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Teens define sex in new ways (or Just Say Blow!)

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout' started by No Worries, Oct 25, 2005.

  1. No Worries

    No Worries Member

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    Couple of months while waiting to get my haircut, I noticed a Seventeen magazine with an article about 'hooking up'. Well, seeing as I am old fart and had no idea what 'hooking up' meant, I read the article. It was a real eye opener. Teens nowadays appear to do 'one off encounters' but not go *all the way*.

    I had twothoughts. First thought was if I had a seventeen year old daughter I sure would not want her to be reading this magazine ;) Second was that teenage boys nowadays are so effing lucky.

    Last week, I saw a related article in USA Today while getting groceries. And here it is:

    Teens define sex in new ways
    Posted 10/19/2005 12:17 AM Updated 10/19/2005 3:40 AM
    By Sharon Jayson, USA TODAY
    The generational divide between baby-boomer parents and their teenage offspring is sharpening over sex.

    Oral sex, that is.

    More than half of 15- to 19-year-olds are doing it, according to a groundbreaking study by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

    The researchers did not ask about the circumstances in which oral sex occurred, but the report does provide the first federal data that offer a peek into the sex lives of American teenagers.

    To adults, "oral sex is extremely intimate, and to some of these young people, apparently it isn't as much," says Sarah Brown, director of the National Campaign to Prevent Teen Pregnancy.

    "What we're learning here is that adolescents are redefining what is intimate."

    Among teens, oral sex is often viewed so casually that it needn't even occur within the confines of a relationship. Some teens say it can take place at parties, possibly with multiple partners. But they say the more likely scenario is oral sex within an existing relationship. (Related story: "Technical virginity" becomes part of teens' equation)

    Still, some experts are increasingly worrying that a generation that approaches intimate behavior so casually might have difficulty forming healthy intimate relationships later on.

    "My parents' generation sort of viewed oral sex as something almost greater than sex. Like once you've had sex, something more intimate is oral sex," says Carly Donnelly, 17, a high school senior from Cockeysville, Md.

    "Now that some kids are using oral sex as something that's more casual, it's shocking to (parents)."

    David Walsh, a psychologist and author of the teen-behavior book Why Do They Act That Way?, says the brain is wired to develop intense physical and emotional attraction during the teenage years as part of the maturing process. But he's disturbed by the casual way sex is often portrayed in the media, which he says gives teens a distorted view of true intimacy.

    Sex — even oral sex — "just becomes kind of a recreational activity that is separate from a close, personal relationship," he says.

    "When the physical part of the relationship races ahead of everything else, it can almost become the focus of the relationship," Walsh says, "and they're not then developing all of the really important skills like trust and communication and all those things that are the key ingredients for a healthy, long-lasting relationship."

    "Intimacy has been so devalued," says Doris Fuller of Sandpoint, Idaho, who, with her two teenage children, wrote the 2004 book Promise You Won't Freak Out, which discusses topics such as teen oral sex.

    "What will the impact be on their ultimately more lasting relationships? I don't think we know yet."

    Casual attitude is worrying

    Child psychology professor W. Andrew Collins of the University of Minnesota says a relationship "that's only about sex is not a high-quality relationship."

    In a 28-year study, Collins and his colleagues followed 180 individuals from birth. His yet-to-be-published research, presented at a conference in April, suggests that emotionally fulfilling high school relationships do help teens learn important relationship skills.

    The researchers did not specifically ask about oral sex, he says. But relationships that are focused more on sex tend to be "less sustained, often not monogamous and with lower levels of satisfaction."

    Terri Fisher, an associate professor of psychology at Ohio State University, says oral sex used to be considered "exotic." After the sexual revolution of the 1960s, it was viewed as a more intimate sexual act than sexual intercourse, but now, in young people's minds, it's "a more casual act."

    Beyond shock, many parents aren't sure what to think when they discover their children's nonchalant approach to oral sex.

    "It doesn't cross your mind because it's not something you have done," Fuller says. "Most parents weren't doing this (as teenagers) in the way these kids are."

    But if parents are looking for reasons to freak out, the health risk of oral sex apparently isn't one of them. Teenagers and experts agree that oral sex is less risky than intercourse because there's no threat of pregnancy and less chance of contracting a sexually transmitted disease or HIV.

    "The fact that teenagers have oral sex doesn't upset me much from a public health perspective," says J. Dennis Fortenberry, a physician who specializes in adolescent medicine at the Indiana University School of Medicine.

    "From my perspective, relatively few teenagers only have oral sex. And so for the most part, oral sex, as for adults, is typically incorporated into a pattern of sexual behaviors that may vary depending upon the type of relationship and the timing of a relationship."

    Data don't tell whole story

    A study published in the journal Pediatrics in April supports the view that adolescents believe oral sex is safer than intercourse, with less risk to their physical and emotional health.

    The study of ethnically diverse high school freshmen from California found that almost 20% had tried oral sex, compared with 13.5% who said they had intercourse.

    More of these teens believed oral sex was more acceptable for their age group than intercourse, even if the partners are not dating.

    "The problem with surveys is they don't tell you the intimacy sequence," Brown says. "The vast majority who had intercourse also had oral sex. We don't know which came first."

    The federal study, based on data collected in 2002 and released last month, found that 55% of 15- to 19-year-old boys and 54% of girls reported getting or giving oral sex, compared with 49% of boys and 53% of girls the same ages who reported having had intercourse.

    Though the study provides data, researchers say, it doesn't help them understand the role oral sex plays in the overall relationship; nor does it explain the fact that today's teens are changing the sequence of sexual behaviors so that oral sex has skipped ahead of intercourse.

    "All of us in the field are still trying to get a handle on how much of this is going on and trying to understand it from a young person's point of view," says Stephanie Sanders, associate director of The Kinsey Institute for Research in Sex, Gender and Reproduction at Indiana University, which investigates sexual behavior and sexual health.

    "Clearly, we need more information about what young people think is appropriate behavior, under what circumstances and with whom," Sanders says. "Now we know a little more about what they're doing but not what they're thinking."

    The $16 million study, which took six years to develop, complete and analyze, surveyed almost 13,000 teens, men and women ages 15-44 on a variety of sexual behaviors.

    Researchers say that the large sample size, an increased societal openness about sexual issues and the fact that the survey was administered via headphones and computer instead of face to face all give them confidence that, for the first time, they have truthful data on these very personal behaviors.

    "There is strong evidence that people are more willing to tell computers things, such as divulge taboo behaviors, than (they are to tell) a person," Sanders says.

    More analysis needed

    Researchers cannot conclude that the percentage of teens having oral sex is greater than in the past. There is no comparison data for girls, and numbers for boys are about the same as they were a decade ago in the National Survey of Adolescent Males: Currently, 38.8% have given oral sex vs. 38.6% in 1995; 51.5% have received it vs. 49.4% in 1995.

    Further analyses of the federal data by the private, non-profit National Campaign to Prevent Teen Pregnancy and the non-partisan research group Child Trends find almost 25% of teens who say they are virgins have had oral sex. Child Trends also reviewed socioeconomic and other data and found that those who are white and from middle- and upper-income families with higher levels of education are more likely to have oral sex.

    Historically, oral sex has been more common among the more highly educated, Sanders says.

    Is intimacy imperiled?

    The survey also found that almost 90% of teens who have had sexual intercourse also had oral sex. Among adults 25-44, 90% of men and 88% of women have had heterosexual oral sex.

    "If we are indeed headed as a culture to have a total disconnect between intimate sexual behavior and emotional connection, we're not forming the basis for healthy adult relationships," says James Wagoner, president of Advocates for Youth, a reproductive-health organization in Washington.

    Oral sex might affect teenagers' self-esteem most of all, says Paul Coleman, a Poughkeepsie, N.Y., psychologist and author of The Complete Idiot's Guide to Intimacy.

    "Somebody is going to feel hurt or abused or manipulated," he says. "Not all encounters will turn out favorably. ... Teenagers are not mature enough to know all the ramifications of what they're doing.

    "It's pretending to say it's just sexual and nothing else. That's an arbitrary slicing up of the intimacy pie. It's not healthy."

    A survey of more than 1,000 teens conducted with the National Campaign to Prevent Teen Pregnancy resulted in The Real Truth About Teens & Sex, a book by Sabrina Weill, a former editor in chief at Seventeen magazine. She says casual teen attitudes toward sex — particularly oral sex — reflect their confusion about what is normal behavior. She believes teens are facing an intimacy crisis that could haunt them in future relationships.

    "When teenagers fool around before they're ready or have a very casual attitude toward sex, they proceed toward adulthood with a lack of understanding about intimacy," Weill says. "What it means to be intimate is not clearly spelled out for young people by their parents and people they trust."

    Although governmental and educational campaigns urge teens to delay sex, some suggest teens have replaced sexual intercourse with oral sex.

    "If you say to teenagers 'no sex before marriage,' they may interpret that in a variety of ways," says Fisher.

    Talk is crucial

    Experts say parents need to talk to their kids about sex sooner rather than later. Oral sex needs to be part of the discussion because these teens are growing up in a far more sexually open society.

    Anecdotal reports for years have focused on teens "hooking up" casually. Depending on the group, teens say it can mean kissing, making out or having sex.

    "Friends with benefits" is another way of referring to non-dating relationships, with a form of sex as a "benefit."

    But not all teens treat sex so casually, say teens from suburban Baltimore who were interviewed by USA TODAY as part of an informal focus group.

    Alex Trazkovich, 17, a high school senior from Reisterstown, Md., says parents don't hear enough about teen relationships where there is a lot of emotional involvement.

    "They hear about teens going to the parties and having lots and lots of sex," he says. "It happens, but it's not something that happens all the time. It's more of an extreme behavior."


    And here is the companion piece :

    'Technical virginity' becomes part of teens' equation
    Posted 10/19/2005 12:44 AM
    By Sharon Jayson, USA TODAY
    Ten years after Bill Clinton and Monica Lewinsky's relationship made oral sex a mainstream topic, there's still plenty of debate over whether oral sex is really sex.

    "There's not only confusion; there's fighting over it," says J. Dennis Fortenberry, a physician who specializes in adolescent medicine at the Indiana University School of Medicine. "People disagree fairly vehemently."

    The latest fuss is spurred by new federal data that found that more than half of 15- to 19-year-olds have received or given oral sex. Although the study by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention did not ask the particulars of these encounters, research conducted in pre-Clinton times, along with more recent studies, suggests that teens largely fall on the "it's not sex" side. (Related story: Teens define sex in new ways)

    "Some adults say it is a form of sex, but kids don't really see it that way," says Natalie Fuller, 19, a sophomore at Orange Coast College in Costa Mesa, Calif.

    "For most teens, the only form of sex is penetration, and anything else doesn't count. You can have oral sex and be a virgin."

    Fuller was 16 when she, her brother and her mother co-wrote the book Promise You Won't Freak Out, which includes discussion of teen oral sex.

    The report released last month by the CDC shows that one-quarter of teens who have not had intercourse have had oral sex. The survey questions, administered via headphones and computer for maximum anonymity, clearly defined the actions to eliminate any ambiguity about the meaning of the term "oral sex."

    "The implications are that teens who define themselves as abstinent may be engaging in oral sex," says Jennifer Manlove, a senior research associate with the non-profit group Child Trends, which analyzed the federal data.

    Kyle Tarver, 17, a high school senior from Pikesville, Md., who was among an informal USA TODAY focus group of Maryland teenagers, says most teens who have had oral sex think of themselves as virgins.

    "If you were to ask someone if they were a virgin, they wouldn't include that they had given or gotten oral sex," he says.

    A study published in 1999 in the Journal of the American Medical Association examines the definition of sex based on a 1991 random sample of 599 college students from 29 states. Sixty percent said oral-genital contact did not constitute having sex. "That's the 'technical virginity' thing that's going on," says Stephanie Sanders, associate director of the Kinsey Institute for Research in Sex, Gender, and Reproduction at Indiana University and co-author of the study, which the researchers titled "Would You Say You 'Had Sex' If ...?"

    "There is not nearly as much conversation between two people and as much thought put into engaging in oral sex. That, in my mind, makes it a lot different," says Michael Levy, 17, a senior from Owings Mills, Md.

    What constitutes sex tends to be defined in a culture and varies with the times, Fortenberry says.

    "In certain times in the history of the world, certain kinds of kissing would be considered sex," he says. "Not too many years ago, a woman would have been considered a 'loose woman' if she kissed a person before marriage."

    But a new book from the Medical Institute for Sexual Health, an Austin-based non-profit that has worked for abstinence education with the Bush administration, doesn't waffle. In Questions Kids Ask About Sex, oral sex is clearly sex.

    "Sex occurs when one person touches another person's genitals and causes that person to get sexually excited," the book states. "A girl or boy who's had oral sex doesn't feel or think like a virgin anymore, because he or she has had a form of sex."

    Melissa Cox, who edited and contributed to the book, is a Denver-based medical writer who also edited a publication for Focus on the Family, an organization devoted to Christian family values.

    She says a medical panel for the institute determined that oral sex is sex because it places young people at risk for sexually transmitted diseases and infections, puts them at risk for long-term emotional harm and opens the door for other sexual activity.

    Not everyone agrees.

    "If you look at the information that they have, you might find it difficult to cite a basis for that, other than someone's opinion," says adolescent-medicine specialist Fortenberry.

    Teenagers say messages from the media make them feel that casual oral sex is normal and suggest that all teens are preoccupied with sex.

    "I feel like I see more commercials about casual sex than I do about how important it is to have a family and how important it is to be in a marriage instead of having sex with people from a bar," says Shanae Sheppard, a 17-year-old senior from Owings Mills, Md.

    Last week, the federal government announced $37 million in awards to 63 programs across the country aimed at encouraging young people to abstain from intercourse until marriage.

    But abstinence-only education may inadvertently reinforce the belief that oral sex isn't real sex, says John DeLamater, a sociology professor at the University of Wisconsin and editor of the Journal of Sex Research, a scholarly journal published by the Society for the Scientific Study of Sexuality.

    "We should be sending a message that sexual activity is much broader," he says.

    Because teens are focused on that narrow definition of sexual intercourse and the message is to postpone it until they are older, they tend to equate intercourse with adulthood, Tarver says.

    "Oral sex is not on a pedestal the way that regular sexual intercourse is," he says.
     
  2. Faos

    Faos Member

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    I read that the other day and wondered where those gals were when I went to high school 20 years ago. :(
     
  3. No Worries

    No Worries Member

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    Do the math ;)
     
  4. RocketMan Tex

    RocketMan Tex Member

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    They were there. They just didn't hang out with the geeks in the chess club.

    They hung out with the dudes that played in the band that did the 25 minute version of "Smoke on the Water" at the freshman dance.

    :D
     
  5. Pole

    Pole Houston Rockets--Tilman Fertitta's latest mess.

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    I did not have sexual relations with that woman. Perception is reality...........perhaps he was telling the truth.
     
  6. Jeff

    Jeff Clutch Crew

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    This is a classic example of how sexuality is so distorted in our society. It is either to be feared and hated or over-glamourized and worshipped.

    It's like it is either Jerry Springer or Pat Robertson. There is no in between.
     
  7. JayZ750

    JayZ750 Member

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    This may be addressed in the articles (I only skimmed), but I assume for the most part we are talking about oral sex being given by the girls and received by the boys, no?
     
  8. Summer Song Giver

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    Nothings changed much, I first "hooked up" in ninth grade after a first date in the back of her friends car with her friend driving, looking back the only thing I should have done differently was somehow get the friend involved.
     
  9. the futants

    the futants Member

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    i've often wondered why Terry Gilliam hasn't made a movie out of Aldous Huxley's Brave New World.

    seriously...
     
  10. dskillz

    dskillz Member

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    There was an article in the Chronicle like 3 or 4 years ago about teens going to movies, sitting in the back and the girls giving oral sex to their dates. From what the theater manager was saying it was an epidemic or something. The manager was more concerned with the cleanup after the fact than the fact that it was going on there.

    Now that I look back on high school days, there were a ton of freaks at school. Maybe this isn't as widespread as the article suggests.
     
  11. Faos

    Faos Member

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    Memo to self: apply for part time position as theatre projectionist.
     
  12. rrj_gamz

    rrj_gamz Member

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    Where were these chicks 15 years ago...Hell, does that mean I can date younger woman and as they mature, a casual blow is easy as pie...
     
  13. Rocketman95

    Rocketman95 Hangout Boy

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    In the back row with me. Dances With Wolves is the greatest movie of all-time. :D
     
  14. Franchise3

    Franchise3 Member

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    As a college aged young man, I can attest first-hand that these stories are true. I can honestly say that I could go out almost any night to a party, strike up some conversation with some young lady, and get a blowjob if I wanted.

    I can't count the number of times I've heard people say:
    "Did you hook up?"
    and the reply: "Yeah, but she only gave me a blowjob."

    You may think this is a good thing (and I guess it is to some degree) that someone my age can go out and get oral sex just about any night of the week, but I certaintly couldn't tell you where to find a nice girl that you would want to take out on a date.
     
  15. No Worries

    No Worries Member

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    This is so not fair.
     
  16. the futants

    the futants Member

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    touche...
     
  17. Two Sandwiches

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    Sometimes I do feel like I'm one of the only kids my age that does things the old fashioned way...
     
  18. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Member

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    I don't think the worries of intimacy will make the future divorce rate get any higher than it is now. Perhaps the formation of a 5 year bond will lower it...

    Whether sex is that casual or not, people will feel lonelier eventually and get their **** straight or have a lot of drunk stories.

    After all, the median age for generation Y'ers staying at home is 25. They're living it up because they see the long road ahead.

    My two cents....
     
  19. ROCKSS

    ROCKSS Member
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    The $16 million study, which took six years to develop, complete and analyze, surveyed almost 13,000 teens, men and women ages 15-44 on a variety of sexual behaviors.

    16 Million dollars for this......A bit silly if you ask me.
     
  20. Xerobull

    Xerobull ...and I'm all out of bubblegum
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    ...Up next, casual anal sex.
     

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