Different year, same story. We've all seen Jones beast at times during the regular season. Hell he might even do it for extended times stretching over several games. Then he either gets hurt or has a mental lapse and loses all confidence and goes back to being a scrub. Moreover, when the playoffs come he is absolutely a black hole both offensively and defensively. I still have nightmares of LMA taking him to the back of the woodshed. Last year he had zero to no impact in all 3 series. Every role player has at least 1 game where they step up and make their mark on a game. Josh Smith made his presence felt in a major way, Aminu earned a nice contract from the series, there was a freaking "Austin Rivers game". I remember ariza, brewer, terry etc all making key plays. Even Prigioni made key contributions. With Jones he couldn't exploit a favorable matchup against the Mavs, he got schooled by Blake as expected defensively and offered nothing in return offensively. Against the Warriors when we really needed him and he had a chance to step up and really make a mark in another favorable matchup he was a no show again. If it weren't for Smith and or if we had to have played Jones more the Mavs would've extended the series. If we kept Jones in the starting lineup against the Clips we would've gotten swept. Was it a coincidence that when we subbed Jones out for Smith starting in game 3 that we finally showed life and were able to come back??? Didn't think so.
I would consider trading DMo and keeping Terrence if we were able to trade DMo for DeMarcus or a similar caliber player. So there are a few scenarios where I'd trade DMO and keep Terrence or trade both. LOL at Terrence creating his own shot. I said last year and the year before Terrence has about two of these plays a year where he goes coast to coast through traffic and finishes. That doesn't mean he can effectively create his own shot. If he could, he would. Unfairly extrapolate his defense from two years ago on LaMarcus, eh? How much do you have to see? Terrence has consistently underperformed and looked terrible against all the playoff bigs we have gone up against. He always flashes a good game against a rookie (Kaminsky) or somebody like Big Baby and his fans come out of the woodwork extrapolating potential out of those rare performances when he has a favorable matchup. No they're not at this stage of their careers. DMo's the conceded better player by the GM's around the league.
No you trade Jones 100% because A) Jones gets all the time weird injuries. It's gotten to the point that it's simply as weird as it sounds not a mere coincidence. There are other players in the league like him that if there is an injury to be had, they get it. Kyrie, Ilyasova, Rubio , Rose etc. Some players are simply injury prone. B) VERSATILITY. I don't think I have to explain in detail how the modern game has put an emphasis on versatility. The more postiitons you can play AND guard the more valuable you are. You can play small ball without giving to your opponent an advatage and C) Potential price tag. A young player like Jones who shows 1 game in 5-7 flashes and high scoring with good athleticism are the worst kind of trap to lure other desperate teams to offer contracts that the player will never live up to. Do you want to have the Pistons offer Jones a 17 million contract and you have to match? At least with DMO you know that you will be playing for a COMBO big that can get lots of minutes in 2 positions and his game will hold up because it's not based on athleticism. Don't judge DMO's perfomance just yet. He is too in a contract year, he too will make anything possible to play well and get his $. But he needs more time, which he will get, to completely recover from his back.
Jones continues to make mistakes all of the time on defense, it just never changes. When he has games like last night and shows off his offensive capabilities you think of the potential, but there is no way he can play well enough of offense to offset his defensive lapses. He ranks 92 out of 95 PF's in DRPM. D-Mo, who is just now rounding into shape, is 1.4 points better than him without playing even close to his best. He never covers fast enough on a beaten man (which compounds our lazy SG) he doesn't make proper rotations. When he helps, he helps incorrectly and leaves an easy passing lane. He also tends to get bullied in the post, but this day in age that's actually one of his smaller issues. I keep waiting for him to start learning these things, but he just doesn't seem to have the capability of grasping the concepts. Tim Duncan doesn't continue to be elite defensively because of athleticism, he does it by always knowing where he needs to be.
Hope you don't care if I play devils advocate here (and yes Jones is the devil around here it seems). I personally could care less if we trade Jones, or whatever. I have no skin in the game, but I feel like he's unfairly chastised by the fans here, and we as fans of a team need to do a better job than to buy into junior high gossip bully mob mentality. I also think we are stuck back in 2012 asset collection mode which is currently the wrong mentality to have... maybe that changes if the team sucks it up again but I'll expand on that later. Anyways... Let's be fair to Jones. Before this season, he's PLAYED in the league two years only (first year D-League bound). Those two seasons he had one with great health playing 76 games, and the second one with some freak injuries. The only one that scares me is the nerve issue because its possible that it comes back at some point, and is career threatening. But other than that... collapsed lung, eyelid cut, etc. If you let that scare you into trading for him, or whatever I'd say that's paranoia. There is plenty of evidence to suggest he will be fine. TBH, every time the Rockets go small with Jones at the 5, I cringe, but for some reason the Rockets always do well with that lineup. But guess what lineup the Rockets have this year with the highest plus/minus? Jones at the 5 with Harden, Terry, Ariza, Brewer has a +12.5. I don't think that's necessarily vindictive of how great Jones is, but it does show the power of small ball when you have a big like Jones you can go small with. He's no Draymond Green, but I think teams will look at him and think there is a poor poor poor man's version of Green, and the data sort of backs it up even in a small sample size. You look at the stats and what you see jump off the charts is the Rockets 3 point shooting, and assist to turnover ratio. There is something to that and speaking against Jones' versatility.... I don't understand the logic. Let's all not forget about the Clipper's series where the Jones small ball lineup pretty much saved the series in I think it was gave 4 or 5. Have to look up the stats on that series again for the 200th time. If I was a GM consultant (definitely not) I would say he's definitely a player to avoid giving a huge contract to if you are expecting him to take a bigger role in the offense, and give you a consistent performance. But what does that have to do with the Rockets? People's logic around here is that the Rockets should trade him because he won't be a great player next year for whatever team he's on when he gets paid a huge contract. What does that have to do with his value to the Rockets? The Rockets, AS LONG AS THEY ARE STILL PLANNING ON MAKING A PLAYOFF RUN, can still use him currently to help win games to get in the playoffs, or get a higher seed. Why are they trading him? Well a few reasons would be the case- A. They are punting on the season because of poor performance B. Jones has been buried on the bench by better play from others (I though Harrell was supposed to ALREADY be a better player back in August BBHollic?) Getting an asset back from a player who might or might not leave in free agency is only the case if you are building a team for the future and not competing currently. The Rockets GAVE UP four 2nd round picks last winter for two players on expiring contracts that could help a playoff run. As long as Jones is helping for the playoff run (if he's helping you win games in the regular season he's helping the cause) then he's worth keeping instead of trying to get a future asset... even if you know you are likely losing him in the offseason.
This is all very true. Even last night, Terrence was out of position multiple times to go along with simply standing around as the play went by him. If you offset that defense with the points he gave us, it's pretty much a wash. Rockets have Harrell burning down the d-league. Harrell could very easily replace Terrence with no dips in team performance and possibly a rise in team performance. Although not a good defender himself, Harrell gives you way more hustle and court awareness on the defensive end than Terrence does. So, while I'm happy Terrence looked good on the surface last night, I'm ready for the trade that moves him out and moves Harrell into his spot. And hopefully the trades we make will be for at least one quality big that pushes Capela down in the rotation to 4th big and Harrell to 5th big behind our Dwight/DMo and our newly acquired big man that can defend the rim, paint, and rebound.
First of all I have to admit I find it funny that you choose to play devil's advocate choosing my posts since according to some here I am a Jones fangirl ...(because apparently whoever doesn't make Jones the scapegoat for everything under the sun, is his greatest fan) A) Hmm yeah as I said i know it's sounds weird but I have noticed it with multiple players that always get freak injuries. On their own isolated there is nothing one can say, but when a player always get freak injuries in the end it shows a pattern. Is there a concussion to be had? Ilyasova will get it. is there a broken nose to be had? Ilyasova will get it Is there a bumping knees in practice to be had? Ilyasova will get it. Is there a extremely rare flesh eating virus out of Congo? Ilyasova will get it. Same with Jones in my opinion. The guy just has the black cat. Whatever weird and freak will happen to him. Maybe for you it is not a factor, but my judgement it is. I see this happen to players and there is no other explanation except they are extremely injury prone to get multiple freak injuries. Him being young and not having a big history of injuries only because he hasn't been an nba player for long doesnt' mean much, since for his experience he already has missed too many games compared to other 4 year players. b) what is the minutes sample to this lineup? And what exactly is the contribution of Jones himself in this lineup? Considering that DMO wasn't available and Capela is the definition of a foul machine. If a guy is in a good lineup but is respnsobile for the other team scoring and it's only because you can sneak in multiple shooters who are the ones responsible for the scoring and the +12.5 then ..? for sure this lineup can be even better by taking out Jones and put in someone who can defend his position. c)WOW...I thought that by now you didn't honestly think that we are title contenders...If you still think that I don't know what to tell you honestly. If it's just to lose in first or second round then why let an asset leave for nothing? An asset we can use to get rid of the leech that is Brew's contract? As for you being a GM consultant I have no doubt that you would be better in your decisions than a lot of actual gms. Unfortunately you aren't and so there are multiple idiot men in charge of franchises right now.
just glad his value is increasing.. I don't trust this couple of games run he has had... we know how this ends
LOL. I reply to you because you use common sense and don't automatically vilify anyone that doesn't completely agree with everything you preach. That's a complement. And I wasn't' necessarily playing devils advocate against you.. just the narrative that is constantly spewed about Jones. A. Haha... yeah Jones had some bad luck, but it seems like it was confined to one season. So I don't know if its going to affect the way teams look at him as a whole. But the nerve issue... hell yeah. I bet teams look at that hard before giving him a contract. Could be something neurologically going on there that could creep back up, and bam. Unfortunately I've got way too familiar with weird neuro diseases in my fam so when I heard about that happening I probably took it more serious than others. Legs going limp randomly... not a good sign. B. I'll check BBall reference later, but when I was looking before, it wasn't high, but none of the Rockets lineups have had that much time together as a whole this season. Its been a weird lineup shuffle it seems. So it bears watching, but last night it worked to close out the game, and in the Clippers series it about the only thing that saved the series.... mostly because Jones was the only big who could hit free throws... To your point, I think D-Mo is probably a more effective version of Jones in this lineup so we will probably see him at the 5 more and more in smaller lineups. We need to check back in with the D-Mo small ball lineups in a couple weeks for sure. Should be better at it than Jones since the theme that is tying in success seems to be assist to turnover ratio and spacing for a better shooting percentage. C.) Title contenders??... Well let's take that out of the vocabulary for a second. Are the Rockets at a place where they would still sacrifice assets to win now... I'd have to say that we are teetering on that right now. If the Rockets are showing the ability to make a 2nd half run, and are going to be a playoff team, I'd have to think that Morey will still make moves to setup success for the playoffs. Is he going "all in".... probably not anymore. But that still doesn't mean he's not willing to sacrifice SOME assets for success THIS YEAR going into the postseason. So teetering on it.... what would I do.... I'd trade Jones IF the offer was good enough. Like 1st rounder good enough... and I need to see more out of Harrell. I've seen flashes but not enough to put my trust that he can provide quality rotation minutes without fouling out in 5 minutes. I'm not trading Jones in a salary dump move, or for something silly like a second rounder. He's worth more to this team even just as a regular season depth rental than that. And I'm sure as hell not trading him or anyone to get Markieff Morris. IMO the Suns need to be PAYING the Rockets, not the Rockets gifting assets to them (despite the size of asset folks think Jones is, he's still an asset). But I know we differ in opinion on Morris so we can leave that one be.
Neither has shown enough consistency for me (More than 82 games) but I guess rebounding and shotblocking are good traits for a "big man" Dmo has better understanding of a team game because he is a Euro who played professional ball early on in a good league overseas (good passing game, but nothing stands out so far) good positional game in Defense and Offense but not spectacular. TJones probably won't be very good but he can be a specialist for rebounding and shotblocking if he can consistently work on these things. He is a better player in those areas that are still important for a bigger guy. Because we just do not know how much longer Dwight is going to play on a very good level or is he leaving soon?
Whether the team will improve or not isn't really the main concern here for the decision makers (I.e. Not fans). It is financial. One or both of them is gone. I beleive that Jones is the odd man out.
You need to show proof with a comment like this. You just can't throw cap out there and hope it sticks.
Jones is the odd man out. I just don't know if it makes sense to trade him. We still want to try and win games THIS year. Keepin Jones on the roster and then letting him walk next summer may be better than trading him during the season for another player that doesn't help us. It just seems people are in a hurry to trade Jones just to get ride of him , even while he does help the team win games at times. I'm just saying don't trade the man just to trade him.
Some interesting names near the bottom of that list: (83) Markeiff Morris (88) Montrezl (89) Zach Randolph (93) Nerlens Noel (95) Julius Randle I would have said yes to giving minutes to all of these guys, lol.
