Tyreke Evans being shopped by Sac.

[Juxtaposed Jolt]

Originally Posted by meh Do you believe Kyle Lowry is one of these players?

Ibaka is one of those players.

If he keeps working on his shot, and he improves, someone will offer him a max contract.

[Mariachi ROCKET]

We must trade all our picks for Brian Scalabrine!

[leebigez]

Originally Posted by roslolian 30% is not an average jumpshooter that's a horrible jumpshooter. You're talking about a 10% increase in mid-range accuracy, how often does that happen in the NBA when you don't have 3 pt range? What easy fix are you talking about, if it was that easy then everybody could increase their mid-range accuracy. As you said it takes a lot of repitition and practice, and looking at how Evan's game hasn't improved at all the past couple of years I don't know why you think he'll suddenly wake up one morning, decide he wants to be the best NBA player in history and start working on his game like mad. As for getting those layups, floaters, babyhooks and dunks it'll be hard to penetrate in the lane and do anything if the opponent can zone up and prevent you from getting close to the rim. Right now he's playing on a garbage team so opponents don't take him too seriously and let him dominate the ball and have his way because every time he ball hogs his team loses. However when he goes to a winning team Miami and OKC will clamp down on the paint so hard he'll be rendered useless.

Do you want me to use hof players or just regular players? Go and check clyde drexler,jordan their jumpshooting % their 3rd yr in the league
. Also check out tony parker and his jumpshootint % his 3rd yr. Point being is if the player can get to the rim despite being a 30% jumpshooter. What is said was the easiest thing it is to learn is to to vs being a driver slasher type. We've seen through the history of the nba of players becoming good jumpshooters vs good slashers. Dwayne wade is a slasher, now he's a good jumpshooter. Imm willing to bet without looking at the number that wade isn't more than a 0% jumpshooter. He shoots a high % because he can blow by you + he has a variety of floaters,jump hooks and off balance shots he make. Durant is a great jumpshooter by the term. Westbrook is also by term. Those guys are probably 45 % or so. Most of the high % jumpshooters are guys taking wide open mid range shots or a guy like kobe.

[LCAhmed]

Originally Posted by Mariachi ROCKET We must trade all our picks for Brian Scalabrine!

White Mamba is thy savior

[meh]

Originally Posted by Juxtaposed Jolt Ibaka is one of those players. If he keeps working on his shot, and he improves, someone will offer him a max contract.

Ibaka jumpshot % since coming into the league

Year 1: 46%
Year 2: 41%
Year 3: 41%

[meh]

Originally Posted by Raven Don't be an ass or I will simply ignore you. Let's take a guy who the Rockets have targeted. Morey wants him, but other teams do too. Now this guy is thinking one contract ahead. He's getting essentially the same offer from several teams, but one of those teams (us) has a reputation for playing hardball on contract extensions. Why choose us if he thinks Morey is going to nickel and dime him four years down the road. Morey is smart not to overpay, but he's not very smooth in how he goes about it.

So you feel that players such as Dwight Howard and Deron Williams believe they'll be role players down the road, and fears that Morey may only pay them $4mil instead of $5mil when they are looking at their next contract?

Morey has shown that he'll pay non-superstars superstar money. He offered more money for Melo, Bosh, and Gasol than what Lebron got from Miami. Unless there's a superstar who thinks he'll turn into Aaron Brooks soon, there's no logical reason why he'll fear signing with the Rockets.

[plutoblue11]

Originally Posted by jopatmc Sorry, it's the right comparison. Someone was trying to make the point that NBA ROYs never bust. My point is yes, sometimes they do. If Tyreke Evans doesn't get serious about developing his game, he'll be playing overseas in a couple years. His ROY was a product of the Sacramento Kings promoting him in the media similar to the way a college team promotes Heisman Trophy candidates. His ROY was a joke to begin with. He WAS NOT the best player in his rookie class. His statistics were and still are hollow. High usage rate, very, very low efficiency.

The odd thing about Coleman was he did not live up to his potential, but he had a better than average NBA career. I imagine if his personal intangible improved, he would've been a better players.

It's much too early to put that kind of judgement on Evans, he's three years into the league on an awful team with no structure.

In all of Evans awfulness and ball-hogging, he shot better from the field (inside the 3 point line) this year than Kevin Martin, Courtney Lee, Kyle Lowry, Brandon Jennings, Derrick Rose, OJ Mayo, Ricky Rubio, Monta Ellis, Lou Williams, and many others. In two of his first three season, he's shot over 45% from the field. His biggest strengths, he can get to basket and beat players off the dribble.


Even with all poor usage rates, efficiency, and ball-hogging nature, among all guards, he's one of the league leaders in scoring efficiency at the rim and in the post.

I laughed a poster said that Terrence Williams or Courtney would turn out to be better players than Evans will. This is why you cannot take most posters on Clutch Fans seriously with their deluded perceptions of certain players.

[jopatmc]

Originally Posted by plutoblue11 The odd thing about Coleman was he did not live up to his potential, but he had a better than average NBA career. I imagine if his personal intangible improved, he would've been a better players. It's much too early to put that kind of judgement on Evans, he's three years into the league on an awful team with no structure. In all of Evans awfulness and ball-hogging, he shot better from the field (inside the 3 point line) this year than Kevin Martin, Courtney Lee, Kyle Lowry, Brandon Jennings, Derrick Rose, OJ Mayo, Ricky Rubio, Monta Ellis, Lou Williams, and many others. In two of his first three season, he's shot over 45% from the field. His biggest strengths, he can get to basket and beat players off the dribble. Even with all poor usage rates, efficiency, and ball-hogging nature, among all guards, he's one of the league leaders in scoring efficiency at the rim and in the post. I laughed a poster said that Terrence Williams or Courtney would turn out to be better players than Evans will. This is why you cannot take most posters on Clutch Fans seriously with their deluded perceptions of certain players.

I can't take a poster seriously when they think Coleman had a good career and think Tyreke could break out because he's one of the league leaders in scoring efficiency at the rim and in the post.

[leebigez]

Originally Posted by jopatmc I can't take a poster seriously when they think Coleman had a good career and think Tyreke could break out because he's one of the league leaders in scoring efficiency at the rim and in the post.

You don't think coleman had a good career? Maybe we need to hear your definition of good. Did his career match his talent? No, but he had a good career. Tyson chandler has had a good career. Not the kind you would think the #2 pick should have,but he's had a good career. He's started pretty much every yr he's been in the league since he got the starting nod.

I'm not sure anyone said tyreke would break out and become a superstar,but I think he's worth the gamble of him becoming an all star level player. Notice I didn't say every yr all star player,but a guy who can make it several times in his career. This isn't t-will,jordan hill,or hasheem thabeet. This guy has started and been productive in the nba. He can get better if he puts in the work. A lot of posters think the nba is so easy that guys don't work and can roll out of bed and produce and that's not true. I've never read or heard about evans having a poor work ethic. I've also hear he's a gym rat which is always a good thing. Aside from do-nuts and maybe dragic, I don't see anyone on the rockets who will or have the potential to make several all star games in their career. So,its not like the rockets are giving up a major piece to get him. Jmo

[plutoblue11]

Originally Posted by jopatmc I can't take a poster seriously when they think Coleman had a good career and think Tyreke could break out because he's one of the league leaders in scoring efficiency at the rim and in the post.

DC: 15 seasons played, 16.5 ppg, 9.3 rebs, 2.5 assists, 1.3 blks, 76.9 FT%,
http://www.basketball-reference.com/...colemde01.html



Hell, if he won 2 or more NBA titles. Some people would think he'd be Hall of Fame worthy with those numbers, down the road. Right now, I'd give up anyone our team to get a player, like Derrick Coleman. He was 20-10 player for consecutive NBA seasons.

He's not even a superstar.


So again, I will ask you don't think that's a good career?

For most NBA players, even top 3 picks, that's a more than passable career and I'd imagine alot of teams would be happy to get a player like that out of draft based on numbers alone.


I never actually said Tyreke Evans would turn into a superstar. Don't put words in my mouth, again. It's very foolish to believe that he isn't a productive player or is completely useless to the dynamic of a team. Most of all, the point which I made was his game would be well-suited in the right system or with the right set of players. You also left out the part where he shot over 45% from the field two out of the last three. Nice way to misrepresent my argument and leave the vital part out.


It's ironic poster cry about how terrible he is, yet if he came to the Rockets. He'd arguably be the best player. Worst of all, he brings a skill set to the table that no other players on the Rockets really posses.

In reality, the only person I can see having a better career than him when it's said and done is Dragic and maybe Lowry. It won't be a great gap, either.

[jopatmc]

If Tyreke came to the Rox, McHale would bench his a.. so fast it would make your head swim. And then we'd end up shipping him out like we did TWill for a whole lotta nuth'n. I'm done commenting on Tyreke. I've been consistent since his rookie season saying he was WAY OVERRATED and one of the most selfish non-winning players in the NBA. And I maintain if he doesn't change his game and his style he'll be out of the league in a couple years. Best player on our roster poppycock.

[plutoblue11]

Originally Posted by jopatmc If Tyreke came to the Rox, McHale would bench his a.. so fast it would make your head swim. And then we'd end up shipping him out like we did TWill for a whole lotta nuth'n. I'm done commenting on Tyreke. I've been consistent since his rookie season saying he was WAY OVERRATED and one of the most selfish non-winning players in the NBA. And I maintain if he doesn't change his game and his style he'll be out of the league in a couple years. Best player on our roster poppycock.

For the sake of the argument, I'll give you the best player point. ON the same token, speaking strictly on offense, how many players on this roster could average 17 or more points on 45% shooting consistently and create their own offense.

[meh]

Originally Posted by plutoblue11 For the sake of the argument, I'll give you the best player point. ON the same token, speaking strictly on offense, how many players on this roster could average 17 or more points on 45% shooting consistently and create their own offense.

For this argument to work, you have to assume that NBA coaches use raw FG% to judge players. That they don't take into account a player's ability to draw fouls nor their ability to make 3s. You can disagree with NBA teams for caring more about raw FG%, but that's how they do it in the NBA.

FWIW, Derrick Coleman example is not a good one because Coleman was lazy and fat. There's nothing that suggest Evans doesn't care. In fact, there's more to suggest that he is willing to try and play well but simply can't. There's a reason why posters here compare him to Steve Francis, a player most of us Rockets fans love for his drive and competitiveness.

[meh]

Originally Posted by meh For this argument to work, you have to assume that NBA coaches use raw FG% to judge players. That they don't take into account a player's ability to draw fouls nor their ability to make 3s. You can disagree with NBA teams for caring more than raw FG%, but that's how they do it in the NBA. FWIW, Derrick Coleman example is not a good one because Coleman was lazy and fat. There's nothing that suggest Evans doesn't care. In fact, there's more to suggest that he is willing to try and play well but simply can't. There's a reason why posters here compare him to Steve Francis, a player most of us Rockets fans love for his drive and competitiveness.

fixed

[plutoblue11]

Originally Posted by meh For this argument to work, you have to assume that NBA coaches use raw FG% to judge players. That they don't take into account a player's ability to draw fouls nor their ability to make 3s. You can disagree with NBA teams for caring more about raw FG%, but that's how they do it in the NBA. FWIW, Derrick Coleman example is not a good one because Coleman was lazy and fat. There's nothing that suggest Evans doesn't care. In fact, there's more to suggest that he is willing to try and play well but simply can't. There's a reason why posters here compare him to Steve Francis, a player most of us Rockets fans love for his drive and competitiveness.

I never brought Coleman into the argument, that was another posters doing.

I also added other things that Evans does well, and that really his only fatal flaw is jump-shooting.

[meh]

Originally Posted by plutoblue11 I never brought Coleman into the argument, that was another posters doing. I also added other things that Evans does well, and that really his only fatal flaw is jump-shooting.

Okay. Because from your post it seems like you feel his 45% shooting is suppose to make him better than Rockets players that can shoot 3s, spread the floor, and get to the line... but doesn't have his raw FG%. Do you truly believe that?

As for his fatal flaws, I think his court vision is crappy. Most notably evident by him averaging less assists per minute than a guy the Kings picked up off the waivers mid-season.

[RocketsMAN!]

BUMP
http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?t=221646

Sources say Houston has an offer of Lowry, the #14 and #16 picks for TyrekeEvans and the #5 pick on the table. Up to Sacramento to decide.

— Jonathan Givony (@DraftExpress) June 26, 2012