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Who are the best post entry passers in the NBA today?

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by mollamar, Jan 17, 2014.

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  1. mollamar

    mollamar Contributing Member

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    Last season, we ran pick and rolls with Lin-Asik and Harden-Asik, and we all lamented how bad Asik was at catching passes and finishing. I assumed that with Dwight, we would add about 4-6 points per game on these types of possessions just because Dwight would be able to hold onto the ball. Watching the first half of the season though, my eye-tests tells me that the guards would pass into Asik as the roll man with a lot more frequency than they do this year with Dwight as the roll man.

    However, we ostensibly want to be more of a post up team. While Dwight's moves at the beginning of the season looked forced, rushed, and premeditated, in the past 10 games or so, I have noticed that Dwight's post moves are starting to look a lot less mechanical and he is starting to recognize help defense better and thread in some counter moves. Chalk it up to, as recently reported, Carroll Dawson starting to work with Dwight. I expect Dwight to continue to improve in this area.

    To make the post work, a remaining glaring hole in our offense is reliable post entry passes for Dwight to start from. I saw the following thread in another forum http://www.basketballforum.com/nba-forum/347199-best-post-entry-passer-league.html that dated to 2007 where folks were discussing post entry passers. They noted that only the Rockets (Yao) and Heat (Shaq) were committed to the post, with (Orlando) Dwight working on it. They listed the best contemporary post entry passers as being Robert Horry, Baron Davis, Jason Williams, Jamal Crawford, Manu Ginobili, Stephon Marbury, and Jamaal Tinsley. Kind of a sad list, even if you teleport back to 2007.

    To refresh the list, I thought about which team's systems rely on variations of the post, even if not with a big ma,n and which would still have players in the NBA today. The Lakers notably ran a triple post offense (the Triangle) for years, but only Derrick Fisher and Kobe come to mind as guards who are still playing (sort of) and who really knew that offense. Adleman's teams ran high post offenses that were effective in getting the ball down low, but he doesn't really have a family tree of post passing guards either.

    I'm curious which other systems come to mind and which players folks think have shown that they can get the job done.

    Thoughts?
     
    #1 mollamar, Jan 17, 2014
  2. qiantom1999

    qiantom1999 Rookie

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    I do not think entry pass is the main problem though. Dwight not able to establish position consistently is a bigger problem.

     
    #2 qiantom1999, Jan 17, 2014
  3. WNBA

    WNBA Member

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    Post up is becoming the least efficient offense. Hope Howard can play P&R or Morey can trade Howard.
     
    #3 WNBA, Jan 17, 2014
  4. haoafu

    haoafu Contributing Member

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    Interesting all those "good passers" had all time great low post bigmen to pass to...
     
    #4 haoafu, Jan 17, 2014
  5. LosPollosHermanos

    LosPollosHermanos Houston only fan
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    Brooks, parsons.
     
    #5 LosPollosHermanos, Jan 17, 2014
  6. Easy

    Easy Boban Only Fan
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    The post game is not like your grandfather's game anymore. Rule changes and how they call the game just killed the traditional post game unless you are really elite. (Yao could have been more dominant had he played in the 80s and early 90s. So would Shaq.)

    The best entry passer would be Robert Horry. Maybe Morey can convince him to come out of retirement.He might even be able to hit a big shot or two for us. :grin:
     
    #6 Easy, Jan 17, 2014
  7. Play07

    Play07 Member

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    center with no shot post game in the NBA ended when SHAQ left. If you cant hit a shot like M.gasol, P.gasol, hibbert, cousins then you will find out quick that you will not get far agaisnt coaches in the playoffs
     
    #7 Play07, Jan 17, 2014
  8. Garner

    Garner Member

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    Chemistry will take care of plenty of this.
     
    #8 Garner, Jan 17, 2014
  9. Benchwarmer

    Benchwarmer Member

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    Post up only works when you have a PF who can spread the floor. Or else it's the opposing C and PF double teaming Dwight on every post up play.
     
    #9 Benchwarmer, Jan 17, 2014
  10. baller4life315

    baller4life315 Contributing Member

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    Dwight has been to the NBA Finals...

    :confused:
     
    #10 baller4life315, Jan 17, 2014
  11. WNBA

    WNBA Member

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    Dwight has been to the NBA Finals by playing p&r and hustling like superman.
    That Dwight has been long gone.
     
    #11 WNBA, Jan 17, 2014
  12. omgTHEpotential

    omgTHEpotential Member

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    None of the Rockets, that's for sure.
     
    #12 omgTHEpotential, Jan 17, 2014
  13. cheke64

    cheke64 Member

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    We need a pg, entry passer, third star, years to gel, injuries healed, enforcer. What did I miss?
     
    #13 cheke64, Jan 17, 2014
  14. Juxtaposed Jolt

    Juxtaposed Jolt Member

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    I'm not sure if there's a stat detailing the success of the post-entry pass.
     
    #14 Juxtaposed Jolt, Jan 17, 2014
  15. mogrod

    mogrod Contributing Member

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    How is Jameer Nelson at post-entry passing?

    Dwight had his best years in Orlando obviously. I know it wasn't directly coming off of pounding it in the post play after play. But, I'd have to imagine Jameer is at least adequate at throwing it to Dwight where and when he likes it.
     
    #15 mogrod, Jan 17, 2014
  16. Antec

    Antec Member

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    TMAC

    TRACY MCGRADY
     
    #16 Antec, Jan 17, 2014
  17. HardLin

    HardLin Member

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    At the beginning of the season I saw our ball handlers pick up their dribble, then a game of keep-away would start with their defender, while they tried to get an entry pass to D12. This would often lead to either a turnover, or D12 having to leap out of position to get the pass.

    Now I often see the guards beat their man off the dribble before passing to D12 in the post. Or, a spot-up 3 shooter pump faking, then bouncing a pass to D12 when the defender closes out. Next I hope to see either screens, or other diversionary plays to get D12 the ball.

    So the team is learning. Doing a static entry pass while everyone else stands around is not an effective way to get Dwight the ball. Even with an "elite" post entry passer.
     
    #17 HardLin, Jan 17, 2014
  18. shastarocket

    shastarocket Contributing Member

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    Andre Miller can be had for peanuts.

    Unfortunately his expiring $5mill salary will likely require more than he's worth.
     
    #18 shastarocket, Jan 17, 2014
  19. thejeremylins

    thejeremylins Member

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    Nice post OP

    Looking at the NBA now, obviously there's no dominant low-post player, but there are a few players who get most of their buckets on the low block and maybe their pgs feed them:

    Marc Gasol- 14.7ppg Grizzlies- Mike Conley
    Nikola Pekovic- 18.2ppg Twolves- Rubio
    Andre Drummond- 12.7ppg Pistons- Jennings, Billups
    Al Jefferson- 17.6ppg Bobbykittens- Kemba Walker


    Ref:
    http://www.cbssports.com/nba/playerrankings/regularseason/C
    http://vorped.com/bball/index.php/player/shotchart/

    Not sure if these guards are actually assisting the bigs I listed since I only watch Houston games, but I hope it gives ya something.
     
    #19 thejeremylins, Jan 17, 2014
  20. Carl Herrera

    Carl Herrera Contributing Member

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    Many of the better post entry passers are not PGs or even high assist total guys. Instead, they are taller guys who can throw a pass over the top of the defense.

    Shane Battier was really good at it with Yao-- not a creative passer but safe and really zips the ball into Yao's hands at the right moment without causing a turnover too often. For Dwight Howard, two guys who passed well to him were Hedo in Orlando and Pau Gasol in LA.
     
    #20 Carl Herrera, Jan 17, 2014
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