Texans lead top 10 Trotter destinations

[Hottoddie]

This is pure speculation by a New Jersey paper, but hmmmmmmm....., sure is something to think about. Would you give up a second round pick or future #1 pick (3-5 years down the road) for him?

http://www.nj.com/eagles/times/index...-JFQT2AOD.html

Texans lead top-10 Trotter destinations

03/17/02


MARK ECKEL

NFL

This much we know.

Jeremiah Trotter does not want to be an Eagle, not at one year for $5.5 million with no signing bonus.

And the Eagles' front office is not exactly thrilled about having to pay Trotter $5.5 million for one year and take that kind of salary-cap hit.

So there are two options.

One is to get together sometime between July 15 and the start of the season and get a long-term deal done.

While that sounds nice, don't count on it happening.

This fence is not going to be easily mended. It's gotten a little too personal at this point.

So the other option is to trade Trotter and get what you can. One Internet report said the Eagles would take a third-round pick.

That's absurd, whether it's true or not.

Figure on a No. 1 pick, at worst a good No. 2.

Now comes the really hard part: Where do you send a two-time All-Pro linebacker who just turned 25 and wants lots of money?

Hard to believe, but there are not that many choices.

In order to trade Trotter, the Eagles need to find a team that fits three important criteria. Obviously, the team must need a linebacker. It also must be able to sign Trotter to the contract he wants and fit him under the salary cap, and it has to be willing to part with a No. 1 or high No. 2 draft choice.

More than half the teams in the league are more than satisfied with their linebacker situation and wouldn't be interested at Trotter's price, or the Eagles'.

That still leaves about a dozen possibilities -- Dallas, Washington, Green Bay, Minnesota, New Orleans, and Tampa Bay in the NFC; Cleveland, Indianapolis, Jacksonville, Houston, Oakland and Kansas City in the AFC.

Of those 12, rule out Jacksonville and Kansas City as being able to afford to sign Trotter. Either team could make drastic cuts to find room, but as of now the Jaguars were just $395,000 under the cap, and the Chiefs were just $865,000 under.

Now we're down to a top-10 list, so let's explore those.

Houston, with the No. 1 pick overall, isn't moving that. The Texas do have a bunch of other picks, however, and could come up with a nice package. Head coach Dom Capers likes linebackers and plays a 3-4 defense, where Trotter would look like one of those Pittsburgh linebackers making plays all over the field.

Let's make the Texans the favorite.

Cleveland also has expressed some interest, and would like to put Trotter in between outside linebackers Jamir Miller and Dwayne Rudd and behind a pretty good front four. Head coach Butch Davis, a Jimmy Johnson protege, hates to trade draft picks, however.

Here is an idea that would make a lot of people happy, including Eagles quarterback Donovan McNabb: Trotter for wide receiver Kevin Johnson.

Rate Cleveland second on the Trotter hit parade.

Oakland and New Orleans are next.

Both have extra No. 1 picks -- the Raiders from Tampa Bay, Saints from Miami.

Oakland, which besides the 21st and 23rd picks also has two No. 2s, could use help at the linebacker position in a big way, and Al Davis never met a deal he didn't like.

Saints head coach Jim Haslett is a linebacker guy. He played it in Buffalo, coached it in Pittsburgh and needs it in New Orleans. He also has two No. 1s and is expected to get another draft pick for tackle Willie Roaf, so he has the ammunition to make a move.

Rate the Raiders and Saints three and four.

Green Bay also is interesting. The Packers made a big move last week to fix their offense by acquiring talented but enigmatic wide receiver Terry Glenn. Trotter is just as talented, but does not have the baggage, and will do for the defense what Glenn does for the offense. Green Bay will create cap room once it cuts wide receiver Antonio Freeman, and giving up the 28th overall pick in the draft for a two-time All-Pro might be well worth it.

And remember this: Trotter's agent is Jimmy Sexton. That's the same guy who got Reggie White to Green Bay from the Eagles. That alone puts the Packers in the top five.

Indianapolis would be next.

New head coach Tony Dungy knows defense and knows how much of an impact Trotter could make on the Colts. Indy is not going to want to part with the 11th overall pick, but again, a package of picks might work.

Minnesota has money to spend but has been looking for lower-tier players like Henri Crockett, who they gave a three-year, $3 million deal.

Dallas and Washington, both NFC East rivals, could use Trotter, but the Eagles would not want to trade him within the division. That would be as bad as getting a third-round pick.

Tampa Bay does not have a No. 1 or a No. 2 pick, so while Jon Gruden is losing players every day, he has little chance of landing Trotter.

[CriscoKidd]

I would give up a future 2nd rounder for him.

Future 1st? no.

2nd rounder this year? no.

A third rounder? mebbe.

I really like Trotter, but he isn't worth giving up a good pick + the cap space. Better to just go for lesser known solid lbs. I think Philly would be willing to let him go for less than a 1st or 2nd rounder though. I reeally don't think they want to pay him.

imo, of course.

[JayZ750]

Originally posted by CriscoKidd 2nd rounder this year? no.

Salary aside, Trotter would be a sure thing top 10 pick if he went back into the draft today. You just wouldnt give up the second rounder because of the cap hit? I don't know the money situation well enough - either they have it or they don't, but if they do got the money to spend and all it would take would be say, our second second rounder and a seventh rounder (or something like that), then you got to pull that deal. Trotter is very solid.

[Hottoddie]

I guess the decision would depend on whether or not Holmes signed with us.

[CriscoKidd]

Originally posted by JayZ750 Salary aside, Trotter would be a sure thing top 10 pick if he went back into the draft today. You just wouldnt give up the second rounder because of the cap hit? I don't know the money situation well enough - either they have it or they don't, but if they do got the money to spend and all it would take would be say, our second second rounder and a seventh rounder (or something like that), then you got to pull that deal. Trotter is very solid.

I don't think the cap hit is all that bad, but the 2nd rounder is gonna be a good player imo, a skill position one most likely(which they really need on the roster right now).

I just think that with the attractiveness of Houston to FAgents, esp linebackers, that Hou doesn't need to give up good picks to attract good lbs.

Course I wouldn't cry if they got him, he is a stud lb.

[Nomar]

I would give our mid 2nd round pick for Trotter, not the 1st pick in the 2nd round though.

[rocketteen]

I thought for rounds 2 thru 7, we have the first pick and last pick in each of those rounds? I certainly would trade our 2nd #2 pick at the end of that round for Mr. Trotter. Dude just turned 25 and has that much talent and still has room for improvement. If were able to land him and another stud outside backer, maybe Holdman, we would have the best linebacking crew in the NFL bar none. Running backs would be scared to run, recievers would be scared to run in the middle, TE's would get abused. Man I'm pumped...bring on some football.

[Ottomaton]

You guys have been smoking too much crack rock. Try going here instead as it's healthier in the long run. Trottier is pretty close to being the best in the NFL at his position. Going into this draft, I probably wouldn't trade the #1 overall pick for Trottier, but even then, how sure are you that you're getting one of the top 2 or three players at his position with the #1 overall?

You guys are as bad as the people who'd nix a Tim Duncan for Collier/TMo/MoT trade if the Spurs demanded you include a second round pick. Get over yourselves.

[gr8-1]

rocketteen, I think we have the 1st and the middle pick of each round. I would trade the second #2 for Trotter in a heartbeat.

[gr8-1]

Originally posted by Ottomaton You guys are as bad as the people who'd nix a Tim Duncan for Collier/TMo/MoT trade if the Spurs demanded you include a second round pick. Get over yourselves.

Well, Trotter is not as rare a talent as Duncan. Also a #2 in the nfl should be a starter. A second rounder in the nba may not make the roster.

Trotter is a st ud, but I'm sure there are a ton of GM's who would take a Julius Peppers like talent over him.

[Ottomaton]

BTW - history of the first pick in the second round:


2001 - Drew Brees - QB - Perdue
2000 - Dennis Northcutt - WR - Arizona
1999 - Kevin Johnson - WR - Syracuse
1998 - Leon Bender - DT - Washington State
1997 - Rick Terry - DT - North Carolina
1996 - Alex Van Dyke - WR - Nevada
1995 - Matt O'Dwyer - G - Northwestern
1994 - Darnay Scott - WR - San Diego State
1993 - Carlton Gray - DB - UCLA
1992 - Ashley Ambrose - DB - Mississippi Valley State
1991 - Mike Dumas - DB - Indiana

Even though Dumas, Scott, and Ambrose were all OK to pretty good in their prime, I'd have no qualms about trading all three of them for Trottier.

Also, I think those 3 and Kevin Johnson are more or less the only ones that did anything in the NFL. In otherwords, the success rate of the first pick in the second round is 40% for the last 10 years. You could trade, therefore, 3 picks at the beginning of the second round and most likely end up with no more than 1 NFL player, much less one of Trottier's caliber.

Nomah... I don't enjoy picking on you. I really don't. But I remember a 'Amare Stoudamire' thread which combined with this one tends to leave me with a general impression:

Many of you tend to overvalue the unknown. You make judgements and based on incomplete information and, in the name of frugality, believe that it's always appears better to offer some sort of stingy offer.

I think you need to examine your logic. The truism 'A bird in hand is worth two in bush.' Became a truism for a reason... it's true.

[rocketteen]

Gr8-1, I do believe that u r right. I went looking for the actual lists of the 2002 draft for all rounds. I was unsuccessful, but I did read something from the chronicle that said that the texans have the same draft format as the Browns and they picked in the middle of rounds 2-7 after all the teams w/ losing records picked. So we should have the first picks in rounds 1-7, #17 in rounds 2-7 and #32 in round 7 for a grand total of 14 picks overall.

I would trade my #17 in the 2nd round for a pro bowl middle linebacker who just turned 25 and we needed to fill a position granted he won't be asking for ridiculous money.

[Hottoddie]

It states that we get the 1st pick in every round & an additional pick in rounds 2-7, after all teams with less than a .500 record, which should be the 18th pick in each round. We also get the last pick in the 7th round. Here's the link to the Texan's draft rules & the picks, based on our record, for next year. I've also included a link to the 2002 draft order.

http://www.nfl.com/ce/feature/0,3783,4785885,00.html


Houston will have 28 choices in the NFL Draft over the next two years, 14 in 2002, and 14 in 2003. If the Texans make the playoffs in 2002, the team will not have extra picks in 2003.

In the 2002 draft (April 20-21), the Texans will receive the first pick in each of the seven rounds. They will also receive seven additional picks to be allocated in the following manner:


One selection in each of Rounds 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 and 7 after all teams with a 2001 regular-season winning percentage of less than .500.
Final selection in Round 7 (after all compensatory selections).
In the 2003 draft, Houston will receive one regular pick per round based on its 2002 record, the same as all other clubs.

The Texans will also receive seven additional picks in the 2003 draft -- unless they make the playoffs in 2002, in which case they will receive no extra picks. These picks will vary depending upon Houston's 2002 won-loss percentage, as reflected in the following year's draft order. These additional picks would be allocated in the following manner:


2002 W-L Extra Picks in 2003 Draft
#25 through #32 One pick in Rounds 3, 4 and 5. Two picks in Rounds 6 and 7.
#19 through #24 One pick in Rounds 4 and 5. Two picks in Round 6. Three picks in Round 7.
#13 through #18 One pick in Round 5. Two picks in Round 6. Four picks in Round 7.
Playoff team No extra picks.

The first extra Houston pick in any round will fall 16 slots below the club's original choice in that round, but no lower than the end of the round, after any compensatory picks. The second, third or fourth extra pick in a round will be at the end of the round after any compensatory selections.

In 2001 and 2002, Houston will be prohibited from trading any draft picks to acquire rights to sign or obtain the contractual release of any non-player personnel (e.g., coach, general manager).

http://www.nfl.com/ce/multi/0,3783,4816815,00.html

[PhiSlammaJamma]

I would trade for Trotter. We need good linebackers to be effective. Trotter is perfect. We already have a RB and the draft is deep at WR. I think it's a no brainer as long the money fits. Wong is going to need some help out there.

[PhiSlammaJamma]

.

[VesceySux]

Ottomaton, I completely agree with your analysis. If we could trade for Trotter (assuming his salary demands are reasonable), I would do it in a heartbeat. Trade our late 2nd round pick? No problem. Hell, I'll throw in a late rounder as well. Trotter is a proven commodity, plain and simple. He would completely upgrade our defense and perhaps turn it into one of the league's best (although, that would also depend on whether Wong can play OLB).

Put it this way: Would you rather have Elton Brand (the proven commodity) or draft picks? The Bulls went with the unknown, and the jury's still out on that decision.

[Joe Joe]

If the Texans weren't set on Carr, I'd suggest trading the 1st and second 3rd round pick for Trotter, the Eagles 1st, and Eagles second.

The Texans do need a QB and have FA opputunities for a LB. I think its a mistake to lock in like it sounds like the Texans have, but considering the Texans have no other QB options its a rare exception.

Question:

Whats better?

Holmes, Carr, 2 seconds, early and mid third rd pick and money to spend on lower tier players.
or
Trotter, Blake, a late first, three seconds, and first 3rd.

Carr vs Blake is a perceived big dropoff, but I don't trust unproven QBs.

Trotter vs Holmes adv Trotter

A 1st and a 2nd vs a mid third +cash adv 1st, 2nd

If it wasn't for Blake being proven to be so not good, I'd do the trade assuming the FA acquisitions. I don't like that Carr is the only reliable option left and QB's have a high bust potential. I wouldn't consider this a Texans mistake just the problem with expansion teams.....you just don't have options at every position.

I have nothing against Carr personally, but think its risky to draft a QB and the fact that I haven't seen him play adds to the fear.

[CriscoKidd]

Hey Ottomaton, I don't agree with your opinion so you must be a loosened up crack whore.



Oh, and I just wouldn't want to part with that 1st 2nd rounder. I knew they had additional picks, but I thought they kicked in later on.

And best in the league at his position, puh-lease. Who is overvaluing now? If he was that damn good the Eagles would build around him, not try to unload him. And if he's that damn good why aren't teams with high picks willing to trade for him?

oh, oh, I think ... I just got over myself.

[Hey Now!]

Originally posted by PhiSlammaJamma Wong is going to need some help out there.

how quickly they forget! jamie sharper ring any bells? the texans have a starting MLB who's every bit as good as trotter only he's much, much cheaper and doesn't cost them draft picks.

Originally posted by Joe Joe I have nothing against Carr personally, but think its risky to draft a QB and the fact that I haven't seen him play adds to the fear.

i hate to get self-righteous on everyone's ass, but this is really very simple: if you have a chance to draft a franchise QB, even if joe joe's never seen him play... you do it. there is no trade in the world that should deter you from making that selection. period. next issue. i can't even bring myself to debate this i feel so strongly about it.

the texans think carr is a franchise QB; scouts think carr is a franchise QB. he has a cannon attached to his right shoulder, better than average speed, remarkable intelligence, beyond-his-years maturity... david carr is the complete package, and he's about to be drafted by a team with a commitment to winning, a coaching staff with years of experience developing young QB's and an offensive line that's already among the best in the league. it's a no-brainer.

[gr8-1]

Originally posted by Ric the texans think carr is a franchise QB; scouts think carr is a franchise QB. he has a cannon attached to his right shoulder, better than average speed, remarkable intelligence, beyond-his-years maturity... david carr is the complete package, and he's about to be drafted by a team with a commitment to winning, a coaching staff with years of experience developing young QB's and an offensive line that's already among the best in the league. it's a no-brainer.

If he turns into a bust after next year, do you think the Texans will draft Manning, Leftwich, or Simms?

Of course, maybe a year is a bit earlier to proclaim someone a bust.