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Zach Lowe podcast returns with a discussion on Rockets and firing of McHale

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by HamJam, Nov 19, 2015.

  1. RV6

    RV6 Contributing Member

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    I'd disagree....especially now with guys who are stars in AAU, then high school...not only do they get told they can make it, but they are hounded by scouts and brands.

    And then there's Lamar Odom. **** happens sometimes and you can't help but become mentally weak or insecure, even after being confident for so long. Pro athletes aren't immune to real life problems. Just look at Ty.
     
  2. YOLO

    YOLO Member

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    also guys like javale mcgee and lance stephenson. Michael Beasley is another one that comes to mind. These guys just don't get it. plenty of guys in the league who are mentally weak.
     
  3. sirbaihu

    sirbaihu Member

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    Harden simply gave a crap about winning the gold. Afterward, he didn't forget everything he supposedly learned from Coach K, did he? He simply felt motivated that summer.
     
  4. RV6

    RV6 Contributing Member

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    yeah, i think if you have the talent, a lot of times others will do a lot of the work for you..you just have to show up and play. Coaches are out there recruiting youngsters, picking them up to go to practice and games, getting them to transfer schools. It's a lot easier to make it, if you transfer to an Oak Hill, than if you stay in some unknown high school and still put up big numbers. Everything is set up to get you to the NBA or a big name college, where it all starts again. Not everyone works as hard to make it to the NBA and stick around. Some get here and are still coddled by teams or their "camp" from back home.
     
  5. malakas

    malakas Member

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    J.R Smith is accused of chocking a fan has lead to a death of one of his friends because he was driving drunk and is one of the most incosistent and dirtiest headcases in teh nba.
    And he won a 6moy was in the finals having a definite and important role off the bench.


    Roy Hibbert who was the center of a contending team collapsed mentally for some reason that we dont' even know for sure( pg slept with his gf? Lance stephenson cancer?) and lead to a downfall of his team and the team wanting to get rid of him and in the end begging him to opt out.

    So stop with "noone in the nba is mentally weak". And that's some of the most extreme cases. There are plenty players in the nba who are mentally weak without being so weak like Hibbert or so crazy like J.R but they wont' be the leaders of the lockeroom either.
     
  6. malakas

    malakas Member

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    I forgot Hassan Whiteside another glaring example of a headcase being able to make it in the NBA. Guy had the worst work ethic couldnt' (and still can't)control his temper and gets his head filled with air to the point that the team has appointed a mentor and all the leaders of the lockeroom keep him in a very tight lease.

    And what about Jeremy Lin? lol yeah..no mentally weak nba players exist.
     
  7. RocketsJumer

    RocketsJumer Member

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    I feel like when Harden plays the game smart/right and with the team, he is probably the hardest player in the NBA to guard. We've seen instances where he just shreds some of the best defenses singlehandedly, not just with his scoring game, but with his passing too. With his elite passing and the threat of him scoring, he can be the most dangerous offensive player in the game.

    No other player in the league can attack the basket relentlessly, work some of the best defenders down with isolation moves, breakdown team defenses with crisp passing, draw fouls at an elite rate and as David Thorpe puts, "throw daggers".

    Not LeBron. Not Durant. Not Curry.

    As long as he is giving a true effort on defense, he would instantly be top 3 in the league, competing for the MVP and boosting the Rockets to a top seed.

    Hope to see this Harden from now on. Need to get a coach that brings that out of Harden on a more consistent basis. Maybe JB is that guy.
     
  8. basketballholic

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    Whiteside has good work ethic. He cane into the league a skinny runt and he dieted and resistance trained himself up to 280 lbs of lean muscle.

    He does have a screw loose and is still immature. But he has and does spend a lot of time in the gym working out.

    Will be interesting to see what he does after he gets his money. That's when we'll see what his character has developed in to. Will he continue to work hard after he gets his deal or will he taper off, pick up fast, and get slower and sluggish?
     
  9. don grahamleone

    don grahamleone Contributing Member

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    These two podcast guys plus Harden's stats make me think that Harden and McHale had serious beef. Their points on over-coaching were good to hear. These guys or at least one of them was a coach. I believe them.

    Harden's +/- game by game

    1. Denver -20 led team
    2. Golden State -22 led team
    3. Miami -23 tied with Lawson to lead team
    4. OKC +6 middle of the pack
    5. Orlando +2 middle
    6. Sacramento +24 near the top
    7. Clippers +6 near the top
    8. Brooklyn +1 on of three players with positive numbers
    9. Denver -9 second worst
    10. Dallas -12 amongst the worst on the team
    11. Boston -27 led team
    12. Portland +10 second on the team

    Forget his points and shooting percentages. Harden is jekyl and hyding the team. I really hope that McHale was the only issue because he's flat out dragged the team down with him up to this point or he wills them to win. This team follows its leader and it's James Harden. Time to lead them up to the top with examples of defense and smart shooting/passing.
     
  10. heypartner

    heypartner Contributing Member

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    don grahamleone,

    Note that the math of +/- converges on the final score the closer to 48 minutes you play. Indeed, if you play all 48 minutes, your +/- will be equal to the point differential of the final box score.

    So, when you run +/- on a 39 mpg player like Harden, don't be surprised if his +/- nearly matches the final score.

    And what you listed is pretty close each game to the final score, and you try to compare it all the players. That's not good math. You can blame the final score on Harden, but don't try to find some hidden analytic gem in the +/- of a 39mpg player, like he's jekyl and hyde.
     
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  11. sirbaihu

    sirbaihu Member

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    Good observation. Here's a different view:

     
  12. Hmm

    Hmm Member

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    Has no one to blame but himself... Harden is a byproduct of his environment... There's no structure here, there's no winning culture, there's no leadership, and coaching is minimized by the GM on this team, that trickles down to the player's perception of their coach... especially for a young player who was dubbed a "Superstar" a bit too eagerly by the local fans and local media... and has been given free-reign to do as he well pleases on the court because the stats say it'll all eventually work out for the better...
     
  13. dmoneybangbang

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    Pretty sure he was let go in the offseason after getting to the WCF, along with a few other front office folks.
     
  14. dmoneybangbang

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    We've built up a few players under Morey so I disagree it's the environment.
     
  15. RV6

    RV6 Contributing Member

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    Hollins wasn't renewed bc he didn't like analytics approach Memphis was trying to take, after hiring Hollinger.
     
  16. oakdogg

    oakdogg Contributing Member

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    Cheap shots at Jerry Stackhouse. As someone who watched Stackhouse, I do not sign off on that.
     
  17. oakdogg

    oakdogg Contributing Member

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    I tend to think there's a big difference on the position. For athletic big men, they have no competition. They literally are freaks. In my long a$$ life, I don't think I've seen a guy 6'9 or above not on a bball court. Of the few of these giants there are, how many are mobile and durable enough to play at that level? If you are an athletic big man, you do not have to beat a bunch of other athletic big men to make it in the league by working hard on your game. Therefore, I believe fans overrate the drive and discipline of big men like Dwight Howard. Big men don't make free throws b/c they don't have to, not because it's harder to make them when you're bigger.

    How many people know a 6'2 dude who plays basketball? There are millions upon millions of them. Therefore, I tend to give a guy who beats those odds the benefit of a doubt regarding toughness, discipline, etc. People act like they really know anything about Harden's life. Everybody doesn't advertise every time they work out like DMo.
     
  18. Hmm

    Hmm Member

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    Who would these players be..? 27 year old Luis Scola...? Kyle Lowry who came in mentally tough...? Maybe you mean Carl Landry, who had Yao, Scola, Lowry, Hayes and coach Adelman to "grow up" with..?

    Maybe you mean Chandler Parsons.... diva #1... to go with James Harden, diva #2...?
     

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