Houston to bid for Super Bowl LI (UPDATE: Houston lands 2017 Super Bowl!)

By contrast, McLane was a relative new-comer to town when he started talking about needing a new stadium. He had made enough friends in town to get the business community behind him. The land that MMP sits on was essentially paid for by private businesses that wanted to help him. They helped fund efforts to get people to vote in support of the new ballpark.

By contrast, no one stood up for Bud Adams. Even, as you say, after 40 years here.

 

Yep... and this was no secret, especially within the NFL.

The NFL wasn't thrilled about losing the Houston market and having a team in hicksville Tennessee... but because they were very in-tune to how Adams basically burned all bridges to salvage a relationship with Houston, there was very little they could do (the NFL would never force an owner to sell a team, especially not a founding owner... although this situation would have benefitted both the city and the NFL had something like that been done).

Even though Houston basically got a team due to LA's bungling of the expansion franchise, many also felt that the NFL knew Houston had gotten screwed by a greedy b*stard of an owner, and that weighed into the decision making as well when it came time to award a new team.

I laugh every time I hear *complaints* about how nice a guy McNair is, and how the franchise would be better off with a "hands-on/greedier" owner who was more ruthless... like most things in life, there's always a flip-side to the coin.

 

I also can't stress enough how Houston did luck out by not having the "Bud-dome" being built... which would have been a lesser version of the now defunct Edwards Jones Dome in St. Louis, the useless Alamodome in San Antonio, or the now defunct Georgia Dome in Atlanta.

If there was one sort of stadium that has proven to have a limited shelf-life... its the 90's/early 2000's non-retractable roof domed stadium for football teams.

 

Yeah, the thing is... Adams was right. The Dome *had* become an outdated, antiquated stadium that did hurt both the Oilers and Astros, in terms of generating additional revenues. But Adams' Chicken Little act had grown so tired - especially with it coming on the heels of his Jacksonville flirtation in the mid-80s - that Lanier was right to stand up to him. IIRC - and I may have the #s wrong - Adams was trying to break a lease that was..... was it even 10 years old? A lease that he had finagled from the city by threatening the Jacksonville move. He was awful.

This is why I don't understand all the Oiler nostalgia. I mean: I *understand* it... I just can't believe fans would sincerely want any part of that franchise again: it was a disaster. Another example, IMO, of the powerfully narcotic impact of nostalgia, which runs everything through this pristine filter that washes away all the bad and leaves all the warm and fuzzy.

Again; I named my first born Campbell; I LOVED the Oilers. And I've never, ever wanted any part of that franchise back. I wish the NFL had just retired it (something I wish they'd do *whenever* a team moves, frankly) - but I'd never want those records and memories associated with the Texans; I'm fine with them being in Tennessee. I was there, November 20, 1978 - I know Earl didn't rumble for 199 yards wearing a Titan uniform.

 

Ironically, with the Adams descendants all doing their best to not want to own/run a football team... with no imminent future success on the forefront (Mike Mularkey was the best they could do?)... I wouldn't be shocked if that team was sold and started exploring other locations prior to their lease running out.

 

They're almost ready to break ground on the trailer park!

 

I would not consider myself a member of that group - but respect that it likely exists. Not sure why... but...

If forced to list all the elements that contribute to a city's cultural fabric... I mean, I'm not sure I'd ever list an amusement park. I'd certainly never be embarrassed if one closed; I'm not embarrassed that we don't have one. That's just a silly notion...

 

I realize winning cures just about everything.

Oilers didn't win, hence, no new stadium.

Houstun realized it really could lose a franchise, so, the Rockets and Astros got new buildings.

 

The Oilers were very successful despite their idiot owner... they weren't perennial losers at the time of the demands. And even then, it was the ******* move to attempt to break a lease and cry chicken little just a few years after demanding the renovations. Adams mis-played his hand, badly... if he needed a new stadium, should never have signed off on the previous renovations (that were a band-aid, if anything), or should have secured the land/funding mechanisms well in advance (rather than simply making threatening demands, again).

Once you've made a threat to leave and you've gotten what you demanded once... why in the world would any sane person expect to get the exact same thing again less than 8 years later? And this is before you consider his overall douche-bag persona that left him with no friends in areas of power/leadership that could have helped him.

Wrong, again. The first referendum was primarily for the Astros... with possible funding tied in for an NFL stadium should Houston get an expansion team. That referendum only passed by 2%, well after the Oilers already left.

The Rockets had a separate referendum 3 years later that FAILED the first time... this is coming off 4 years of consecutive sell-outs and teams with huge names that had championship aspirations.

 

Win, in this instance, is relative. They won; in fact, they won a lot - seven straight trips to the postseason ('87-'93) just prior to Adams' Tennessee flirtation (which engulfed the '95 and '96 seasons). It was the manner in which they lost during that postseason run that caused fan frustration/apathy. BUT... however fans felt wasn't relevant; they were never given an opportunity to vote on any Oiler/new stadium referendum.

Had the Oilers ever played in an AFC Championship Game, or, hell - a Super Bowl - during that stretch... things *may* have worked out differently. But Adams had nuked every possible bridge - with fans, city officials, local businesses... He was a universally disliked owner -- he was cheap, greedy, embarrassing... and ran a mostly terrible operation.

 

First, Oilers didn't win. You're better off not arguing that. They didn't win.

Second, I'm not saying Adams was at all justified. At. All.

I'm saying he gets that stadium after a championship.

In the end, we know who got new buildings and who didn't.

 

They did: 70-41 in the regular season between 1987 and 1993; they made the playoffs every year. Arguing they didn't win in the playoffs - while accurate - isn't an accurate summation of that era.

They disappointed; often historically. But that team won. You're telling me this town wouldn't be bonkers with a seven-year stretch in which the Texans averaged 10 wins/year and made the playoffs every season?...

 

Just like the Rockets got that stadium after two championships? Of all the teams that wanted a new stadium, the Rockets were the only team who actually failed in their first attempt... despite being the only team to actually win one.

And even then... if the Oilers get the Bud-Dome... do you not realize how poor a facility that would have been? How it very likely would be outdated/requiring massive renovation right about now?

Yes, every owner not named Bud Adams eventually got a stadium... even the new NFL owner got a stadium at a price that was 3x the amount it would have cost with Bud. I guess that's the *******/douche-bag tax they were willing to spend.

I really don't know what you're arguing at this point... but its full of mis-information/inaccuracies that you're probably better off not challenging people who have far better recollection of the actual events and/or who aren't too young to not know any better.

 

Well yeah, it definitely isn't part of the cultural fabric. It's just an entertainment option. Nothing to be embarrassed about.

Honestly, I replied only to a small part of a comment about the nature of Astroworld's closing. I'm not interested in ranking it in the terms of what makes a city. A lot of people miss it, or something like it, and others, like you don't. That's fine.

Not really part of the bigger topic of this thread.

 

Bud wasn't here to eventually get his, so different story.

I still remember a sentiment of "no winning, no stadium" though.

Go Texans!!

 

The point is that Bud was never going to get "his" here... he already got his, and he got it in the most uncooperative/back-handed way possible... and then just 6 years later, he wasn't happy with it anymore.

Obviously the playoff failures didn't help... but the playoff failures from the Astros didn't prevent them from getting a new stadium, nor did the playoff success of the Rockets push their first referendum to an approval (and this was directly after the city had already approved MMP/NRG).

 

Never is a strong word. And winning cures a lot.. especially THE sport in Houstun.

I don't recall the particulars on why the Rockets' first plan didn't work, but the city made sure it didn't lose another team. There was an MLB stadium surge when Enron was approved. The city was starving for football again with the Texans, and didn't McNair front much of the cost?

Regardless, it's still embarrassing and a shame to have lost the Oilers and Astroworld. I don't like the ballet or NASCAR, but I realize a city is better with more things "to do". I couldn't imagine a true-Houstunian "blowing off" Astroworld like, "who cares". Small minded thinking at its finest.

Long live great historic feats!!!

Spoiler

8th Wonder of the World

 

Please, sweet merciful black baby jeebus please, PLEASE shut the hell up until you educate yourself. Just watch and listen and read and absorb, every youngster goes through this, live and learn....

 

Nobody is blowing off anything. You reek of somebody who doesn't recall Astroworld in its prime vs. Astroworld towards the end. You seem to be making the same mistake with the Dome, which hasn't been worthy of the wonder title since the 60's. We've already established that you have no clue why or how Houston got its stadiums built.

You would probably keep a terminal pt on life support forever... And hang on to a car that no longer runs just because it was once great.

Houston has more "to do" now than ever before... Without having to rely on a broken down amusement park and an abandoned stadium. Most of the great cities in this country do just fine without a city limits amusement park... The demographic they attract in the middle of nowhere is probably best served out in the sticks as is.

 

AstroWorld should've been upgraded. Wouldn't matter if it relocated to the outskirts or wherever.

Houstun doesn't have to rely on any ONE form of entertainment or the Astrodome. That's just a foolish over-the-top comment to benefit your argument. The city is BETTER with them though. Again, I don't like the ballet or NASCAR, but I'm not biased, enabling me to see the bigger picture.

How about you actually say something specific instead of posting blanket statements.