I enjoyed it. One big question: Spoiler Regarding this map of Luke's secret location... somebody's going to have to explain that a little better. Maybe it was because it was the very first thing in the movie, and my mind hadn't completely adjusted to paying attention to every single bit of dialogue yet... but do they ever explain why there is a secret map with Luke's secret location? I had just gotten done reading the yellow word title screen which basically says "Luke Skywalker is missing!"... but he's not really missing, he's hiding. And if he's hiding, would he really want there to be a map so somebody can find him? For something which was the main plot of the movie (first order wants the map, resistance is hiding the map, first order wants to eradicate all jedi and Skywalker is the last one), I'd appreciate if somebody who may have been paying more attention to these details could explain it better. Regarding the similarities between episode IV: Spoiler I actually didn't come away with that entirely. Sure, looking back there were some similarities... as there will be with any star wars movie... but as far as it being set up the same? Far from it. Maybe if Kylo fights an old guy at the end... and maybe if there's a huge medal ceremony at the end... other than that, it basically felt like they were introducing new characters, setting up places/situations for them all to come together, and taking it further to set up new story lines for future movies. The actual "force awakening" stuff has never been done in any other star wars movie... and I have a feeling this movie will be better appreciated after all of that stuff is revealed (Rey's background, her previous training, what all those visions were, etc.) Regarding Rey's background: Spoiler I'll look closer at this when I re-watch... but they never did anything to explicitly rule out her being the daughter of Han/Leia. Also, isn't it a little far-fetched/coincidental that #1. the Millennium Falcon happens to be "abandoned" on a planet that has this girl and the planet also happens to harbor the secret map of luke and #2. Han/Chewie happen to be in pretty close proximity to the ship/girl, this planet, and Han even mentions that "you think we're here by accident?". Also, Ren hints to Rey that "Is Han the father figure you always wanted?"... and the entire time, Han is never truly "annoyed" by her, despite several opportunities that would have annoyed him in the past (girl talks back, girl tells him what to do, girl tells him how to fix something...)... if anything, he's proud of her.
Nick you are spot on and I couldn't agree more with any of the posters in this thread. The only difference is that the Falcon didn't have the secret map....R2D2 did.
Spoiler I know the falcon didn't have it.... and R2 didn't really have it either (he just had part of it)... the old guy at the beginning had it and he happened to be on the same planet as the girl and the falcon (either a huge coincidence, or the falcon/girl being in the same place is no accident). On re-reading my post, I guess it could be confusing... I'll edit it. Again, more explanation needed regarding that map...
Spoiler I saw it more like Luke made the map for Rey to find him once the force awakened in her so he could begin training her. Maybe Han wasn't annoyed by her because he knows she's Lukes daughter and his niece? Leia also hugs her in the end and holds her tight and the way she looks at her as she walks away made me feel like there is something she knows that she or Han couldn't tell her because it wasn't their place. That, or Leia is force sensitive so she could have felt Luke in her and found out herself. In the end, she could end up just being one of the survivors of Lukes training that the Knights of Ren massacred. IF Luke disappeared after that massacre, and Rey was a youngling in training, it would mean there has been at least 7-10 years for Rey to grow up(assuming she's like 15 to 18 now and in the memory where she was left on Jakku she was around 5 -8 years old) and Luke to go in hiding waiting for her to find his map with their force connection.
Spoiler Didn't Max Von Sydow's character in the beginning tell Poe that he was an old friend or something when Poe was asking how he got the map? Maybe he's part of the rebels that pioted with Luke. So maybe he's someone Luke trusted with the map.
But wasn't that rule of 2 really popularized by the prequels themselves? ("always 2 there are..."-yoda). Also, as much as people try to distance these movies from the prequels... I find it annoying that several long-ish posts here base their entire views/premises on the prequels themselves. Posts comparing current jedi to Mace Windu? Posts talking about miticholrians? Posts talking about young Anakin and his early characteristics (which were specifically written by Lucas)? Its like the prequels are the Ed Wade of Star Wars... completely awful, yet some still inadvertantly credit a lot of their star wars background/knowledge to what they got from those movies (and all the material that came out around that time). I'd honestly be happier if they were never made... and if these movies are a huge success, I would have zero problem with somebody re-imaging a better prequel story... and remaking those movies (which would render the current prequels as non-cannon).
Spoiler I think it just makes sense IMO. Luke and R2 are always together and close so before Luke went into hiding, he gave majority of the map to R2 and instructed him to power down until he contacts him when he's ready. He then gave the missing smaller part of the map to a trusted old friend when the time was right and Rey is reaching of age. When Luke feels Rey's force awakening just as Snoke did, Luke contacts R2 to power back on and give them the map because it's time for Rey to find him and begin their real training.
Spoiler So, do we know for sure that Luke made the map? Or did somebody track him there? If Luke trusted the old man with the map, why is he so quick to give it up to Poe who will certainly give it to Leia... wouldn't Luke just trust Leia with it? As it is, it seems the old man is the one who sought out Leia/Resistance to get them the map long before any evidence of the girl being awakened or even being introduced happened. Again, I just don't recall the movie explaining any of that well, so was looking for something concrete and certain. Spoiler Or maybe she's really their kid (Han/Leia)... and they were forced to exile her because of fear that she would end up like Kylo. That also explains all your other observations. I'm guessing her character is supposed to be around 18-20 years old... with Rey being ~ 10 years older.... and in her flashback, she was about 6-7 years old when it looked like she was being left on Jakku, which would all make sense from a timeline standpoint.
I largely agree with this to an extent. The prequels did far too much to de-mystify the force and it's various elements. It was one of the biggest problems. Rey's actions in the new movies wouldn't have bothered anybody if this was actually the 4th Star Wars movie and the prequels didn't train us to think Jedi had to be trained basically from the cradle to live as soulless unattached monks. Having said that, it doesn't mean I wouldn't like more information on the Jedi and Sith, and how exactly somebody good could suddenly become evil. I thought the prequels did a good job in that respect, but they could have done it without Qui-Gon, or 8 year old Anakin being "too old", and most definitely without medichlorians. Obi-Wan comes across teenage Anakin and senses something in him, you go from there.
Carrie Fisher could not move her face the whole movie. Botox prevents her from ever having expressions. I wouldn't read anything into it.
Exactly Agreed... or if the jedi were so all-knowing, why did they all still end up allowing Anakin to eventually be trained, despite initial reluctance? I hate the prequels more than ever... I wish I could unlearn what I have learned. Would have been a much better story if he was just simply a boy who had potential/anger issues... and they just couldn't control him. None of this prophecy stuff that doesn't end up meaning much at the end of the day. Agreed
My take on Kylo Ren couldn't be more different. I found him blah and uninteresting. He came off like a petulant child and not that menacing or evil. That's why I termed him the "Diet Coke of the Dark Side". It was if JJ needed to have a designated Sith character wearing black Vader-like outfits and performing Vader's dark side of the force tricks. He reminded me more of Boda Fett than Darth Vader. From the setups in the first movie, it's also obvious who will end up killing him (in the big Episode IX finale of course). The Raid guys were plot filler - kinda like the Ewoks in Episode VI. They were there to setup Han Solo's backstory on what he'd been doing for the past 20+ years.
Not obvious to me. I could see Rey doing the deed or maybe he sacrifices himself and is killed by Supreme Leader Snoke. Maybe Leia. Maybe Finn wants to kill him but Rey doesn't because she finds out hes her brother so FInn does the deed.
Think about it: Rey would be the obvious answer because it's obvious that Luke will be training her in the ways of the Force but JJ wants you to think this. Finn strikes me as more of a Lando Calrissian character - one who plays a prominant but ancillary role in the series so he's not the one. I'm expecting Luke to get Obi Wan'd in Episode VIII so he's out. That would leave one other character who'd REALLY have a reason to want revenge on Kylo Ren: Spoiler https://tribzap2it.files.wordpress.com/2013/02/star-wars-episode-7-peter-mayhew-chewbacca.jpg
EU = Star Wars Expanded Universe (books, comics, cartoon shows, etc.) "canon" = what officially is considered relevant or in the same universe as the movies. So far, none of the expanded universe is considered to be canon to the movies.
Yep... and at this point, I'd be leery about anything in the prequels as being total canon as well. Basically, the best way to watch these movies is simply with what was presented in IV,V, VI. If you're using any info or background away from that to judge these movies, you may not enjoy them very much.
