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The Pope's Address to Congress

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by rocketsjudoka, Sep 24, 2015.

  1. CometsWin

    CometsWin Breaker Breaker One Nine

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    The Vice President and the Speaker of the House sitting right behind the Pope are both Catholic! That looks pretty preferential to me. We're not going to have a Hindu speaker or a Muslim speaker any time soon, I can guarantee you that. We're endorsing Christianity by default.

    I think a lot of the Pope's messages are great but this crosses a line we shouldn't be crossing.
     
  2. Cohete Rojo

    Cohete Rojo Member

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    It's a shame that he is only visiting the NE United States. He is going to get the wrong impression of this country.
     
  3. Cohete Rojo

    Cohete Rojo Member

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    Why don't you tell us more about your Catholic conspiracies.
     
  4. justtxyank

    justtxyank Member

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    We've had Muslim political leaders address Congress.

    There is not a "pope" of the Muslim world that CAN address Congress.

    If it makes you feel better, the Pope is the head of state of an independent state recognized by the United States.
     
  5. JuanValdez

    JuanValdez Member

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    The business about Netanyahu addressing Congress got ugly and petty. But, in general I think we should have a lot more of foreign leaders, and other sorts of important people addressing Congress. What is so sanctified about the floors of the House and Senate that we have to make sure only the right people stand on it? I'd set the bar pretty low. If it's useful to have a guest come speak, have them speak. Even Netanyahu so long as we can avoid using guest appearances as some sort of foreign-policy-by-proxy.
     
  6. justtxyank

    justtxyank Member

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    If the President of Afghanistan can address the Congress I think the Prime Minister of Israel and the Pope of the Holy See are fine.

    It's just a speech.
     
  7. Commodore

    Commodore Member

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    difference between a Polish and South American Pope; the former fought to defeat communism, the latter is a communist sympathizer
     
  8. FranchiseBlade

    Supporting Member

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    what in his speech today shows he's a communist sympathizer?
     
  9. Amiga

    Amiga Member

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    And they can't be any more different in their politics and views.

    How often does the Pope address the US Congress?

    How often does the Pope visits the White House?

    Based on frequency, I don't think it send any NEW message of religious preference by the US government.
     
  10. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    True it starts from religious authority but the end result is still very wide political influence that does go beyond the Church itself. Just because he is a religious figure doesn't diminish that he is a world leader that Congress might be interested in hearing about.
     
  11. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    A piece from The Atlantic about how Pope Francis fits, and doesn't fit, American politics.

    http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/09/why-pope-francis-sounds-like-a-democrat/407023/
    Why Pope Francis Sounds Like a Democrat

    The popular perception of a “liberal pontiff” has a basis in fact.

    As Pope Francis visits the U.S. this week, religion experts have been driven to distraction by the drumbeat of “liberal pope” articles.

    “The next person who tells me Pope Francis is a Democrat—I’m going to punch them,” Christopher Hale of Catholics in Alliance for the Common Good told my colleague Emma Green, in an article—one of many making a similar case—headlined, “Pope Francis Is Not ‘Progressive’—He’s a Priest.”

    But this is an absurd distinction. There are plenty of progressive priests, just as there are plenty of conservative ones. Priests can and do have ideologies, just as politicians have religious convictions. (And unlike a rank-and-file priest, Francis is a head of state who conducts foreign policy.) And there are, in fact, reasons why Francis strikes political observers as having a lot in common with American Democrats.
    eligion writers never tire of reminding us that, as revolutionary as Francis may appear, he actually believes the same things as previous popes. Like his predecessors, Francis is a social conservative who opposes abortion and same-sex marriage. And like Francis, previous popes opposed war and called for helping the poor. If this pontiff seems different, these writers insist, it’s because media outlets have amplified certain stances while downplaying others, or because he has shifted the Church’s emphasis without changing its doctrine.

    But what makes Francis different is really a matter of which Catholic beliefs he has elevated to the level of communal concerns—public policy—and which he has framed as individual choices. To Francis, sharing wealth and fixing global warming are matters that governments should address, while not committing homosexual acts or having abortions are individual choices he endorses. (As he famously put it: “Who am I to judge?”) This is quite different from the American Catholic church, which has poured its political energy into laws banning gay marriage and restricting abortion. (The church, often through the Knights of Columbus, was one of the largest funders of anti-gay-marriage ballot initiatives, particularly post-2008, when the Mormons largely stopped funding them.)

    The pope’s speech at the White House on Wednesday fit this framework. When it came to religious liberty, a hot-button issue for American conservatives, Francis extolled its virtues in the abstract. But in the case of climate, Francis called for government action: “Mr. President, I find it encouraging that you are proposing an initiative for reducing air pollution,” he said.

    Francis is not an American politician, but his perspective on the state’s role in these issues lines up pretty well with that of most American Democrats. To greatly oversimplify, Democrats believe the U.S. needs to regulate the economy and the environment, while allowing people to make their own choices about whom they marry and whether to have an abortion. Republicans—again, oversimplifying greatly—think people should generally be able to do what they want with their money and their carbon footprint, but social behavior should be regulated by the state. Francis aligns more with Democrats than Republicans on other issues: He favors immigration reform, played a major role in the Obama administration’s détente with Cuba, and supports the Iran nuclear deal. No wonder the president and other American liberals are trying to claim him—and conservatives see him as a threat.

    Through his activism, Francis has significantly raised the Church’s profile on issues with which it wasn’t previously associated in American politics—issues chiefly championed by Democrats. But Francis’s major impact within the Vatican, as Emma noted, has been as a reformer, reorganizing the Vatican bureaucracy and cleaning up its scandal-ridden finances. It’s in this regard that Francis most resembles Obama, who campaigned in 2007 on a promise to heal America’s divisions and disrupt the entrenched and corrupt political system.

    Francis, unlike Obama, actually did it: He’s cleverly leveraged his massive popularity to overcome systemic inertia and entrenched opposition, marginalizing his critics and bringing about sweeping changes many insiders had believed to be impossible.(Then again, when the Pope convenes his Synod of Bishops in October, he may, like Obama, discover the challenge of pushing his favored reforms through a factious legislature.) In many ways, Francis is the politician Barack Obama tried and failed to be.

    So yes, Francis is a priest. He’s also a progressive, a politician—and an uncommonly good one at that.
     
  12. Rashmon

    Rashmon Member

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    Man, you have gone off the deep end.
     
  13. bnb

    bnb Member

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  14. durvasa

    durvasa Member

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    Why do you think that is?
     
  15. ROXTXIA

    ROXTXIA Member

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    Just knew one of ya'll would show up here with such a post. Guess big_texxx is on vacation.

    Yep, this Pope believes in the sanctity of life and, like Jesus Christ himself (go figure), espouses lifting up the needy and not chasing after riches.

    Slippery little Communist f***. :rolleyes:

    It was funny watching the Republican Congressmen and military uniforms sitting there on their hands and stewing in their juices during some of the Pope's more "liberal" moments.

    Also kind of funny watching all those old white guys straining to understand Pope Frank's accented English. Reminded me of my grandmother when my Brazilian-born wife was first learning the language. After one of the Pope's remarks, John "What Did He Say?" Kerry leaned over to get the message repeated directly into his ear from the guy sitting next to him: "HE SAID WE SHOULD ABOLISH THE DEATH PENALTY!" And Kerry's, "Oh, hmn, that's interesting!" expression.
     
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  16. Jugdish

    Jugdish Member

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    "THE BLESSING!"

    [​IMG]
     
  17. Commodore

    Commodore Member

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    <blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">THIS WEEK GETS BETTER AND BETTER <a href="https://t.co/pOg1YRzDsJ">https://t.co/pOg1YRzDsJ</a></p>&mdash; Adam Khan (@Khanoisseur) <a href="https://twitter.com/Khanoisseur/status/647123071996964864">September 24, 2015</a></blockquote>
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  18. REEKO_HTOWN

    REEKO_HTOWN I'm Rich Biiiiaaatch!

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    Just like your do nothing congress you would like a do nothing polish pope.
     
  19. sammy

    sammy Member

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    I watched a bit of it now. Just the first 10 mins.

    Pretty sermon-y to begin his speech.
     
  20. mc mark

    mc mark Member

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    WOW you really are a sad, little man.

    Full disclosure and speaking from an agnostic position, this is the most christian pope I think I've seen in my lifetime. I like this Francis.
     
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