spoke decent english, but was very quiet. twenty minutes up in the air and it got so hot in the cabin (like in every middle east aircraft for some reason!) that she had to remove her sweater (it was february). and then all these lash marks on her back/shoulders were exposed. a couple of them even looked quite fresh, like within the previous week. she saw that i noticed them, put her face down in her hands and just started crying.
That's really impressive.i didn't expect that at all One of them of those Syrian refugees cleric established the :sororiyah's way which is basically An armed approach resistance against an enemy. On the opposite side, there is Jamiya's school which is a peaceful resistance established by Nigerian's Refugee . During the 1st Gulf War ,when these opinions among leading clerics first debated and often clashed . The official government clerics justified the need and uses of foreign troop. Jamie's didn't not approve it but didn't attempt to challenge it and often thought political views is based what the king and his circle chose . Sorori didn't not approve it and actually challenge it ,they wanted to be involved with political decision making.which meant a movement that wanted to strip political power from Saud house and religious control from Traditional religious institution. Many of Qiyda ' members borrowed their analogy and ideological views on their own rebranded literatures , as a matter of facts many of their famous clerics changed their mind at later point of time , but they are still blamed for misleading followers . Former King Abdullah was responsible in reforming and introducing the entire 4 main sectors of main streams Sunni and moderate Ismaili and Zaidi to the body of official government religious institution to prevent future clashes among small circles .and to ensure more general diversity , Muslim World League became the main official sources and most respected place to issue Fatwas
As for Obama's bluffs ,and arming radical groups that where you got it wrong. Again : Saudi GovT position is to arm and support Free Syrian Army.but banned volunteers fighter of going to fight as much as possible by controlling funding, listing Nusra,ISIS and such in Terroir's list in which was the first country to take such action Sorori : want to arms all fighters , collect donations and manage operation independently Obama can only veto arming Syrian Free Army with anti-craft missiles(Stingers), based on purchase agreement ,but he clearly knows ,Saudi would do what it takes to support 90% of Syrians
Sad story except for many reason it's hard to believe .. ...there is no flight from Kuwait or Amman to Manila on jordan airlines. I flow many time for years to Malaysia ,Philippines so I know, I'm positive the airline isn't hiding this destination from their web site too. Does't make sense to go west then East for a flight connection. in Jordan ,A/C malfunction in Feb. means it get actually cold inside the airplane. Never heard of a greyhound bus used by airlines before for international flight.. & Middle Eastern airlines are't that bad..you know...Qatar,UAE ,Emirate, and even the worst one are among the best in business And I'm not sure you can afford business class And every temporary worker has access to his/her embassy/can complain to officials at the airport , you know you can make a lot of $$ if someone abuse you, though it's a desert, but it seems like there is a police station next to every dunkin donut even in Kuwait Anyhow...this thread is the weirdo's magnet
Some poorly made up $hit but you believed it robbi , that say more of your mental statues than how badly he influenced your judgment .many creative writers here by the way . Do the math : 20 minutes of a flight is close to 25000-30000 feet above see level , temperature is between -30-47 degree F. , when airplane a/c malfunction its get really cold. Temporary immigrant workers have the same views of Mexicans working in the US, do you want to find out what is it exactly, just drive with Texas plated car to the boarder and find out.
dear idiot, 1) the flight was amman-istanbul, and most of the construction workers were en-route to tripoli. i've never been to manila. 2) they seem to keep the cabins warmer than normal on purpose on middle eastern flights b/c that's probably what their passengers are more used to and dressed for. this has been the case for me on every qatar/emirates/turkish/etihad/gulf/unroyal jordanian flight taken. i never mentioned any malfunction 3) can't believe you actually have the balls to call anyone else in this forum a 'weirdo'. go shoot yourself.
Typical Exiled. Can't understand that what they taught him might not be the only true possibility. A/c malfunctioned? Must be cold air flying into the cabin. Someone critical of wahhabists? Must be shiite. What about Louijain? Is she shiite secret agent too Exiled? <iframe width="420" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/xD68v7ArfVU" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
You may have missed it but I made up a creative story too. The links I posted had creative stories as well. I like creative stories. So please tell me more how Saudi Arabia and the Arab world are actually the leaders for human rights and equality. I was amazed to see only 1 person was executed for witchcraft and sorcery in 2012 in Saudi Arabia. This is a 50% decline from 2011 where 2 people were executed for witchcraft! Amazing progress! I would love to hear more stories of progress like this!
I flew on Royal Jordanian Airlines back in the mid-'60's and it was crazy. We were going from Jordan to Egypt and couldn't fly over Israel (this was a couple of years before the '67 war), which made for a longer flight. It was an old prop job, loud and hot and a bit scary. The stews weren't remarkable, but I certainly believe pip's story about the Filipina maid.
