Here's an interesting stat...

A-Train · 10-31-2002, 09:23 AM

Moochie played 36 minutes last night...

36?

That sound to me like Steve WAS playing the off guard most of the night, and Moochie STILL only had two assists...Now, WHO did a poor job of distributing the ball last night?

Oh well, I can't say that I'm totally AGAINST Steve bashing today, because the truth is that we won't win with Steve shooting 28 times per night. To BLAME this loss on him, though, is pretty shallow when the starting center and starting power forward shoot a combined 3-19. Personally, I blame his new haircut...

Positives from last night:

Griffin only had ONE three point attempt!
17 rebounds from Cato? Where did that come from?

ricerocket · 10-31-2002, 09:29 AM

Steve "the answer" Francis started at the 2, Mobley at the 3.

Positives:

Steve did shoot a good percentage, Mobley too.

Cato did rebound and play fairly well.

That raps that up.

Negatives that stand out:

The interior defense and defensive rebounding was awful.

The offense was "back to the future", Mooch, Steve and Cat dribble, dribble, dribble - chuck.

Yao Ming looked slow and lost

Eddie was way off...

RocDreamer · 10-31-2002, 09:32 AM

Eddie looked very bad.
But how bout big Kelv. 17 boards. I believe that he leads the NBA in rebounding. Didnt he say he was going to do that a year or so ago.:D

zzhiggins · 10-31-2002, 09:33 AM

Eddie shot 1 for 11,,,which is better two point or three points

:D The reason Kelvin got so many offensive rebounds..we kept missing all of our shots..

DearRock · 10-31-2002, 10:19 AM

Very good point. I had been blaming Steve but it really should be Moochie taking the blame. My bad, Steve. I am surprised thought. You also have to give Indy some credit, especially that damn Artest. He was very disruptive. And of course Mr. Missing in Action, EG.

ROXTXIA · 10-31-2002, 12:52 PM

And yet (Devil's Advocate) doesn't this (knee jerk reaction) show that Steve could be a great starting shooting guard? If he plays so much 2 anyway....

Not that Mooch "the Dribbler" Norris should be our starting PG, but....still....

gr8-1 · 10-31-2002, 12:56 PM

It was very frustrating to see Mooch jack up shots. At least Steve and Cat are actual scorers. What's frustrating is watching other teams play. They move the ball around. Did we have one fastbreak? Also, is Steve as explosive as he once was. I watched part of the Hornets game, and I have to say that Baron may be even more athletic.

On the bright side, at least they were jacking up shots earlier in the shot clock.

Sofine81 · 10-31-2002, 01:00 PM

Quote:

Yao Ming looked slow and lost

Your very right, Yao did look slow and lost. However is it fair to blame a young man who has known his teamates....what a whole 11 days? I think we need to be paitent with this man, he will come around.

Also Im gonna say this about Eddie Griffin, he is an awesome defensive player, Perhaps some day his offense will catch up with his defense, we live and hope!

Steve played great, at SHOOTING guard (that was an interesting Stat)

I think all the negative mess should stop, this was ONE game, heck I would like to be on a LA Laker's board right now, they have lost 2 in a row, and are only missing one man, we are 4, give this team time to gel and its gonna be awesome!

rezdawg · 10-31-2002, 01:12 PM

It doesnt matter that Moochie was at the point. Stevie had the ball 90% of the time.

BobFinn* · 10-31-2002, 01:15 PM

Have any of you ever played in a basketball game where one guy hogs the ball? takes all the shots? I bet it was frustrating for you (I know it was for me). You say to yourself, "When I get my hands on the ball, I am shooting it". Works wonders for team chemistry.

This is exactly what happened to the Rockets last night.

Steve's dribbling ability should open up good oppurtunities for his teamates. He beats his man off the dribble, another defender has to pick him up, which leaves a Rocket with an open shot. Last night Francis did not take advantage of this and instead, took shots from wherever and whenever his heart desired.

One other thing to watch in the future is Francis's inability to make the pass to the low post. He is not very good at it.

Sofine81 · 10-31-2002, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by rezdawg
It doesnt matter that Moochie was at the point. Stevie had the ball 90% of the time.

:D Yea well what do you know? your just a junior member lol, Im just kidding with you man! What Im thinking is this....perhaps the Rockets will look at some serious game tape today, and pick themselves apart to find out what went wrong last night, I hope they do anyways!

heypartner · 12:36 PM

A-Train,

Did you see the game? If not, why are you starting a thread about a stat to make some theoretical point.

Do you really believe Francis wasn't dominating the ball?? Most of what Moochie provided was relieving Francis from having to bring the ball up court. Mobley would bring it up too, and immediately pass it over to Francis. Your logic is like saying Jordan's PGs when he was scoring 35ppg dominating the ball were at fault, because they didn't get many assists.

BobFinn*,

I just think Rudy and Francis tried to steal a victory that leading into the game they knew they didn't deserve. in otherwords, they tried the early-Jordan method of winning. It failed largely because Griffin couldn't hit sh!t, and Francis went through a crucial stretch of trying to force his way through a dry spell.

That being his career high, we obviously have never seen him dominate the ball like that before. I just hope they view it as a situational strategy that failed. I also downplay the whole idea that if you're going to fail, fail by trying something new. The value gained (IN ONE GAME) in trying something new with Collier and 3 rookies as your bench matches the harm you can do by telling Francis and Mobley that we are not going to try to win this game, just use it as a practice.

BobFinn* · 10-31-2002, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by heypartner

BobFinn*,

It failed largely because Griffin couldn't hit sh!t, and Francis went through a crucial stretch of trying to force his way through a dry spell.

Griffin did not get the ball in the flow of the offense (was there even a flow to it last night?) All of his shots seemed forced, like "I'm gonna shoot cause I don't know when I'll get the ball again".

If Rudy & Francis knew they were going to lose that game (as you say) going into it, it's time to get rid of both of them.

JayZ750 · 10-31-2002, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by heypartner
I just hope they view it as a situational strategy that failed. I also downplay the whole idea that if you're going to fail, fail by trying something new. The value gained (IN ONE GAME) in trying something new with Collier and 3 rookies as your bench matches the harm you can do by telling Francis and Mobley that we are not going to try to win this game, just use it as a practice.

Unfortunately, Rudy & Co. seem to have a habit of sticking with things once they get in that mindset, even if it doesn't work, and then makign some excuse later (injuries, lack of practice time, rookies, etc) as to why they didn't try and do something different.

To say, before the game, that had they actually tried to run an offense consistent with what they are trying to implement in practice/the rest of the season would have had less of a chance of winning than the good ole selfish style of play doesn't seem realistic to me regardless of which players were/weren't playing. No harm would have been done given they would have had just as likely a shot of winning, imo.

NewYorker · 10-31-2002, 02:01 PM

Being Lost is one thing. Mucking up is one thing. I can live with both of those. I can live with Yao going even 0-100 for all i care. I can live with the turnovers, the lack of rebounds.

But being SLOW. That's a very bad sign.

Quote:

Originally posted by Sofine81
Your very right, Yao did look slow and lost. However is it fair to blame a young man who has known his teamates....what a whole 11 days? I think we need to be paitent with this man, he will come around.

Also Im gonna say this about Eddie Griffin, he is an awesome defensive player, Perhaps some day his offense will catch up with his defense, we live and hope!

Steve played great, at SHOOTING guard (that was an interesting Stat)

I think all the negative mess should stop, this was ONE game, heck I would like to be on a LA Laker's board right now, they have lost 2 in a row, and are only missing one man, we are 4, give this team time to gel and its gonna be awesome!

RocksMillenium · 10-31-2002, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ROXTXIA
And yet (Devil's Advocate) doesn't this (knee jerk reaction) show that Steve could be a great starting shooting guard? If he plays so much 2 anyway....

Not that Mooch "the Dribbler" Norris should be our starting PG, but....still....

No because 1.)He was scoring that much at the PG spot and his assist were higher at the PG spot and 2.)The team still lost. Francis is a PG, and people should let him stay there and let the rest of the scorers return.

RocksMillenium · 10-31-2002, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by NewYorker
Being Lost is one thing. Mucking up is one thing. I can live with both of those. I can live with Yao going even 0-100 for all i care. I can live with the turnovers, the lack of rebounds.

But being SLOW. That's a very bad sign.

Obviously Ming is much faster then he showed last night. He moved much faster in the international games and preseason so speed isn't a problem. It was obvious that he wasn't moving slow, but he was hesitating because he wasn't sure what to do, and he was also nervous.

Bob · 10-31-2002, 02:08 PM

Quote:

....perhaps the Rockets will look at some serious game tape today, and pick themselves apart to find out what went wrong last night, I hope they do anyways!

They have plenty more tape from last season with the same plays - well play. Why can't Rudy see the same thing we see?

heypartner · 10-31-2002, 02:18 PM

Many of Griffin's shots were open. Bob*, maybe you miss open shots that are not in the flow, but pro's can still make those. Flow of the game or not (which is debatable), there's no excuse for 1 for 11. I think you are adding theory to the fuel. I agreed that the strategy was flawed, but it can steal a victory like Jordan's teams could. I'm just trying to talk about what Francis and Rudy might have considered pregame and during the game....I'm not interested in placing blame. It bores me, and being a Rice Alumn used to losing a lot, I don't really understand the infatuation with placing blame, especially when I didn't think we were the best team. O'Neal owned Griffin. Griffin was largely a defensive non-factor against him.

Originally posted by BobFinn*
If Rudy & Francis knew they were going to lose that game (as you say) going into it, it's time to get rid of both of them.

I meant the complete opposite. You're right; I did make it sound like I meant they knew they were going to lose. I meant that given the players they might have considered their best shot is riding Francis, and hoping Griffin or Ming will make some shots.

I'm not defending the strategy as a real strategy; I'm saying Rudy is on record saying he viewed it as a bad situation and they might as well get practice on what they can practice with those players, and he chose to practice his 3 guard lineup. It did produce 17 fastbreak points. We can all disagree with him on using 3 Guards, but some coaches don't disagree with him on that lineup. Don Nelson doesn't.

My only point is (especially given Yao looking lost like Langhi), I don't see what else to achieve in that game that makes me want to distrust Rudy's intention to change the offense, as we move forward.

DukeOfHouston · 10-31-2002, 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by A-Train
Now, WHO did a poor job of distributing the ball last night?

Everyone, the rockets looked awful last night!