Kawhi Leonard: NBA Wingmen and the Lost Art of the Mid-Range game

Max Contract?

Rocket River

 

Yup, the mid range shot as either a Calvin Murphy stop-and-pop or a 15-18 foot elbow shot like Luis Scola is very valuable.

I understand the statistics behind the three or layup philosophy, but we've seen it is too easy for a disciplined team to play zone for the paint and run shooters off the three point line. You have to be able to find quality shots from any distance.

 

Thats how the pps split is gonna be for every player

Midrange is the "cd player" of NBA. Still around but limited use and effectiveness

 

To be honest. I don't know if he is worth the max. I'd say he is probably not worth it now. But he has not peaked yet. So who know how much he will improve in another year or two.

Also, there is a possibility that he is a system guy and just fits well with the Spurs. No matter, his skill set is definitely worth more than what Ariza is making.

 

Do you have any proof of this? Mid-range afficionados like to say a lot of rhetoric but don't have any data backing their claims.

The Lakers have a coach who doesn't like 3 pters and actively encourages mid-range shots. If "shooters" as you call hit shots from any distance then why the **** are the Lakers shooting like crap and why are they one of the worst teams in the NBA? Conversely why are teams like Spurs, Hawks, GSW and of course Rox who all like to shoot a ton of 3's and paint shots in the top of the standing?

It's not about "good looks", you can give Patrick Beverly all the open mid-range shots you like and he'll still brick em up. In fact the Boston Celtics defense with KG and Tom Thibs actually left the mid-range area open and defended the 3 pt line and paint area aggressively, and they posted historical defensive numbers because all the opponents who had "good looks at the mid-range shot" bricked 'em up.

Jesus, why are some people so stubborn about the mid range shot? Unless you can do them especially well, they are the worst shots to take, period since they harder to make than drives to the lane and yet give the same amount of points.

 

He's the best defender in the entire NBA and it isn't even close. His offensive game has improved year by year, game by game. Only somewhat scary thing is all the injuries he has sustained so far since he's been in the NBA but still, none of them were super serious. He's definitely a max player in today's NBA. Hands down.

 

Leonard is a very good defender. He is average offensively, with a below-average jump shot. He's not much of a creator. Popovich's system and coaching has made him (and everyone else on the Spurs, except Duncan) look a lot better than they really are.

Truly great players don't need pre-installed "systems" in order to be effective and dominant. They transcend that stuff.

The midrange game is nice and all...heck, it's another weapon in a player's arsenal...but it doesn't really bring all that much value to an NBA team, especially for guards and small forwards. Chances are, a player who shoots 35% from 3-pt range is only going to shoot about 40% from 18-foot range...sure that's better, but insignificantly so. Offensive rebounds are also less likely for missed midrange jump shots as opposed to missed layups or hook shots in the post. (On the other hand, a big man who can knock down a 15-18 foot jumper in addition to being effective down low is a very nice luxury to have.) Three-point shooting, being able to break defenders down and create offense, and driving it to the hole and finishing and drawing fouls all have more importance and influence in the outcomes of games.

 

Jimmy Butler or Kawhi Leonard. Who you got?

 

Ill just leave this here. I think kawhi is better than jimmy buttler.

http://grantland.com/the-triangle/claw-school-kawhi-leonards-defensive-master-class/

 

Tell that to Michael Jordan in his prime

 

Jimmy is better offensively and Kawhi is better defensively. Can't go wrong with either. The Rockets would benefit more with Jimmy imo.

 

Big men are the best defender in the NBA, and it isn't even close. A guy like healthy Dwight or Tim Duncan does more for your defense than a wing player can, why do you think DPOY's go to big men majority of the time?

As far as individual player defense goes, Kawhi is good but I don't think he separates himself from other top defenders like Ariza or a serious Lebron.

Is Kawhi worth the max? I don't really know, he's excellent defensively and average offensively...maybe he is if you think about it that way. I still won't consider him a superstar until he puts the Spurs on his back and leads them somewhere,right now he's just looking like the best among the Spurs' role players.

 

Kawhi is a max player.

 

It was mentioned a couple of times that the credit should go to Popovich.
Popovich doesn't work with Kawhi 1 on 1. The Spurs assistant that does so (and I believe has been doing so since Kawhi's rookie year or 2nd year) is Ime Udoka. So credit goes to Kawhi, Ime and Pop for the development in Kawhi's game.

 

one of the most overrated players in the league. up there with dame.

 

So you would hit the club with that wing man?

 

Not sure if serious. I hope you seriously don't put stock into the DPOY award. It's strictly just a popularity contest on who can swat the ball into the 10th row. DeAndre Jordan is likely the front runner to get it this year and he isn't a top 15 defender in the league. Great rebounder though.

You obviously haven't watched a lot of Kawhi. Guy is the best defender in the league hands down. His offensive game isn't that great as many have said but it has improved year by year. I'm saying in today's NBA, he is definitely a MAX player. Considering the Parsons, Haywards, etc.

 

Most people love offense, pay attention to offense and no nothing/don't care about defense so thus he's overrated. Any coach in the NBA who has played against Kawhi has talked about how much of a terror he really is defensively.

 

Which prime? The first prime (early 90's) where he took more shots inside?

Or the second prime (late 90's) where he took more of his shots from mid range and wasn't quite as effective as he was in his first prime?

 

Jimmy Butler. He plays for a coach that has no idea at all on the offensive side of the ball while Pops is probably the best offensive coach in the league.