1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

Has Sony's silence regarding the PS3 become a problem?

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout' started by RC Cola, Feb 20, 2006.

  1. RC Cola

    RC Cola Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2002
    Messages:
    11,513
    Likes Received:
    1,367
    Despite the fact that I've wanted more PS3 info since TGS ended late last year, I never really had that much of a problem with Sony deciding to keep the full details to themselves. After all, there's no use in them showing all their cards early, especially if it might impact sales for the PSP and PS2. I thought that Sony would wait until just the right moment, and when that time came, they'd let us know more about the PS3, possibly in blowout fashion (ala E3). Despite others being disappointed at the lack of new info during the holidays (when the 360 launched), during CES (where Sony had the largest area on the floor), and even during smaller events like the Taipei Game Show and ISSCC (where Ken Kutaragi talked about Cell and games in general), I never really cared too much when Sony remained silent.

    However, we're now about a month away from the official start of Spring, and there still isn't much known about the PS3. The rumored "PLAYSTATION Conference" that was to take place on the "eve" of the PS3 launch during this month seems to have been put on hold, if not cancelled outright (unless, of course, they somehow announce and have the show in about a week's time). To make matters worse, a recent report from Merril Lynch has been picked up by the mainstream news (USA Today, MSNBC, CNET, Financial Times, etc.) and is currently one of the top articles at Google News (the top under the Sci/Tech section) with about 300 articles reporting about a possible (or probable as the articles suggest) delay. Now, Sony has sinced denied the reports, and probably rightfully so considering the amount of effort that went into anaylzing the costs for the PS3, but that didn't stop their stock from dropping due to the report.

    Now, I'm going to assume that the ML report about Sony possibly delaying the console due to costs concerns was nothing but BS simply because...well, their analysis seemed like BS.* If that were the case and Sony can produce the PS3 "anytime," then obviously there might be a bit of a problem going on. A spokesperson from SCEI can deny these reports and point to the same "Spring 2006" announcement Sony made at E3, but it seems like that won't stop people from speculating on a delay or an insane price tag. After all, even though I personally have no issues with tech demos and realtime footage, it is true that Sony has yet to show anything really playable (outside of a few titles) on a "real" PS3. Then there's the rumors about the controller as well, which apparently no one besides the SCEI CEO, Ken Kutaragi, has laid a hand on. Whether they like it or not, Sony may have a little extra persuasion to release new info on the PS3 ASAP.

    So as the thread title says, is this silence becoming a problem? Are there now doubts in your mind that weren't previously there thanks to numerous rumors about a delay and/or other areas of concern?

    Personally, I'm somewhat split on the issue. Up until recently, I didn't really care that much, but I really expected for Sony to start letting the air out of the balloon this month, which has yet to happen with about 8 days left to go. For others, when they see sources like the USA Today and the Financial Times mention a 2007 launch and a $800-$900 cost for making the PS3, all of a sudden the Xbox 360 starts looking much more appealing (especially with the killer March it has lined up). I'm not sure what is going to happen, but with the Spring season coming up quickly (which includes GDC and E3), I don't think Sony can keep silent for much longer.


    *I think we can all agree that, if the reports of a delay to 2007 were true, then Sony would probably be in big trouble. I won't get into all of it, but obviously some people would be pissed, including possibly developers, publishers and even movie studios planning on having a few extra million Blu-ray players out this year. I'm not necessarily ruling out a delay, but I'm simplifying the situation by assuming it to be false, especially with Sony continuing to say "Spring 2006."
     
  2. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Member

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2001
    Messages:
    45,954
    Likes Received:
    28,051
    I think the camps are fairly entrenched so if people who have 350 bones to fork over haven't bought the 360 yet, they're probably in it to get the PS3...

    As for the Merril Lynch article, it might help Sony later when the specs say the same but the retail price is much much lower than expected.
     
  3. Xenochimera

    Xenochimera Member

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2005
    Messages:
    1,929
    Likes Received:
    25
    they just dont want a 360 to happen to them, you know not enough units so i guess they are just thinking of the most efficient way to supply gamers.
     
  4. CriscoKidd

    CriscoKidd Member

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 1999
    Messages:
    9,303
    Likes Received:
    546
    yeah, because sony is really good at keeping supply high with new hardware. :D

    I'll be skeptical of Sony til I see a price tag and the games for it.
     
  5. RC Cola

    RC Cola Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2002
    Messages:
    11,513
    Likes Received:
    1,367
    True. In fact, I probably would have said the same things not so long ago.

    Still, I just wonder if those that were on the fence may now consider the 360 as a strong choice, especially when they see Fight Night 3, GRAW, Oblivion, etc. (including improving supply), while on the other hand, they're seeing Merrill Lynch and sources like the USA Today state that the PS3 might see a 6-12 month delay due to production costs exceeding $800. I mean, if Sony did more than just deny those reports (IE: show some playable games, give more info on online service/RSX, info on release schedule, etc.), then that would probably be pretty huge in a way, especially hot off the heels of reports suggesting otherwise. But if they continue to keep things secret, I just don't know how much more hype they can create by doing so. There have been reports by analysts suggesting a high price tag and/or a delay for a while now; what use is there in allowing for yet another round of "No PS3 till late 2007 due to $1600 production costs" articles? Just seems like there's really no way to really increase hype, but they might end up losing some possible customers to this, not to mention having their stock drop.

    Of course, I realize I'm overreacting a bit. Despite nothing happening in the last few months, I still feel as though Sony will release some new info soon (either by their own schedule or due to the recent bad press). I guess I'm just getting tired of seeing the same old analyst predictions based on absolutely nothing, especially when Sony could easily just end all that now...which happens to be a time period where Sony could probably benefit from doing so (after holidays, so PS2/PSP sales aren't as badly affect, plus they can possible take some attention away from the 360).

    Well, I'm not necessarily asking should Sony launch the PS3 tomorrow worldwide, with 5-10 million units. I was just wondering if maybe it was about time to start letting the air out of the balloon.

    Personally, I think a Spring (June-esque) launch in Japan and a Fall launch in the US should do OK for Sony when it comes to supply. IBM is apparently ramping up yields of Cell "faster than on any chip" they've done, and it sounds like it might have better yields, relatively speaking, than the Xenon CPU in the 360. RSX, if "just" a G70 (though I think that's been debunked IIRC), shouldn't be very complex to make either, at worst probably around the same as Xenos. The thing that might limit supply would probably be the Blu-ray drives, or possibly the laser diodes to be more specific. Still, hopefully they won't have to worry as much about supply as MS has had to, although that could still be a problem depending on exactly how crazy the demand is. Either way though, they can still ease up a bit on the secrets and still plan out when (and where?) to launch the PS3.

    The PSP had great supply, at least in the US. Think it had shortages in the UK and possibly the Japanese launch. But yeah, I'm sure we won't be seeing too many PS3's on the shelves at launch...unless it priced at $700, but still loses $100-$200 per console. :D



    So yeah, this thread was partly me ranting about all these rumors based on very little evidence (yet becoming mainstream news), and partly me wondering how others felt about Sony continuing to withhold information.
     
  6. Faos

    Faos Member

    Joined:
    May 31, 2003
    Messages:
    15,370
    Likes Received:
    53
    Sony PS3 delays, cost hurt stock

    By Yukari Iwatani Kane, Reuters

    TOKYO — Sony's (SNE) stock plunged in Tokyo Monday after the company said the launch of its next-generation PlayStation 3 video game console could be delayed if industry specifications for some of its technology are not final soon.

    But it is still aiming for a spring rollout, Sony said.

    The launch of PlayStation 3 (PS3) has been the subject of heavy speculation in the industry. Expectations are high for the powerful machine, which will feature cutting-edge technology in its DVD player, processors and graphics.

    PS3 will compete with Microsoft's (MSFT) Xbox 360, which went on sale last November, and Nintendo's (NTDOY) Revolution, expected later this year.

    "We're aiming for spring, but we haven't announced specific regions," a spokeswoman for Sony Computer Entertainment said, adding that it is waiting for final specifications on some of the technology it is using in the PS3, such as that related to the Blu-ray DVD drive and to input and output video and sound.

    The specs are decided by industry consortiums.

    "We're waiting for them until the last possible minute, but the launch could be pushed back if they're not decided soon," the spokeswoman said. If the PS3 is not ready in time, the company will choose the next best timing for the launch, she said.

    Sony has been promising a spring launch but has been deliberately vague about exactly when that would be. Analysts have said it could mean anytime between March and the end of Japan's rainy season in June.

    Sony's shares fell as much as 4.4% on Monday after Merrill Lynch said in a research note last week that the PS3's launch might be delayed six to 12 months and the cost of production could initially approach $900 per unit.

    The shares closed down 3.6% at 5,300 yen, underperforming the Tokyo stock market's electrical machinery index IELEC, which fell 1.85%.

    Manufacturers typically sell new game consoles at a loss initially to gain market share so they can later make money selling software — a $25 billion global market.

    But the higher-than-expected cost estimate by Merrill means Sony would have to take a much larger loss on each PS3 unit it sells or sacrifice market share to Microsoft, which is selling its Xbox 360 for about $400.

    Sony currently has about 70% of the global market for game consoles, but some analysts have said it could lose as much as 20 percentage points to Microsoft, which is making an aggressive push to increase its 15% share.

    Nintendo, which also has a 15% market share, is taking a different strategy as it aims to increase the number of game players with a unique console and original games.

    Merrill Lynch also downgraded its rating on Sony to "sell" from "neutral", saying in its note that Sony could see its earnings decline.

    Most analysts took the report in stride as they already expected Sony to launch the PS3 this summer in Japan, followed by a U.S. launch before the Thanksgiving holiday in November. They expect a launch in Europe in early 2007.

    "No one is seriously thinking a spring release is realistic any more," said Hiroshi Kamide, an analyst at KBC Securities. "If I were Sony, I wouldn't be that worried about releasing as soon as I possibly could."

    Kamide said Sony may wait until it is fully prepared, especially after seeing slow initial sales of Microsoft's Xbox 360 even though it was launched in time for the holidays.

    Having led the worldwide console gaming market for the last decade, Sony is counting on the new machine to dominate in all aspects of networked home entertainment — games, movies, music and more.

    Yuta Sakurai, a senior analyst at Nomura Securities, says the price of the PS3 is more important than its timing.

    "I don't think it matters when Sony launches in the U.S. as long as it's in time for Christmas," Sakurai said. He expects Sony to try to launch the PS3 in Japan in early summer, in time for the big selling season when schools go on holiday in July.

    Sakurai estimated that Sony could charge at most 50,000 yen ($420) for the console.

    Retail price estimates by analysts in Japan vary widely from about 40,000 yen ($338) to several times that much, primarily because of all of the technology packed into the machine, which is expected to be the size of a laptop computer.

    The PS3, which can be played simultaneously by up to seven people, will be powered by the "Cell" chip, which is significantly more powerful than Intel's Pentium 4, the most common chip for today's PCs and existing game machine processors.

    It will also feature a super-powerful graphics chip, a built-in Ethernet port for high-speed Internet access, and Blu-ray, a next-generation DVD format backed by Sony.

    Analysts generally agree that Sony will do whatever it can to avoid missing the key year-end holiday season this year, but many believe it will be unable to make the PS3 in great volumes.

    Game development for the PS3 is also seen being delayed because the technology specifications have not been finalised.

    "Game makers are developing games according to their guesses on what the final specifications might be," said Takeshi Tajima, a BNP Paribas analyst.


    http://www.usatoday.com/tech/gaming/2006-02-20-sony-ps3_x.htm
     
  7. rrj_gamz

    rrj_gamz Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2002
    Messages:
    15,595
    Likes Received:
    198
    I saw something like this yesterday...

    PS3 article

    Pretty much the same thing usatoday says...
     
  8. UTweezer

    UTweezer Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2002
    Messages:
    3,888
    Likes Received:
    41
    pretty safe to assume it's not coming out until at least the '06 holidays, but hopefully sooner. You'd think they would start the hype machine (pre-ordering) by now, seeing as it's only a few weeks away from spring time. I've read that the manufacturing costs may average around $800 per machine?! So to keep that $150-$200 loss per unit range...we could potentially be looking at a $500-$649 console, until manufacturing process is refined...

    where are the 360's when you need them?!
     
  9. underoverup

    underoverup Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2003
    Messages:
    3,208
    Likes Received:
    75
    i would never buy one of the first ps3's i bet they have a lot of bugs
     
  10. tinman

    tinman 999999999
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 1999
    Messages:
    104,490
    Likes Received:
    47,415
    one reason to buy PS3s at launch:
    EBAY
     
  11. tinman

    tinman 999999999
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 1999
    Messages:
    104,490
    Likes Received:
    47,415
    look in march when they mysteriously will have a bunch of them out.

    get call of duty 2, that game is awesome!
     
  12. RC Cola

    RC Cola Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2002
    Messages:
    11,513
    Likes Received:
    1,367
    Well, I've been leaning towards a Fall 06 US release anyway, so the 06 holidays wouldn't be too different. Prior to this month, I believe they had been following the PS2 schedule almost to a T (little-to-no info prior to February, then a Feb show, then a Japanese release the first week of March). Again, they might surprise me in the next few days, but I'm starting to doubt anything new will be revealed this month.

    As for hyping up the PS3, the media has already hyped it up quite a bit, so the marketing team at Sony doesn't really have to do much to create hype for the PS3. They might have to shoot down some rumors though, which is one of my concerns. I know they'll have something at E3 (that would make MS "bring their diapers"), but I don't know if they should wait that long to release anything of importance about the PS3.

    BTW, as I said earlier, the whole $800-$900 per machine thing is BS IMO. Heck, I'm still trying to figure out how the PS3 could come out 6-12 months later than the 360, cost like ~2 times more to make (and probably using better cost-reducing strategies), yet still not offer much more than the 360 (IE: PS3 only marginally more powerful or something like that). According to Merrill Lynch, there would be about a $600 difference between the 360 at launch and the PS3 at launch. Even worse, ML seems to think it will take 3 years before Sony could match the 360's production costs (~$340 according to them IIRC). So yeah, I don't put much faith in ML anymore.

    You heard it here first: due to high production costs, the PS3 has been delayed to 2009... the same year the Dreamcast gets relaunched. :)
     
    #12 RC Cola, Feb 21, 2006
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2006
  13. wakkoman

    wakkoman Member

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2003
    Messages:
    2,935
    Likes Received:
    80
  14. hotballa

    hotballa Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2002
    Messages:
    12,521
    Likes Received:
    316
    my belief is that the ML anaylst is clearly smoking crack.

    that said, honestly with the sales of the PS2 and PSP staying strong and atop the charts or close to it, maybe Sony doesn't feel as bad about the bottom line.
     
  15. UTweezer

    UTweezer Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2002
    Messages:
    3,888
    Likes Received:
    41
    i wish sega would release another console.
     

Share This Page