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Testimony from a former U.S. Army Ranger: War Crimes and Atrocities in Iraq

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by CreepyFloyd, May 22, 2006.

  1. CreepyFloyd

    CreepyFloyd Member

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    A 20 min. interview with Jessie Macbeth, who has a stuttering problem and isn't the most articulate guy in the world, but extremely eye-opening nevertheless. I don't see the mainstream media interviewing this former soldier.

    Here's the video:

    http://multi-media.modernwriters.org/modules/smartmedia/clip.php?categoryid=1&folderid=5&clipid=47

    I also don't want to hear the apologists come out and say this is unfortunate, but happens in every war. What he describes is much more systematic and pervasive. He talks about official orders given to disregard the Geneva Conventions and to kill and target civilians intentionally (i.e. terrorism). What will happen to these people? Probably nothing.

    I guess "they" hate "us" for our "freedoms."
     
  2. HayesStreet

    HayesStreet Member

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    Sounds like individual unit actions. Unfortunate if true, but most of what he says is purely speculative with no substantiation. Mainstream media probably isn't using it because there's not anything other than his speculation about anything systemic.
     
  3. SamFisher

    SamFisher Member

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    yeah if only they'd been this exacting in 2002 and 2003...
     
  4. StupidMoniker

    StupidMoniker I lost a bet

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    It seems like if the guys claims where true, there would be thousands of Rangers talking about how when the first arrived in Kuwait their commanders told them that they were supposed to slaughter women and children. I am skeptical of the veracity of his claims (which are ironically on par with Clutchfans own MacBeth). In addition to what he is saying being hard to believe, the source is obviously and unabashadly biased.

    Emphasis mine.
     
  5. Buck Turgidson

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    The guy is most likely a complete fraud & never even served w/ the Rangers. Many details of his story - from his dress in pictures in his video, to the timeframe & location he was in theater, to the service awards & commendations he claimed - have been pretty convincingly taken apart by military blogs.

    That his last name is "Macbeth" should have clued us in.
     
  6. HayesStreet

    HayesStreet Member

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    Wow. The guy is a complete fake? Some of his story didn't add up for sure but that's pretty low even for the .org crowd.
     
  7. Buck Turgidson

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    Complete fake.

    “Initial research by the U.S. Army Special Operations Command at Fort Bragg shows no Soldier with the name of Jesse Macbeth having ever been assigned to the Special Forces or the Army Rangers — which are, in fact, two separate disciplines. This appears to be some sort of hoax. No Soldier by that name at Fort Lewis to our knowledge, in the past, either. Of course, the line about “go into the Army or go to jail” is vintage TV script not heard since the 1960s. There are also numerous wear and appearance issues with the Soldier’s uniform — a mix of foreign uniforms with the sleeves rolled up like a Marine and a badly floppy tan beret worn like a pastry chef. Of course, the allegations of war crimes are vague, as are the awards the Soldier allegedly received.” -- Army Spokesman John Boyce

    Pretty shocking to see this thread from someone who "only posts the truth".
     
  8. ima_drummer2k

    ima_drummer2k Member

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    LOL, this is pretty funny to read back now that this guy has been exposed to be (surprise) a total fraud.

    I wonder if CreepyFloyd will ever come back to this thread to explain himself. He seemed so sure of himself yesterday.
     
  9. giddyup

    giddyup Member

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    so did he or didn't he live with all those hot chicks in a teeming metropollis like Toronto? :D ... and date that p*rn star?
     
  10. giddyup

    giddyup Member

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    go look at the Lindsay Lohan/Paris Hilton thread... that's why they hate us... I can of hate us too when I watch something like that.
     
  11. RocketMan Tex

    RocketMan Tex Member

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    He lived in Keeyokuk Iowa and did date a p*rn star, but she did BBW snuff movies! :eek: :D
     
  12. cson

    cson Member

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    No apologies here. That's why people say "No War". If you say "Pro War" their blood is on your hands. Enjoy
     
  13. CreepyFloyd

    CreepyFloyd Member

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    If this is a 'hoax' like you claim (please provide a link to your quote) it's a pretty elaborate one:

    Here's another interview with Jessie Macbeth (http://www.socialistalternative.org/news/article13.php?id=261)
    He says he was in the 3rd Ranget Battalion in Iraq

    Another protest he was involved in:

    Halliburton On The Run Protest - Teach In / Press Event

    WED, MAY 17TH, 2006
    5:30pm-7:00pm
    Mayflower Congregational Church
    3901 NW 63rd Street
    Oklahoma City, OK 73116
    (OPEN TO THE PUBLIC)

    Event to discuss action taken at the
    HALLIBURTON ANNUAL SHAREHOLDERS MEETING
    (Several panelist will be attending the shareholders’ meeting)

    Special Guests:
    Pratap Chatterjee - CorpWatch
    Hart Viges - Iraq Veteran - IVAW
    Jesse MacBeth - Iraq Veteran - IVAW
    Alan Shackleton - Iraq Veteran - IVAW
    Jeri Reed - VFP - Mother of Iraq Veteran
    Maureen Haver - Houston Global Awareness
    Robert Guimaraes Vasquez - AIDESEP, Peru
    Michael Karikpo - Friends Of The Earth, Nigeria

    Source: http://crawfordpeace.nfshost.com/node/2477

    Yet another protests he was involved in:

    Editorial: Plantation serves discrimination

    Businesses have the right to refuse service to their customers; people who are drunk, yelling, belligerent, unclothed and so forth.

    But some businesses, like Coffee Plantation on Mill Avenue in downtown Tempe, take that right to the extreme, refusing to serve customers who they just don't like the looks of, a local activist group alleges.

    The Free to Camp Coalition protested Coffee Plantation's mistreatment and discrimination of the homeless and others on Saturday by handing out fake Coffee Plantation coupons for free discrimination, waving banners that read, "Coffee Plant. Won't Serve Homeless & Veterans," and chanting rhymes like, "Don't harass us, don't trespass us" and "Stop the war on the poor."

    A specific example of Coffee Plantation's refusal to serve gone haywire occurred in March when security escorted 20-year-old U.S. soldier Jesse MacBeth, who recently returned from the war in Iraq after he sustained a back injury, out of the coffee house.

    MacBeth bought a coffee and was quietly sipping from it when an employee approached him and asked him to leave.

    The coffee brewers apparently did not take to the way MacBeth was wearing his military training uniform.

    Even after he showed management his military ID card, security guards forced him to leave, threatening him with arrest if he returned.


    At the protest Saturday, MacBeth said he wanted to disrupt the business' flow of customers.

    "If you cut down the customers a lot, then they won't keep their business going," he said. "That's the whole point, to let society know what's going on."

    In response to the protest and Free to Camp's allegations, Coffee Plantation posted a sign on their window that says the business has the right to refuse customers who are "offensive in hygiene, language or behavior."

    Store owner Eric Spruce said the coalition's allegations are false.

    "It has nothing to do with [discrimination]," he said. "It's just a few people who we wouldn't allow to use our bathrooms [to bathe] and panhandle our customers. It's just overreacting."

    On the contrary, coffee man. The overreaction happened when MacBeth was thrown out and banned for not looking pretty in his fatigues.

    He was not bathing, yelling or behaving unlike any other customer behaves. He was simply wearing his uniform and drinking coffee.

    Last time we checked, the Tempe City Council hadn't yet outlawed those behaviors.

    Yes, Coffee Plantation has the right to refuse service to anyone, but choosing to exercise that right in excess is ridiculous.

    MacBeth just wanted a cup of the good stuff, not too much to ask for from a man who risked his life fighting on behalf of the country.

    Maybe we all should think twice before buying coffee from the old Plantation. If you still decide to go, make sure you wear your Gap pants and cologne.

    Source: http://www.asuwebdevil.com/issues/2004/04/12/opinions/657486

    Local activists protest Coffee Plantation
    Group alleges that new management discriminates

    The Free to Camp Coalition protested near Coffee Plantation on Mill Avenue to criticize the store for an alleged mistreatment of homeless people and others.

    For about an hour Saturday evening, more than 30 ASU students, activists and local residents marched up and down both sides of the downtown street.

    They handed out fliers and fake Coffee Plantation coupons for a free discrimination, waved hand-painted, fabric banners that read "Coffee Plant. Won't Serve Homeless & Veterans."

    The group also chanted rhymes like "Don't harass us, don't trespass us" and "Stop the war on the poor."

    Free to Camp's main complaint: Since Coffee Plantation came under new management in January, frequently it has refused service to homeless people and others based on physical attributes like appearance and hygiene.

    Eric Spruce, the store's new owner, said the charges are false.

    A statement posted on the store's windows in response to Free to Camp's allegations affirms the store's right to refuse business to those who are "offensive in hygiene, language or behavior."

    "It has nothing to do with [discrimination]," Spruce said. "It's just a few people who we wouldn't allow to use our bathrooms [to bathe] and panhandle our customers. It's just overreacting."

    Jesse MacBeth told another story.

    MacBeth, a 20-year-old U.S. soldier who recently returned from Iraq after sustaining a back injury, said Coffee Plantation banned him from the store in March for the way he was dressed -- in his training uniform.

    He had been sipping coffee calmly when a store employee asked him to leave. He refused.

    Management insisted that he leave even after he took out his military ID card. Security guards escorted him off the premises under threat of arrest if he returned.

    He said he hoped the protest would disrupt the flow of customers into the store.

    "If you cut down the customers a lot, then they won't keep their business going," MacBeth said. "That's the whole point, to let society know what's going on."

    Another protester, journalism freshman Andrew Socha, wasn't so sure the demonstration would be successful.

    "If anything is going to be effective, then people standing outside your store and yelling will hopefully get the message across," Socha said.

    Socha paused and looked inside the store, which was far from empty.

    "But a lot of times, people don't get the message no matter what you say," he said.

    As if to accentuate the point, fliers and coupons that had been distributed by the protesters and dropped by passersby skittered along the sidewalk in the cool breeze.

    One man quickly walked past the group and repeated, "Get a job. Get a job," while talking on his cell phone.

    Source: http://www.asuwebdevil.com/issues/2004/04/12/news/657497

    Here he is again:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    The gentleman in the photos with the hat and uniform on is identified as Jesse Macbeth and he is participating in the 3rd anniversary war in Iraq/Afghanistan procession march in Tacoma, WA. Iraq Veterans Against the War led the march, followed by Veterans for Peace followed by Military Families Speak Out, followed by faith communities, followed by Jobs with Justice labor unions, followed by other assorted peace and activitist coalitions of Tacoma, WA. Source: http://dyingwarriors.blogspot.com/

    The only inconsistency I've seen is that his name is spelled 'Jesse' sometimes and 'Jessie' at other times.
     
  14. glynch

    glynch Member

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    Well here is a Ranger story from my brother in law who lives in Houston and voted against Bush and the GOP for the first time in 2004 as he opposed the war in Iraq..

    The invasion of Panama. His 20th year in the military, mostly if not all in the Rangers. His commanding officer freaked and ordered him to waste some civilians in a hut they were serching. Brother in law went beserk drew his weapon on the officer and threatened to kill him if he didn't leave the **** immediately. Very tense. Later officer wrote him up for disobeying an order (not that one) and threatening an officer. His word versus the officer. Fortunately 20 years of service and good record, he had some support, so the whole thing was dropped. He retired shortly after the invasion which sickened him as he saw so many innocent civilians killed needlessly.
     
  15. wnes

    wnes Contributing Member

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    I don't know what to make of this Jesse Macbeth guy. Normally antiwar.com would pick up such story easily, but it has not done so. The guy looks a little too thin for the body type you'd expect from an Army Ranger.
     
  16. Master Baiter

    Master Baiter Member

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    What does this have to do with anything? It's two articles about a dude that lied about being in the military. Obviously he is just trying to get attention in any way possible. Do you know how easy it is for anyone to get a camo jacket? Just because he has one doesn't make him a veteran. I don't even understand what kind of argument you are trying to make?
     
  17. HayesStreet

    HayesStreet Member

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    There are so many problems with this guy's story that it would be laughable if it wasn't so despicable. When we start taking socialistalternative.org as proof of anything I think its pretty ridiculous - especially from someone who is well known to have claimed that he only read 'scholarly' journals and well respected books, lol.

    The Army has already stated he was never in the Ranger ranks.

    How was he in Fallujah in November 2004 when he was already 'out' of the military and protesting at an Arizona coffee house in April 2004 and then being indicted for credit card fraud (Summer 2004)?

    Jesse's criminal background during those dates

    The 3rd Ranger Battalion wasn't even in Iraq during the battle for Fallujah. The 3rd also didn't have a combat jump in Iraq.

    He claims to have both the Combat Action Badge and the Combat Infantry Badge - you can't have both if you have the CIB then you're not eligible for the CAB:

    http://www.tioh.hqda.pentagon.mil/Badges/CombatActionBadge.htm

    You don't go to Ranger School for 18 months.

    He claimed to have three stars on his jump wings - that's THREE combat jumps which is impossible for someone of his alleged tenure.

    [​IMG]

    He's wearing the wrong color t-shirt. His sleeves are rolled up like a Marine, not a Ranger. His nametag is on the wrong side of his uniform.

    The list goes on and on...

    Most likely he's another Micah Wright:

    http://www.micahwright.com/ranger.htm

    Actually I did find one guy claiming to have served with MacBeth. Here is his account:

    No S***, There I Was In Fallujah With Jesse MacBeth...(Updated) (2)
    ...in the Airborne Special Air Assault Ranger Forces Unit; The Screaming Beagles. We crept through the inky shadows to our target, the Coffee Plantation near Arizona State University. Once inside, my battle buddy and I mowed down nearly two dozen iced mocha lattes before slithering back through the quiet streets of Tempe, er.. Fallujah, leaving a trail of stench as we forgot we were lactose intolerant. The horror, the horror. We arrived just in time to roll our sleeves up with the insides showing and make sure our berets were lined up properly with the flash over our right eyes in preparation for our morning uniform inspection. Unfortunately, we were gigged as our pin-on rank had unknowingly fallen off during our mission. We were then sent home, unfit to remain with our elite fighting unit.

    And that is how we ended up working at a Wendy's in the Seattle area. No s***!
     
    #17 HayesStreet, May 23, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: May 23, 2006
  18. ima_drummer2k

    ima_drummer2k Member

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    They're not articles, they're blogs. Which of course means they're totally legit...
     
  19. StupidMoniker

    StupidMoniker I lost a bet

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    It isn't any harder for him to tell the same lie 4 times than it is to tell it one time. Where are all the other Rangers who were at the briefing where he was told to murder women and children in order to inspire fear in the Iraqis? Did all of the thousands of other Rangers in Iraq just think that order was hunky-dorey? Also, why would the Army say that he had never served as a Ranger, which should be something that could easily be refuted by Macbeth if he is telling the truth, instead of just denying the bad parts of his story, for which there would be much less evidence.
     
  20. StupidMoniker

    StupidMoniker I lost a bet

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    IVAW says that Macbeth is not a recognized spokesman for IVAW.
    Link
     

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