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[CBS Sports] How Hero-ball doomed the Rockets
Tags:  basketball, blog, doomed, heat, houston rockets, lebron, lebron james, miami, nba Tags
durvasa is online now Old 11-13-2012, 01:52 AM   #1
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Some may instinctively feel this is a negative thread because of the title, but this really is a very nice breakdown of what went right and then what went wrong for the Rockets against Miami. Several game play videos included, which is helpful for those of us who couldn't watch the game.

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/blog/ey...on-for-the-win
 
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Blaster_333 is offline Old 11-13-2012, 01:55 AM   #2
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I love stuff like this, I wish there was a resident b-ball coach on the forums that could break down games for us.
 
split41 is offline Old 11-13-2012, 01:58 AM   #3
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Thanks man, this is interesting.
 
apollo33 is offline Old 11-13-2012, 01:58 AM   #4
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awesome breakdown thanks durv

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durvasa is online now Old 11-13-2012, 01:58 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blaster_333 View Post
I love stuff like this, I wish there was a resident b-ball coach on the forums that could break down games for us.
Don't know if there are any coaches, but many posters here come to mind when it comes to analyzing b-ball X's and O's that are worth paying attention to. I think heypartner and leebigez both know a lot about the game (even though they very often disagree -- that's part of the fun ). A newcomer, torocan, also seems to be very knowledgeable.
 
mirus is offline Old 11-13-2012, 02:01 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by durvasa View Post
Don't if there are any coaches, but a few posters here come to mind when it comes to analyzing b-ball X's and O's that are worth paying attention to. I think heypartner and leebigez both know a lot about the game (even though they very often disagree -- that's part of the fun ). A newcomer, torocan, also seems to be very knowledgeable.
FYI,torocan is a very reputable poster in PSD knicks board.You can check his reps there.

btw thanks durvasa for sharing

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RV6 is offline Old 11-13-2012, 02:04 AM   #7
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Can't blame Pat completely, but

a) he had inside position on Harden's miss and he let Bosh push him out.

b) he should have anticipated Lebron's crossover and committed earlier. You could tell Lebron was setting up that move. Maybe Pat wasn't looking.

Rusty Hardin's reaction to Lin's 3 is classic...

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dragonz is offline Old 11-13-2012, 02:20 AM   #8
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Can't blame Pat completely, but

a) he had inside position on Harden's miss and he let Bosh push him out.

b) he should have anticipated Lebron's crossover and committed earlier. You could tell Lebron was setting up that move. Maybe Pat wasn't looking.

Rusty Hardin's reaction to Lin's 3 is classic...
Agree, I don't really like how 2Pat always get pushed around by other team's big men, he needs stand his ground both in offense and defense. People all tends like to see those highlight blocks or cool scoring ect, but its the basic stuff like stand your ground and push opponent out of their comfort zone changes the game.
 
torocan is offline Old 11-13-2012, 02:22 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RV6 View Post
Can't blame Pat completely, but

a) he had inside position on Harden's miss and he let Bosh push him out.

b) he should have anticipated Lebron's crossover and committed earlier. You could tell Lebron was setting up that move. Maybe Pat wasn't looking.

Rusty Hardin's reaction to Lin's 3 is classic...
Yah, I find Pat's defense is oddly inconsistent when bodying up, especially when I see a smaller player like Lin driving Lebron to the baseline but Pat having difficulty doing the same thing.

I suspect that he may need to work more on his fundamental footwork.

Whatever happened to Big Man Camp?
 
RV6 is offline Old 11-13-2012, 02:23 AM   #10
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And that last shot by Harden was horrible. Was that Harden's call or Sampson's? Guys weren't even in position to shoot a three and Harden ran theclock down too much, so of course he was going to step back for a three...

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JayGoogle is online now Old 11-13-2012, 02:43 AM   #11
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And that last shot by Harden was horrible. Was that Harden's call or Sampson's? Guys weren't even in position to shoot a three and Harden ran theclock down too much, so of course he was going to step back for a three...
Harden says they had something drawn up.

You can see Delfino trying to get open (at one point is bear hugged by Allen...) and I think once Harden saw that he decided he had to get a shot up.

In the end it was better defense by Miami because no one else was open and in that instance than yeah, you want Harden to take that shot.

Other than one bad step back jumper...I just don't see the hero ball everyone wants to put on James.

He creates two good looks and gets his teams 6 points...then drives, to the rim and doesn't get a call or finish, ah well. It was a pretty good drive until the end there.

Then that play where Lin got open and missed. I just don't see this whole "Harden tried to be the hero!" thing, the plays in the end didn't work. Lebron hit his clutch shots, Bosh got the big rebound as well.

That BS call that took out Morris who was playing phenomenal also has a pretty big effect on the game...took out a impact player AND gave the Heat the ball in a crucial situation. That call really sucked.

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dragonz is offline Old 11-13-2012, 03:02 AM   #12
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still cant believe Harden drive into the lane that Shane Battier gave him, without a backup plan.

There is a reason Battier is the top defender of this game and Harden truely has alot to learn.
 
Blaster_333 is offline Old 11-13-2012, 03:07 AM   #13
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Harden says they had something drawn up.

You can see Delfino trying to get open (at one point is bear hugged by Allen...) and I think once Harden saw that he decided he had to get a shot up.

In the end it was better defense by Miami because no one else was open and in that instance than yeah, you want Harden to take that shot.

Other than one bad step back jumper...I just don't see the hero ball everyone wants to put on James.

He creates two good looks and gets his teams 6 points...then drives, to the rim and doesn't get a call or finish, ah well. It was a pretty good drive until the end there.

Then that play where Lin got open and missed. I just don't see this whole "Harden tried to be the hero!" thing, the plays in the end didn't work. Lebron hit his clutch shots, Bosh got the big rebound as well.

That BS call that took out Morris who was playing phenomenal also has a pretty big effect on the game...took out a impact player AND gave the Heat the ball in a crucial situation. That call really sucked.
Yeah upon watcing the replays and hearing them in their post game interviews, it really did look like a bad offensive scheme being beaten by a superior defense. I guess we all want Harden to be the scapegoat here, but they may not be giving him much to work with.
 
MambaJoe is offline Old 11-13-2012, 03:21 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by RV6 View Post
And that last shot by Harden was horrible. Was that Harden's call or Sampson's? Guys weren't even in position to shoot a three and Harden ran theclock down too much, so of course he was going to step back for a three...
I think the play was just overall a mess. Harden got the ball and looked around but no one was open, everyone was still trying to fight through screens and then he just took it upon himself because there's really not much time left (7 seconds) and just try to make a desperate 3.

The outcome is really, the Heat is overall a better team, more talented, stronger, and more athletic, with better coaches while the Rockets are in rebuilding, everyone trying to figure out one another and a assistant coach...

The Rockets put up a great fight, but the last few minutes was just horrendous on defense. They did made a couple of big shots but Lebron was just the best player. The Miami Heat defense is built to shut anybody down.

Tonight, they zero in on James Harden, they scouted him and attacked his strengths. The Heat had Shane, Wade, Lebron, Bosh, and a little of Mario Chalmbers taking turns guarding him. 3 of them are NBA top 10 wing defensive players. On top of having 3 of the best wing defenders in the NBA, they also know how to play help defense. James Harden did quite well considering how much the defense zero'd in on him.

This should be a great learning experience for Houston. They have a lot of tweaking to do. Like with Wade and Lebron, they still have their teammates help create space for them to hit shots. With James, no one really help him create any space because whenever they run a pick n roll for him, the defense would just rush up and double team him.

I think if they would set like 2 screens for James to run off of and do a catch and shoot would benefit a lot. There is a lot of things that Lin really needs to work on. He has the talent and great passing ability, but he needs to be more aggressive at penetrating the defense and creating contact to get to the foul line because he is basically useless on a catch and shoot.

The Rockets have Lin and Harden who both can penetrate the defense and create for others. But they also need their teammates to help create space for them when elite defenders are all over them. Patrick Patterson still need to be a little more aggressive and box out opponents. The only thing that was really killing them is their ability to get off good shots. The Rockets don't really have any good offensive plays.

The Rockets coaching staff needs to use this game to learn from all their mistakes. They cannot expect to win many games with Harden going 1 on 1 the whole entire night or that Pick & Roll that rarely works. I notice today on a pick & roll possession, Asik set up a nice pick for Harden, but the defense just bum rushed him and double him. While James was being double, Asik slowly rolled into the middle of the lane where another Heat player was just standing there waiting for Harden to pass it to Asik...

I really feel like the Harden-Asik P&R does not work. Omer Asik is great at setting screens but he is not capable of catching the ball while rolling to the basket on P&R. But they keep going back to that. Patrick would be a better option because he can catch and shoot but his jumpshot is far from a Chris Bosh consistency and he doesn't attack the basket aggressively enough either. I would love to see the coaches try a Harden-Jones P&R or even a little Lin-Harden P&R with Lin being the ball handler and Harden being the roller. It would make more sense because Harden can catch the ball as he's rolling to the basket and get to the basket or catch and shoot. But with Asik, he's more suited for grabbing lose ball and put backs or gets fed the ball when he has his man fully boxed out under the basket. But on a P&R situation, Asik is almost useless because the defense would just double the handler and Asik is not capable of catching the ball while rolling without traveling, fumbling the ball, or gets out of control and commit a charge.

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xclearscreen is offline Old 11-13-2012, 03:48 AM   #15
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I think the play was just overall a mess. Harden got the ball and looked around but no one was open, everyone was still trying to fight through screens and then he just took it upon himself because there's really not much time left (7 seconds) and just try to make a desperate 3.
watch that last play again. watch the huddle right before it. the play was drawn up. Parsons even reconfirmed it with Harden as they walked. Harden's face was like "hell no". he was determined to take things in his own hands.

the play was to free Lin up (screen set by PPat) to get the ball from Harden. Harden totally ignored him. Lin came back and Harden again ignored him. at this point, it became a total mess.. guys had to adjust/improvise. Delfino was able to curled out of the mess down low but Harden was already determined to be fire that last shot. Delfino was like "WHAT THE ***** JUST HAPPENED?"
 
gtmkcp is offline Old 11-13-2012, 03:59 AM   #16
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watch that last play again. watch the huddle right before it. the play was drawn up. Parsons even reconfirmed it with Harden as they walked. Harden's face was like "hell no". he was determined to take things in his own hands.

the play was to free Lin up (screen set by PPat) to get the ball from Harden. Harden totally ignored him. Lin came back and Harden again ignored him. at this point, it became a total mess.. guys had to adjust/improvise. Delfino was able to curled out of the mess down low but Harden was already determined to be fire that last shot. Delfino was like "WHAT THE ***** JUST HAPPENED?"
If that's what happenned I'm really starting to dislike Harden. He's putting himself first over the team. I thought he cost the team the loss against Portland also, when he went heroball in that last play.
 
JayGoogle is online now Old 11-13-2012, 04:09 AM   #17
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Quote:
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watch that last play again. watch the huddle right before it. the play was drawn up. Parsons even reconfirmed it with Harden as they walked. Harden's face was like "hell no". he was determined to take things in his own hands.

the play was to free Lin up (screen set by PPat) to get the ball from Harden. Harden totally ignored him. Lin came back and Harden again ignored him. at this point, it became a total mess.. guys had to adjust/improvise. Delfino was able to curled out of the mess down low but Harden was already determined to be fire that last shot. Delfino was like "WHAT THE ***** JUST HAPPENED?"
You are making a assumption.

A lot of these plays have several options.

I see the "Screen" by 2pat, problem is it was not a screen at all, if it was supposed to be then he completely failed to do so. I can see how it would go if it was successful, Wade was on Lin. Screen gets Wade out of the play and frees up Lin. This would give Lin the option of a semi-contested three (as Wade would likely run over Patterson to get there and would not get called for it anyways.) or If Lin drives maybe the man that is on Parsons in the corner leaves him...then again Miami would welcome the drive and give him the two. So it could have been another shot at giving Lin another 3.

As it were though, there was no screen. Wade was on Lin and James was on Harden. Delfino tried to get free, you can see him desperately trying to do so but he could not.

After all this is done there is one second on the clock.

It's a complete assumption to say that Harden ignored coaches orders and did his own thing.

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xclearscreen is offline Old 11-13-2012, 04:21 AM   #18
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You are making a assumption.

A lot of these plays have several options.

I see the "Screen" by 2pat, problem is it was not a screen at all, if it was supposed to be then he completely failed to do so. I can see how it would go if it was successful, Wade was on Lin. Screen gets Wade out of the play and frees up Lin. This would give Lin the option of a semi-contested three (as Wade would likely run over Patterson to get there and would not get called for it anyways.) or If Lin drives maybe the man that is on Parsons in the corner leaves him...then again Miami would welcome the drive and give him the two. So it could have been another shot at giving Lin another 3.

As it were though, there was no screen. Wade was on Lin and James was on Harden. Delfino tried to get free, you can see him desperately trying to do so but he could not.

After all this is done there is one second on the clock.

It's a complete assumption to say that Harden ignored coaches orders and did his own thing.
a whole lot of nit-picking and assumption on your part actually. whatever it was PPat got Lin free to get the ball from Harden but was ignored twice. when you go straight up like that (not curls) it's usually a play just to get the pg the ball to setup the play. at this point there was still 4-5 seconds on the clock. NO WAY was it meant for Lin do a complete 180 and launch a contested 3. but from there on it is hard to tell because the whole play had already collapse before it even had a chance.
 
the_hustler is offline Old 11-13-2012, 06:06 AM   #19
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I know this is out of context, but does anybody else miss Luis Scola?

I know he is not a great defender , but I think he would have been very good with Asik playing along and covering his inefficiencies. Scola was a threat with his jumper, excellent finishing skills around the rim and his post up game. With a guy like Scola involved in PnRs with James Harden, a lot would have changed because Luis can catch the ball and finish around the rim. He is also an underrated passer.

I know we are going with the youth movement etc, but D Mo , T Jones etc are not even playing. Looks like we are playing to win games now and P-Patt has not been impressive to me after these 2 years he has spent with the team. We absolutely need a ScoLandry level power forward and I hope D-Mo can be the guy. T-Jones too.
 
Knickskiller is offline Old 11-13-2012, 06:10 AM   #20
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actually the bench nearly won this game for us. we had a huge lead before they came in.
Shame on the starters except for Asik
 

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