Is James Harden already top 3 Players in franchise history?

To answer the question, answer this question....

Which Rockets players have finished as high as 2nd in MVP voting?

 

Moses won twice, Hakeem won once.

 

Agree. Harden has a lot of time to move up the ladder.

 

In terms of basketball skill as a Rocket player he is already top 3 IMO. In terms of Rocket lore he is down the list. I looked at the question as if I could draft any Rocket player from anytime what order would I select them. And I could see taking Harden in top 3.


#1 Dream- 2 Rings, MVP, the leader. 17 seasons averaged 22/11 almost 2 steals and more than 3 blocks Most games played as a Rocket with 1177.

#2 Moses 6 season as a Rocket, 1 MVP as Rocket, 24/15 w 1.6 blocks, 5 time all-star as a Rocket, 1 Finals appearance

#3 Harden in 3 seasons 3 time-All-Star 26/5/6 w almost 2 steals. 1 WCF appearance. He is the #1 player on the team now. He is already the better player as a Rocket than Drexler was but as for lore Drexler would be ahead.

The rest of my top 10, these are ranked under Rocket lore not how good the players skills were.

#4 Rudy-T 11 season all as a Rocket. 5 time all-star Averaged 17 points and 8 rebounds. If you add his coaching he is probably the most important Rocket of all-time because he helped get Hakeem stay and win the rings. Rudy made 1 finals appearance as a player. Great Rocket but never the #1 guy on the team. 3rd in games played with 768. 4th in all-time Rocket in rebounds.

#5 Clyde gave you 3 and a half-seasons at 19/6/5 plus the second ring. He was the #2 guy on a team full of players playing their role. We should have drafted him! Damn, Damn, Damn!

#6 Yao 8 seasons all as all-star (only 5 games in his last season) 19/9 w 2 blocks. Yao is tough call, when in his prime he got shutdown, we got a glimpse of his full peak. His skills where very unique for a center with huge size. I think really he was the better talent compared to Rudy but Rudy has always been my favorite. Even though he is 10th in games played as a Rocket, Yao left us wanting more.

#7 Hayes I missed his 1st stint with the Rockets as much of it was in San Diego and I didn't start following basketball till late 70's. I really only saw his last seasons as a Rocket he was barely an average player by then but his early years as a San Diego Rocket show he filled the stat sheet 28/17 in SD for 3 years! Average 20/12 as a Rocket in a total of 7 seasons. Those 1st 4 all-star seasons as a Rocket are statically some of the greatest numbers by a Rocket of all-time. Those early years are hard to judge because the game is so different and I never saw him.

#8 Murphy was 1 time all star but a great long time Rocket all 13 season with Rockets. Averaged 18 points w 4 assists. Second in games played as a Rocket behind Dream with 1002. Very good player for a very long time.

#9 O-Thorpe The Forgotten Man. 7 seasons with the Rockets. 9th all-time in games played 518 games as a Rocket. Averaged 16/10 and 2.5 assists along side the Dream! On the 1st Rockets Championship. 5th all-time in rebounds.

#10 T-Mac 6 seasons as a Rocket, 3 All-Stars, 22/5/5. Dynamic but injuries derailed him from an real success.

 

No doubt

 

He could be in top 5 if he shaves.

 

Hakeem, Moses, Harden

Champion, Finals, Western Conf Finals

Nobody else has done better in the playoffs....looking at you Hays, McGrady, Yao

 

He's not more skilled/talented than tmac but hes alreary more successful.

 

Adams + Lamb > Jim Harden

Thinking of what could have been...

 

Harden no longer defies gravity, gravity has given up.

James Harden doesn't always play defense, but when he did Hurricane Joaquin changed course.

Harden doesn't always score 40, but when he does Stephen Curry is getting owned.

 

He's way more talented and skilled hence the moves, you could argue on the physically gifted but the extra width has its physical benefits too. Mentally, no comparison, T-mac was a midget.

 

1. Dream
2. Big Mo
3. The Big E
4. Lucas
5. Clyde
6. McGrady
7. Francis
8. Yao Ming
9. Calvin
10. Ralph

Harden is an awesome offensive player, just doesn't bring the same intensity to the defensive side of the ball.

 

Clyde Drexler

 

INB4 tinman drops the truth

 

This. Hayes was so so good. However, things still have time to change and James can climb that ladder. He can be better than Hakeem, he's got that kind of talent, drive, and leadership. Here's to that happening.

Why you gotta round down? If you round up he's 23/6/6 and it sounds so much better.

 

Good to see the koolaid of Rockets past player still flows strongly here.. Harden is easily #3 if not #2. It's kind of hard to believe at the moment, but he could even be #1 before all is said and done, although I don't think that's likely.

 

Hakeem, Moses, and Hayes are above him.

 

Hayes spent his best years with the Bullets. He's more their player than ours: that's when he won his chip and all his 1st team NBA selections.

And let's be real Harden is on pace for a HOF career, so they're only putting one HOF player in front of another HOF player.

Moses is tier 1 - the man won 2 MVPs here. I see it like this:

Tier 1
Hakeem
Moses

Tier 2
Harden (pushing into tier one with more achievements),
Hayes (didn't spend his golden yrs with the rox),
Rudy T... (biased due to his coaching career - rox lifer)

Tier 3
Murphy due to longevity, leadership and performance, but more of a "legend" than top player in franchise history.
Yao
McGrady
Clyde (even though he was instrumental in winning the chip - he had his best years elsewhere)

 

Why you gotta round down? If you round up he's 23/6/6 and it sounds so much better.[/QUOTE]

Didn't have to, just in a hurry... It was a long post, but fair point.

I can see I'll be the only one mentioning OT. So over looked even by the community. He was night in night out with those points and rebound when Dream was in his Prime. The rest of the team you never knew what you would get.

I see Lucas made someone's list. He only played 325 games as a Rocket, 17 play-off games. Otis Thorpe played 46 play-off games and won a ring, COME ON MAN. Lucas may have cost us a ring with his poor choices as a Rocket. FTR I love the redemption of JLII

 

2 mvps as a rocket, 79 and 82