[ClutchFans] Podcast: Ty Lawson, Houston Rockets Point Guard

Let me put it another way:

Curry = 7.7apg
AI = 3apg
Green = 3.7apg
Total = 14.4apg

Harden = 7apg
Bev = 3.4apg
Smith = 3.3apg
Total = 13.7

Replace Smith with Ty that's 20apg

That's raw and doesn't adjust for minutes and impact of adding Ty into this roster BUT essentially Ty >>>> then every other play maker you mentioned plus there's only one ball.

 

It doesn't work that way. Bev got those APG being the starter and with different lineups, before Smith came, etc.

It's all just variables. The only linear stat is Harden will not get 7apg if his usage goes down, by default of having Lawson. That's it.

 

Yes I know that's why i said they were raw unadjusted numbers. The point was to simple show that the addition of lawson overwhelmingly compensates for any playmaking loss from Josh and that there isn't a need for a 3rd playmaker when you have harden and ty. Bev was just included because Drock added players like green and Livingston who help but aren't major playmakers either.

 

Either you really don't get the point I'm trying to make or you are simply stubbornly defending your own argument. Rockets need another play maker or two on the roster so Rockets can have at least TWO on the floor at all times. This is a hedge against defenses overloading on the lone play maker when the other sits. Or worse, in the event of injury or off the court issues. It is a loooong season and things happen.

Is that really so difficult for you to comprehend???

 

No I comprehend what you're saying, it's not difficult at all. I just think you're wrong. For the reasons I already stated. We might have very different definitions of playmaker because I don't put green and barbosa in that category for sure but you do. So if you're looking to add a guy of that playmaking caliber then sure but I don't see that moving the needle much or adding much insurance. Again it's not like Joshs playmaking when harden sat was what kept us afloat. Morey said it himself, next to harden Dmo was the next best offensive option. NOT smith.

Harden and lawson are plenty....asking for more at this point is just greedy and more importantly not even possible given our roster and salary cap situation. Serious question though, who do you think is attainable for us that has the playmaking ability you'd want and how would you propose we get him?

And if not agreeing with you makes me stubborn.....then yes I'm stubborn.

 

Ah, this makes things clearer. Morey comments about D-Mo in the regular season, and what Josh Smith contributed in the playoffs are worlds apart. That you could not see it makes so much sense now.

Stubbornness is obviously not what ails you.

 

lol, if you're thinking a guy like Josh is going to give you that type of performance consistently...then i don't know what to tell you man. He has court vision sure and can go nuts, but give him another quarter and he's just as liable to give you 2x as many TO's as he does assist. We wouldn't even need him to do that if we had Dmo in the playoffs because Dmo is the better offensive option. So if you're just talking about someone you can count on to facilitate and keep the offense going then I say again DMo is your third option.

If you're looking for a playmaker meaning someone who can break down a defense and either get his own shot or get someone else a shot then you're talking about a pure PG with court vision.....which we have now. Again, this might get cleared up if you'd just say who it is you think this third playmaker would be that we could reasonably get? Because from what it sounds like you're looking for another guy with enough vision and passing that can get you 5+ assists if called upon without turning the ball over at a crazy rate.

Also if you're think DM's comments about DMo being the 2nd best option behind Harden didn't take into account Smith's play during the playoffs and he was that much more valuable than Dmo (enough to supplant him as the 2nd option) then why do you think he wasn't more aggressive in trying to keep Smith by offering the full MLE? It seems to me DM didn't value his playmaking ability as much as you.

 

DMO is the third playmaker... No team in the league has more then two elite playmakers and the rockets have their two and there elite no debate. I think anyone who thinks you can have 3 elite playmakers is just silly because it won't work not enough possessions to get the full value of each player.

DMO is more then good enough he can create his own shot and is a willing and pretty good passer, plus the ball doesn't stick in his hands.

 

Thank you....that's exactly my point.

 

You are right, stop replying to d rock.

 

And in spot situations, so are brewer, Thornton, Beverley, etc..... Draymond green is NOT a playmaker if you define one as a lawson or harden type player.

 

Smith was a ****ing fluke, the odds he has a stretch shooting the 3 ball like he did against the Clips are slim. They guy was good in the pnr with Howard but was a turnover machine at times. Revisionist history on how good Smith actually was.

 

Getting Smith back would've been a nice luxury but he's not even close to necessary. He's not going to make or break this team. I'll always love Smith for igniting the Clutch City 2.0 but I still remember half those games he drove me crazy with boneheaded turnovers and missed free throw after missed free throw (Spurs game was cringeworthy). He won't have the same freedom he had here with the Clippers. It seems he has his eyes very focused on getting a big contract with the rising cap next season and that may or may not be a good thing.

 

Where did I say elite? I suggested a trade for a young PG or point forward. And just because a player can pass out of the post (D-Mo) or handle the ball (TJones) does not make them a facilitator (play maker, distributor, etc.). If the Rockets ran a system similar to Spurs, where everyone moves the ball, then the point is moot. Then again, Spurs had many players who were very good distributors: Parker, Ginobli, Mills, Joseph, Diaw.

The Rockets do not. Not to say D-Mo cannot grow into that kind of player, but just because he can pass out of the post does not make him a point forward giving Harden/Lawson ability to rest on offense or preventing defenses from simply keying on Harden/Lawson.

Spin Smith's contribution all you want, he stepped up in the playoffs and carried the team when Harden was having off nights. Talk about his poor play on prior teams, or in the regular season all you want, it does not discount what actually happened or mitigate his production. It is not what he could have done, it was what he did. Retaining Smith, in addition to Lawson, would have made Rockets more of a championship contender.

I am done with Smith, he is no longer a Rocket, but the guy was a stud in the playoffs. Hate on his past, hate on his regular season, but when it comes down to it, hate is just hate.

 

FIFY

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/s/smithjo03/gamelog/2015/

 

46 assist to 38 turnovers in the playoffs for a rate of 1.21 assist per TO. Wish we still had him because he'd allow us to be able to move Jones, but that doesn't scream playmaker to me.

 

Mavs Game #2 was a thing of beauty though. Can't deny that.

Spoiler

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/tbPURW4v4dw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

Yeah I remember that game. I was watching it on work retreat with 20 coworkers who are all mavs fans. That was such a good retreat. My coworkers are still salty.....

Josh went 4 TO's and 1 assist in game one too.....that pretty much sums him up. You live by his play or die by his play. Loved his heart though because you just knew he wanted it.

 

Would've been really nice to have resigned him and then just not sign Harrell. With the Clippers he's going to have a TON of lobs to DJ and Blake which is pretty scary.

 

Disagree... Harrell is worth more than Smith at this stage..