And Ray Allen was one of the few bright spots from the Heat side. During AC-gate, when Mr. "walks on water" Lebron was breaking down due to the heat, you had super-conditioned Ray Allen stealing the ball and hauling ass 94ft to dunk that sh**! I jumped off my seat when I saw that. It's like the heat in the arena separated the men from the boys, and Ray Allen was definitely a man...a 39 year old man.
What does their salary have to do with the topic? Whether or not an older player can be relied on has nothing to do with their salary. There's a dozen or more guys that age that are heavily relied upon by their teams. Basically, if those guys are still in the league at that age then they generally are playing or they wouldn't be sticking around. Now if we were talking about salaries for players of that age (which we weren't) then most of the veterans in that age range making a similar salary. Of the ones I sited Duncan makes $10M, Ginobili makes $7M and Ray Allen made $3.2M last season. That's a pretty good spread in salary but ok if you want some older guys in that range here you go: Kobe Bryant $23M Paul Pierce $5.3M Jason Terry $5.4M Steve Nash $10M Kevin Garnett $12M Vince Carter $3.9M Andre Miller $4.6M Dirk Nowitzki $7.9M In fact, let's flip your question to "How many players over 37 years of age aren't making a salary in the same range as Duncan, Manu and Ray Allen?". I'll save you the trouble of looking...there's only two Pablo Prigioni ($1.6M) and Nazr Mohammed ($1.4M). The fact is there aren't a whole lot of players in the league older than 37 but the vast majority of them have salaries comparable or higher than Duncan, Manu and Ray Allen. Of course, that wasn't relevant to the topic I commented on and still isn't. The relevant point is that almost all of the older players (older than 37) are playing 20 plus minutes a night and their teams rely upon them (which was the topic being discussed).
Here's a list of the oldest players in the league last year (not in order): Duncan, Ray Allen, Ginobili, Jason Terry, Nazr Mohammed, Steve Nash, Andre Miller, Pablo Prigioni, Kevin Garnett, Vince Carter, Paul Pierce, Kobe Bryant, Kenyon Martin Kobe Bryant Dirk Nowitzki How many of those guys played over 20 minutes a game last season and were counted on by their teams? Yes Nash and Bryant were out for almost the entire year but the vast majority of those guys were regular contributors. Their teams relied upon them and they played minutes and coincidentially almost all of their teams were in the playoffs last year. Were the Lakers foolish for relying on Derek Fisher? Dallas shouldn't have relied on Jason Kidd? Successful teams have always utilized stars at the end of their careers and it's paid off for them. Go back and look at all of the Celtics championship teams and you'll see guys like Bill Walton, Pete Maravich and Nate Archibald coming off the bench. Remember Bob McAdoo coming off the bench for the Lakers? I would have bet money that Grant Hill was done after Orlando but he ended up playing quite a few more years and was a contributor. Is it a guarantee that he'll be healthy? Nope, but there's also no guarantee with younger guys either.
AElliott - I get what your saying. Yes it's possible for a former all star in his late 30's to be productive, but my point is the Rockets aren't the Spurs and Terry hasn't had the past two years that someone like Vince Carter or even Paul Pierce has had. They aren't the 2011 Mavs. McHale does not have an institution of basketball like Popovich where vets like Ginobilli can take nights off and they don't have an institution of role players that are consistently maximized in their roles. Whoever is relied upon in that role will have to produce outside and above of McHales system. Whoever is coming off the bench as the secondary perimeter facilitator will need to carry a major load through the majority of the season. Can a veteran former all star player carry that load? Maybe, but Jason Terry... Given the fact that he was rightfully given away by two teams who tried like hell to move his contract, and the fact that he hasn't played productive basketball in 2 years leads me personally to be very concerned about relying on him to carry a major role during the regular season. For the Rockets to have sustained success with their bench unit, I'm pretty sure somebody is going to have to step up. There is no evidence that suggests Terry is going to be a reliable solution for 82 games. If he proves me wrong than great, but I don't see anything reliable about the Jason Terry solution. In the playoffs id like to have him though if he's healthy.
Truthfully, I was only replying to the idea that you couldn't rely on a 37 year old for a significant role. There's lots of teams doing it as I pointed out. Dallas' best player is a 37 year old. As far as Terry, I would doubt that he'd be our backup PG too. Not because of his age but because he really hasn't been a PG since his Atlanta days. Once he went to Dallas he became more of a SG/instant offense guy. Like I said, there's no guarantee that Terry will produce but we're talking about a backup position. There's certainly risk but there's also much upside. Really the same as it would be if you went with a young guy, maybe more. We know Terry can shoot and we know he's experience and knows how to play. The question with him is how much does he have left in the tank physically. As for the young guys we don't even know for certain if they can play in the league or not. It's a risk either way and whichever way they go if it's not working we'll make a trade. You are correct that Terry hasn't been as productive as Vince Carter the last couple of years but that's no reason to write him off. If we could somehow acquire Kobe Bryant at $5M/year to be a backup SG, would you take him? Like I said in my earlier post, I was fully convinced that Grant Hill was done after Orlando and he ended up playing quite a few more years and was a great bench player. Ditto for Walton coming back to play as a 6th man for Boston.
This seems like the most likely lineup to me. Though I don't know about Capela. Something McHale said sounded like both Ish and Canaan would make the team:
To continue. . . . Might be like the "competition" between Lin and Beverley last preseason. Ish is getting the minutes right now, like Beverley did.
Jeff Adrien cannot be traded until December 15, so that wouldn't allow you to avoid having to make that additional cut by October 27. Also, if the Rockets come out of next summer with just Llull and Gentile added to the current roster, then something went wrong. They'll be looking for much bigger fish. If they can add a third star/key player during this season, then I could see them trying to bring Llull over using the Taxpayer MLE. I think Gentile has said that he plans to play two more years in Italy and to come to the NBA in 2016.
A quick primer on when each player can be traded, for those proposing that the Rockets trade their way to roster consolidation and avoid having to make additional difficult cuts before October 27: Currently Trade-Eligible: Dwight Howard James Harden Jason Terry (by himself) Terrence Jones Donatas Motiejunas Josh Powell Clint Capela Patrick Beverley Isaiah Canaan Robert Covington Nick Johnson October 21 (maybe a little later): Kostas Papanikolaou November 16: Jason Terry (aggregated with other salaries) December 15: Trevor Ariza Joey Dorsey Francisco Garcia (but not without his consent) Jeff Adrien Ish Smith Troy Daniels Tarik Black Akil Mitchell
Re-watching that Hidalgo GSW game you can clearly see a 16 lead evaporate to single digits in the 4th when Canaan came in for Ishmael Smith.
Capela and Johnson are going to the vipers http://spacecityscoop.com/2014/10/2...-johnson/?utm_medium=referral&utm_source=t.co
Don't know why people think one of Canaan/Ish are getting cut. Given Pat Bev's recent meniscus tear, we're going to need that 3rd string PG especially considering how neither Daniels nor JET are capable of shifting over to the one for substantial minutes at this point in their respective careers.
"We're the team that finds guys like Chandler Parsons, not the team that overpays for Chandler Parsons" - Morey I could see this applied to Terry. Morey could say something like "We're the team that trades for a post-rehab Terry, not the team that pays for a Terry while he's still rehabbing."
There can only be 15 people on this roster so SOMEBODY unexpected is getting cut if not 2 people. I have a hard time seeing Morey cutting someone with guaranteed $ beyond this year (even if its a small amount) so I would think that Morey will try to move Canaan if he can if he feels he has to have 3 true PG's. The other case I think you will see Morey make(if he does have to cut Ish) is that Nick Johnson will be put exclusively at PG in the D-League and will be fast tracked to develop his ball handling skills & learning of setting up their offense. Also you'd hear him mention that James Harden is really the de facto Point Guard on the floor most of the game regardless, and they really only need another guard to help him bring the ball up the floor. I'm not saying Ish is getting cut, or Canaan is getting traded, but I am telling you that SOMEBODY.... actually 2 people out of this group are getting cut- Garcia, Smith, Adrien, Canaan, Black, Dorsey along with Powell, Covington, Mitchell ................. Whichever way YOU WOULD choose will have a case to be made, but my point is there really is no right or wrong answer here. We are just going to have to see who Morey & McHale cut to understand the teams perspective.
Nope he said he's not playing three pgs. Three should definitely make the roster with one being the insurance that Brooks was last season.
I just heard Patrick mention Garcia and terry on some Comcast interview. so doubt Garcia is cut. It will be 2 of adrien, black and Dorsey. both smith and canaan probably make it unless they think terry can do the 1
