Syria

[da1]

Originally Posted by AroundTheWorld At this point, you are nothing but an idiot.

Reported

[FranchiseBlade]

Originally Posted by AroundTheWorld This is from Al-Arabiya and was reprinted in the Huffington Post. So it is not from some right-wing blog or anything. Please read it so that you understand the facts. This article is from last month, and is talking about post-Mubarak. Please address the question: How is that more freedom and self-determination? What exactly is better? Women are getting raped and molested when they take to the streets and whatever police brutality happened before is still happening, and the Islamists have been attacking liberal protesters in the streets brutally. How is that "more freedom and self-determination"? http://www.huffingtonpost.com/faisal...b_2658360.html The 'Naked Truth' About Egypt's Brotherhood Until this week, many observers may have still wondered what kind of rulers the Muslim Brotherhood are in Egypt. Since assuming office last June, questions were being raised around the dubious power-consolidation strategy carried out by President Mohammed Morsi, the democratically elected Brotherhood candidate who came into power on the back of the demise of the Mubarak regime in 2011. However, there was very little room left for uncertainty recently, when a highly disturbing video of Egyptian police brutality went viral. The footage shows police officers stripping middle-aged protester Hamada Saber naked, and beating him senseless in front of the presidential palace; this was said to have taken place last Friday. No reason to celebrate Egyptians have taken back to the streets since last Jan. 25, to mark the second anniversary of the revolution that ended the 30-year rule of President Hosni Mubarak. However, it was quickly evident that the crowds were not gathering to celebrate; this was another angry protest. With a tarnished economy, worsening living conditions, the re-establishment of the state of emergency, and a government that seemed only keen to serve the interests of the ruling party (the Brotherhood in this case), Egyptians were back to square one. Eight months into its rule, the Brotherhood has very little to show in terms of achievements (apart from Cairo's first 'halal' coffee-shop, where gender-segregation is imposed and playing music is forbidden!). The only brilliance the Brotherhood has shown is in waste-management: they "managed" to "waste" a real and valuable opportunity when the whole world was ready to support the resurgence of Egypt. Unsurprisingly, many global players are now reluctant to lend the country the money it so badly needs to get back on its feet. Egypt has just received a loan offer from Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, but this is not necessarily a good thing. In today's world, any offers of 'assistance' from Iran can only mean one thing: that you must have messed up so badly with everyone else. A unified opposition This is not to say that Egyptians were wrong to go down the democratic route, and this is certainly not to say that we should not accept the choice of the now-democratic republic of Egypt. However, let us not shy away from the truth: that it was not the Brotherhood that ignited or led the 2011 revolution, and that since there was no clear opposition figure that claimed responsibility for it, the path was clear for the Brotherhood to reap the rewards. In addition, due to some questionable inner-workings of local politics, when the time to vote arrived in 2012, Egyptians were caught between a rock and a hard place. The only two choices left were the Brotherhood's candidate, and one associated with the former regime. Whilst much can be said to criticize the Brotherhood, one cannot but admire how well-organized and structured it is. Indeed, it was evident that it was going to be the de-facto beneficiary of the Egyptian revolution. The country's liberal opposition must unite behind a strong and savvy politician, and this must happen now. Without a healthy, solid and powerful opposition that could impose a system of checks and balances, it will not just be a protester dragged naked onto the streets, but the whole country.

Thank you for posting that which is certainly awful as I've said time and time again.

I've answered your question about what is better. Guess what. Women and their families were unjustly punished, imprisoned and killed under the previous regime. So while it still happens, as well as an increase in rape, there is something that is better about Egypt today. Egyptians can and are making changes. The protests and the reaction to the brutality shows that Egyptians are willing to to take a stand and move their nation forward. The fact that they now have a legitimate process to do that is a huge improvement over what they had under Mubarak. That's true of women and men living in Egypt.

I understand that you hate that that is the case. I'll let you take whatever time you need to come to grips with that reality.

[FranchiseBlade]

Originally Posted by CometsWin FB, just put him on ignore. Save yourself from the time wasted.

It's okay. Watching him come unglued is not a problem for me. I don't take his insults and antics seriously. I'm just watching the show.

[AroundTheWorld]

Originally Posted by FranchiseBlade I've answered your question about what is better. Guess what. Women and their families were unjustly punished, imprisoned and killed under the previous regime.

This is still happening. Please provide any proof that this has decreased from the previous regime to this one.

Originally Posted by FranchiseBlade So while it still happens, as well as an increase in rape, there is something that is better about Egypt today. Egyptians can and are making changes.

What positive changes have been achieved?

Originally Posted by FranchiseBlade The protests and the reaction to the brutality shows that Egyptians are willing to to take a stand and move their nation forward. The fact that they now have a legitimate process to do that is a huge improvement over what they had under Mubarak. That's true of women and men living in Egypt.

What legitimate process? You mean the elections? I agree that the mere fact that they had the opportunity to vote - at least once - was an improvement. The elections have not led to more freedom, though, which was what you were constantly claiming. What led to more freedom was the strong will of Egyptians to get more freedom and better living conditions. The tragedy is that not only has that goal not been achieved, living conditions have actually worsened and they do not have more freedom. They are back to square one. Whether they will even have free elections again is an open question, but any other rights cannot be exercised more freely than under Mubarak.

Originally Posted by FranchiseBlade I understand that you hate that that is the case. I'll let you take whatever time you need to come to grips with that reality.

That is very generous of you. Assuming that by "that is the case" you mean the ability to have free elections (because that is the only thing that can be seen as an improvement so far), what exactly is the basis for you to claim that I would "hate that that is the case"? Please provide proof for this statement. Thanks in advance.

[AroundTheWorld]

Originally Posted by FranchiseBlade It's okay. Watching him come unglued is not a problem for me. I don't take his insults and antics seriously. I'm just watching the show.

You are, in fact, being very disingenuous. You don't care one bit about Egypt or Egyptians. You don't care about facts either. You are just trying to get under my skin, lying, ignoring facts, making dumbass statements. It's easy to see, and it doesn't get under my skin. I am not calling you an idiot because you would have gotten under my skin, but because you are acting like one.

Oh, and da1 - stick that report somewhere. Feel free to report it, but you are just spamming with your "Reported" posts. Good luck.

[FranchiseBlade]

Originally Posted by AroundTheWorld That is very generous of you. Assuming that by "that is the case" you mean the ability to have free elections (because that is the only thing that can be seen as an improvement so far), what exactly is the basis for you to claim that I would "hate that that is the case"? Please provide proof for this statement. Thanks in advance.

The proof that you hate it is most of your posts in this thread.

[AroundTheWorld]

Originally Posted by FranchiseBlade The proof that you hate it is most of your posts in this thread.

Nope.

You have been making the claim that people have more freedom, because they have the freedom to protest. I have shown - with sources, in contrast to you - that this is factually untrue.

Showing that the facts are different from what you claim does not mean that I don't wish they would have these freedoms.

Nice try.

[CometsWin]

Originally Posted by FranchiseBlade It's okay. Watching him come unglued is not a problem for me. I don't take his insults and antics seriously. I'm just watching the show.

You must be a teacher because only that type of person could possibly maintain such patience in the face of nonsense. Much respect!

[s land balla]

This is entertaining.

Who here has even been to Syria and/or Egypt?

[CometsWin]

Originally Posted by s land balla This is entertaining. Who here has even been to Syria and/or Egypt?

Nobody! Lol

We should have a test to see who can find them on a map. Haha

[AroundTheWorld]

Originally Posted by s land balla This is entertaining. Who here has even been to Syria and/or Egypt?

I know you have been to both. Do you have an opinion?

1) Do you think the West should support the rebels with weapons?
2) Do you think Egyptians (especially women) are better off now than they were under Mubarak?

I would be curious to hear your take.

[AroundTheWorld]

Originally Posted by CometsWin You must be a teacher because only that type of person could possibly have so much time to spew nonsense.

Fixed.

[da1]

Originally Posted by AroundTheWorld Oh, and da1 - stick that report somewhere.

Reported

[Jeff]

Watch this at the 13:15 mark.

To paraphrase:

You shut up.
No, you shut up.
No, you shut up...

Enter small child...

Why don't you BOTH SHUT UP!