Our PF Need is more important

anitasri · 06-09-2006, 11:10 AM

It was painful watching the Rockets shoot in the latter part of the season. Let us not forget 2 contributors- DA, and Jon Barry did not pan out and Luther was in his Rookie year. D wes did his best in a conference where a SG and SF are physically becoming indistinguishable.

Even if we had no picks- we would have replacements for DA, Jon and David- so I am assuming in those 3 replacements we will find additional shooting we need. Plus having Tmac Back would make life easier for others. So the negative differential that we see this year will be settled.

The more practical issue- is that a quality PF would cost upwards of 6-8 Million. In our situation that is something we cannot really afford- not without a lot of wrangling and deal making.

If you noticed the on/court off court stats by position- and watched the games- Juwan is pretty much a liability and Stro for a host of reasons is not working out. Link below

http://www.82games.com/0506/0506HOU.HTM

This is one position on the team that we can have INSTANT Impact by getting in a decent PF- I could not care if it is a draft pick or certain old player who is presumed to be in the last year of his contract! My preference would be a draft pick- mainly because I am tired of injuries.

Again the suggestion that a PF is more crucial for us runs counter intuitive to what is anecdotal ( we need Shooting is the chorius!)- until you start looking at the numbers and appreciate the realities of the business.

Another area would be to have a decent back up at PG ( I would love an upgrade but that may have to wait unless a chance comes up with a trade)- If Sura were to get a Medical exemption, then I am confident we will resolve that issue. I prefer not to use a draft pick- especially a high draft pick.

IF we can achieve all this with the Picks we have and perhaps Stro ( and for that matter Luther)- and address the positions where the differentials will be in our favor- I think we will have an exciting season. ( Of course we do have the MLE and the other TE). Very Doable.

anitasri · 06-09-2006, 11:13 AM

And to add - we need to hold on to Chuck Hayes. This guy has great Presence and has a knack to get to the ball in traffic. Sure I wish he can shoot more consistently other than just garbage baskets. A 3 year deal with the Team holding the options would be decent incentive!

rockbox · 06-09-2006, 11:17 AM

How can anyone say that the 4 is our biggest need when we don't have a shooting guard besides Head nor do we have a PG that can shoot. If the playoffs have shown anything is that wing players are king.

HillBoy · 06-09-2006, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rockbox

How can anyone say that the 4 is our biggest need when we don't have a shooting guard besides Head nor do we have a PG that can shoot. If the playoffs have shown anything is that wing players are king.

Well, we also start a PF who can't shoot as well so does that mean that we win the Trifeca?

jopatmc · 06-09-2006, 11:33 AM

We can "improve" the PF position simply by getting rid of Juwan somehow. If all we had at the PF spot was Chuck Hayes and an NBDL reject we'd be better. If all we could get was Chuckie and some free agent that didn't get drafted like that Pops Mensa-Botha kid we'd be better off. At PF, it is simply addition by subtraction. Our primary need is not that we have to find a PF it's that we have to get rid of the worst fit at PF for our team in the whole league.

That is why I am in favor of moving him for Darius Miles (I think it is possible.) or Raef (Possible) or even Danny Fortson (doubt if Seattle would bite). Anything to get him out of here so JVG get move on to other players in his mind. I'll take a bad attitude player that rides the bench. Because what that essentially means is if Juwan is with us that he is riding the bench which would be a positive.

So, we don't need to make our #1 focus on acquiring a PF. Our #1 focus has to be on getting perimeter help, with ##2 being moving Juwan. #3 is acquiring a better PF. If we just accomplish 1 and 2, we are a seriously better team than last year.

gucci888 · 06-09-2006, 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by anitasri

Even if we had no picks- we would have replacements for DA, Jon and David- so I am assuming in those 3 replacements we will find additional shooting we need. Plus having Tmac Back would make life easier for others. So the negative differential that we see this year will be settled.

Who are the replacements you speak of?

anitasri · 06-09-2006, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gucci888

Who are the replacements you speak of?

Assuming we dont consider the draft- My pick for MLE ( plus some other consideration) would be Bonzi Wells for a Starting Role.

My fall back would be Matt Harpring at MLE.

These are the two who have experience and can do the starter role without a hich- and yes they can defend.

Bonzi may be a difficult proposition at MLE only- we may have to add something on top- but that guy will fit the role.

anitasri · 06-09-2006, 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jopatmc

We can "improve" the PF position simply by getting rid of Juwan somehow. If all we had at the PF spot was Chuck Hayes and an NBDL reject we'd be better. If all we could get was Chuckie and some free agent that didn't get drafted like that Pops Mensa-Botha kid we'd be better off. At PF, it is simply addition by subtraction. Our primary need is not that we have to find a PF it's that we have to get rid of the worst fit at PF for our team in the whole league.

That is why I am in favor of moving him for Darius Miles (I think it is possible.) or Raef (Possible) or even Danny Fortson (doubt if Seattle would bite). Anything to get him out of here so JVG get move on to other players in his mind. I'll take a bad attitude player that rides the bench. Because what that essentially means is if Juwan is with us that he is riding the bench which would be a positive.

So, we don't need to make our #1 focus on acquiring a PF. Our #1 focus has to be on getting perimeter help, with ##2 being moving Juwan. #3 is acquiring a better PF. If we just accomplish 1 and 2, we are a seriously better team than last year.

Agree 100% on Juwan- and if there is a way of Just sending him away that would atleast open a roster spot!

I think there are a couply of pacers that may also fit the role- and heck I will even take PJ Brown for a year if they trade him and JR for Juwan + a player ( not Rafer)

Finding Role player type Shooting Guards- is far more easier than a SG- anyway regardless we will replace Barry, Wesley and DA- it is just a natural progression- we gave up 3 shooters- and we take in 3 to replace them.
I am not really sure about Darius miles- I am sure there are other palatable options. ( I would try Zach Randolph though- heard he was street racing and got into trouble!)

anitasri · 06-09-2006, 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jopatmc

if Juwan is with us that he is riding the bench which would be a positive.

.

Well I am not so sure- JVG does some strange things- like giving Juwan extended minutes which runs counter to what the facts really are. People only look at his mid-range shooting- and forget that the oppostion exploits him on defense.

DaDakota · 06-09-2006, 11:59 AM

You know what, other coaches would not have hesitated to play Chuck Hayes more as he simply produced.......JVG is a fossil and needs to go before the Rockets are to take off.

DD

JuanValdez · 06-09-2006, 12:10 PM

The Juwan hate is getting a bit ridiculous (I can't believe I'm saying this, because I've wanted to get rid of him since he arived). How could losing a guy with nothing in return possibly be a positive? He's not some kind of lockerroom cancer. There is a way, btw, of sending him away to open a roster spot -- the Rockets can cut him. They obviously don't want to. He's not a great power forward, but he's adequate. In fact, the coach seems to think he works out better on the floor than Swift or Hayes. Hope you're not offended, by I'll trust his evaluation on that one. I'd like to have a PF who was better than all three of those guys, one that plays as well as he's paid and is not a drag on the Rockets' salary structure (something only Hayes accomplishes now). Hopefully, we'll get someone like that this offseason. That's the goal though, not getting rid of a starter for nothing in return.

jopatmc · 06-09-2006, 12:44 PM

No, he's not a lockerroom cancer. My impression is he is very professional in the way he goes about his business. He's a floor cancer. Juwan and Yao on the floor together is TERRIBLE. He's the worst possible fit for our big man because he is slow as Moses and his jumper range only goes out to 16 feet effectively. And any jumpers he hits, he more than gives back on the other end. It's not personal. It's all about what happens on the floor.

He needs to be traded because JVG keeps running him out there. Hopefully, our new GM, if he is the number cruncher we think he is, has already realized how terrible we are when Juwan lines up with Yao and how much better we are when anybody else is out there with Yao, including Rybo, Hayes, and Swift. I'd rather run those 3 out there at PF than Juwan. I'd rather give Lampe a shot and let him play 20 minutes with Yao to see what he's got than to see Juwan out there again with Yao. Lampe can't possibly be any worse than Juwan in the game. It just doesn't get any worse.

Chopped · 06-09-2006, 12:52 PM

PF biggest need? Stats say other wise.
http://www.82games.com/0506/0506HOU5.HTM

anitasri · 06-09-2006, 12:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chopped

PF biggest need? Stats say other wise.
http://www.82games.com/0506/0506HOU5.HTM

Take a look at the individual numbers and you will get the picture

http://www.82games.com/0506/0506HOU.HTM

Chopped · 06-09-2006, 01:09 PM

even with the individual numbers, Swift is higher than any of our current "shooting guards" (DW, LH, and KB)

baller4life315 · 06-09-2006, 01:12 PM

What do you do with Howard?

You have three options:

1. Trade him for somebody with an equally as bad contract and/or situation with their team.

2. Move him to the bench and try to make him some form of instant-offense in the frontcourt. Perhaps our version of Jerry Stackhouse in the "veterans former #1 option bringing offense off the bench towards the end of his career".

Its an option that doesn't appear likely at all since JVG has given no indication of having any form or trust in Swift. Swift could barely crack 15 minutes a night when the playoffs were out of reach, that really says something about his future with this team and i'd be surprised if Lampe ever played.

3. Bite the bullet and let him rot away on the bench making $6-7 million a year to do nothing. An option that doesn't appear to be very realistic considering JVG loves Howard so much. Also, if this were the case it would make even more sense just to flat-out cut him---again, another option that doesn't appear to be very plausible.

So where does this leave us? In my opinion, it looks like we're either stuck with him as our starter or we will go the route of option #1 and try to trade for players in similar situations.

Jopatmc mentioned some names you would have to consider if the other teams were willing to pull the trigger. Q-Rich is another name that comes to minds.

A deal I came up with for fun would be sending Howard back to Washington for Etan Thomas and Jarvis Hayes.

jopatmc · 06-09-2006, 01:45 PM

Nobody wants to listen but Juwan for Darius is probably the most doable type trade along with other pieces. I am scared to death Darius is going to wind up on some time like the Lakers that they acquire for a bunch of junk just because Portland is dumping him and then he is a nightmare for us to deal with in the playoffs because he has the length and athleticism to give McGrady fits.

I would bet you that McGrady would name Darius as one of the 2 or 3 defenders that give him the most trouble in the whole league. Darius is another Randy Moss/Terrell Owens/Latrell Sprewell/Dennis Rodman/Vernon Maxwell/Rasheed Wallace/Ron Artest type personalities that will just tear up a team if a team has weak leadership and poor management but could be turned into a difference maker on a championship team just as all those players were/are. I wouldn't want Darius as a #1 or #2 option. I wouldn't even want Darius for anything of value. But I would take Darius in a heartbeat in a deal giving up Juwan.

carolbmt · 06-09-2006, 02:16 PM

Our most obvious need is a SG who can make a shot. I say we keep stro' just because of his awesome put-back dunks. I love those.

A_3PO · 06-09-2006, 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jopatmc

No, he's not a lockerroom cancer. My impression is he is very professional in the way he goes about his business. He's a floor cancer. Juwan and Yao on the floor together is TERRIBLE. He's the worst possible fit for our big man because he is slow as Moses and his jumper range only goes out to 16 feet effectively. And any jumpers he hits, he more than gives back on the other end. It's not personal. It's all about what happens on the floor.

He needs to be traded because JVG keeps running him out there. Hopefully, our new GM, if he is the number cruncher we think he is, has already realized how terrible we are when Juwan lines up with Yao and how much better we are when anybody else is out there with Yao, including Rybo, Hayes, and Swift. I'd rather run those 3 out there at PF than Juwan. I'd rather give Lampe a shot and let him play 20 minutes with Yao to see what he's got than to see Juwan out there again with Yao. Lampe can't possibly be any worse than Juwan in the game. It just doesn't get any worse.

jopatmc, I usually just laugh at your vitriolic posts about JH. But your exaggerations about how he hurts the team are ridiculous. Lampe? Rybo? C'mon now. The fact JH continues to play is an indictment of Stro more than anything else. Hopefully both of them get rolled out of town but I actually wouldn't mind JH as a backup PF. His fumes could function for about 5-15 mins/game, depending how good our new starter is. JH is nothing close to a "floor cancer".

Since75 · 06-09-2006, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by baller4life315

What do you do with Howard?

You have three options:

1. Trade him for somebody with an equally as bad contract and/or situation with their team.

2. Move him to the bench and try to make him some form of instant-offense in the frontcourt. Perhaps our version of Jerry Stackhouse in the "veterans former #1 option bringing offense off the bench towards the end of his career".

Its an option that doesn't appear likely at all since JVG has given no indication of having any form or trust in Swift. Swift could barely crack 15 minutes a night when the playoffs were out of reach, that really says something about his future with this team and i'd be surprised if Lampe ever played.

3. Bite the bullet and let him rot away on the bench making $6-7 million a year to do nothing. An option that doesn't appear to be very realistic considering JVG loves Howard so much. Also, if this were the case it would make even more sense just to flat-out cut him---again, another option that doesn't appear to be very plausible.

So where does this leave us? In my opinion, it looks like we're either stuck with him as our starter or we will go the route of option #1 and try to trade for players in similar situations.

Jopatmc mentioned some names you would have to consider if the other teams were willing to pull the trigger. Q-Rich is another name that comes to minds.

A deal I came up with for fun would be sending Howard back to Washington for Etan Thomas and Jarvis Hayes.

How about we trade him to the Clippers in a sign and trade for Radmonavic? He is a 4 who can shoot and will provide the spacing Yao and Tmac need. You can't have a superstar at every position. To me he's perfect. Then address the swingmen needs in the draft. I believe N.O would trade PJ,Smith, 12 and 15 for Swift, Head and #8. In fact it works in realgm.

PJ's 8mil come off the books next year. Smith only has one year on his deal so if he bombs he's gone. He gives you size and athleticism at the 2. You can then have your choice of 2 of these guys. Brewer, Reddick, Foye,Carney.
Not to mention the early 2nd rd pick