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Jewish 972 Magazine Why It is Time for a One State Solution in Palestine

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by glynch, Mar 27, 2015.

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  1. glynch

    glynch Contributing Member

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    A good article that explains why the two state solution's time has passed and it isn't all Bibi coming clean embarrassingly clean to win the last election.
    ****************
    It's time for a one-state solution

    There is no use convincing the Jewish public to support the two-state solution, especially when over 500,000 settlers live beyond the Green Line and there is no guarantee that a Palestinian state will not be the source of terror against Israelis. The only way forward is to grant full equality to all.

    By Yonatan Amir

    Every time I say that the two-state solution is no longer realistic, and that we need to think about new approaches to solve the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, center-left voters respond with anger, condescension and pity. They claim that this is a far-fetched idea, not to mention dangerous and cruel (!) — an idea that proves the desire to destroy the State of Israel, and is disconnected from the will of the “sane Jewish majority.”

    Let’s start with a reminder: the new Knesset includes 107 members belonging to Jewish parties. Seventy-eight of them oppose the two-state solution, and are divided between those who have no qualms about their stances (Likud, Jewish Home, Kulanu, Shas, United Torah Judaism and Yisrael Beiteinu), and a minority that talks about a solution but creates obstacles to ever achieving one (Yesh Atid). On the other side we have the supporters of two states: five MKs from Meretz and 24 from the Zionist Camp. All in all, 29 versus 78.

    These are the statistics. We aren’t talking about a difference of 2-3 seats that could make a difference in the future, not a “majority,” not “sane,” no “support” and no “solution.” The majority of Israelis oppose a two-state solution. Welcome to the negligible minority

    http://972mag.com/its-time-for-a-one-state-solution/104766/
     
    #1 glynch, Mar 27, 2015
  2. Nivos

    Nivos Member

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    Thank you, very interesting read.
    I have to say that as part of the centre-left in Israel I sadly agree that we might have gone too far with the settlments in the west bank to be able to reach an agreement.
    The last election showed me that you might have been right and a viable 2 state solution is not longer a solution, as much sense that it makes.
    In the wild middle east, sense is hard to find.
    I gave up on thinking a change can come from politicians, it never has in the middle east.
    I also agree with the article that all we need now is to try and change the agenda from within. No more-palestine-Israeli conflict rather now its a conflict for equality to all.
    If we have no other option but embrace the west bank than we have to embeace all of it, treat the palestinians as oart of Israel, give them Israeli passports, disintegrate the palestinian authority and full equal rights as part of citizens of our country.
    Its a much harder battle, because I don't know how they will accept it, my guess is they won't.
    So for now, I'll leave the politicians alone, try and help the people that are less fortunate around me, if they're Jews, Arabs, Cristians or Druze. We're all people after all, we all want to live a decent and dignified life, no matter what is our political agenda or religion belief.
     
    #2 Nivos, Mar 28, 2015
  3. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    I disagree with Israel having "gone too far" with the illegal settlements on the West Bank for Israel to ever give them up. In my opinion, those illegal settlements should be handed over, intact, to the Palestinians of the West Bank as reparations. They have certainly suffered enough for them. That is, if Israel ever wants peace. As for the column, the idea is nonsensical, in my humble opinion.
     
    #3 Deckard, Mar 28, 2015
  4. glynch

    glynch Contributing Member

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    Interesting idea. I wonder if this idea has ever been polled in Israel? Sounds no less difficult to me than the one state solution.

    Why are you so against the one state solution? It certainly seems more in line with American values? If it is that they will always hate and distrust each other so much, I think they will have to overcome this type of irrational hatred to implement either solution. Without this work, no meaningful two state solution is possible and is one of the reasons why only untenable pseudo states have been proposed to date for the Palestinians.

    BTW would you agree with me that settling the Palestine issue will help greatly with solving the overall terrorism problem.? A modern one state Israel/Palestine which would then be really democratic would certainly provide a good source of intermediaries from the "west" to the Arabs as well as an incredible example.
     
    #4 glynch, Mar 28, 2015
  5. Exiled

    Exiled Member

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    That's might be possible like 30 years ago. But the things changed nowdays. radicals and extremists control everything's from politics to religion

    [youtube]9U2M6vsMy48[/youtube]
     
    #5 Exiled, Mar 28, 2015
  6. Exiled

    Exiled Member

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    [youtube]iqL048x4msM[/youtube]
     
    #6 Exiled, Mar 29, 2015
  7. glynch

    glynch Contributing Member

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    Deckard may be somewhat trapped in his opinions formed 30 or more years ago. It isn't his father's Israel. Deckard and I are about the same age. I remember seeing the movie Exodus with Paul Newman back when it came out. Later I read the book by Leon Uris. In effect wonderful propaganda or historical myth. Sort of like the one sidedness of the old fashioned cowboy and Indian movies which seem so racist and dated now. Most Americans were raised with that Exodus image, but as more details came out and Israel has become more extreme one's opinions should change, too.
     
    #7 glynch, Mar 29, 2015
  8. Rocket2008

    Rocket2008 Member

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    **** Israel and everything it stands for, biggest mistake post World War ll. I am talking about the people in power, the nation and its policies. Not Jews or anything of that nature.
     
    #8 Rocket2008, Mar 29, 2015
  9. Major

    Major Member

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    The article spends a lot of time telling us why a two-state solution is not viable - and they may be right - but it spends no time telling us why a one-state solution would be. If 75% of the Knesset is opposed to a two-state solution, and most of that is right-leaning, why would they be willing to give up voting power to the Palestinians? It's like asking the GOP to legalize and give voting rights to all the illegal immigrants in the US, who will promptly vote for Dems.

    One-state seems like it would be even less popular than two-state. I could be wrong on this, but that's my problem with the article - it makes no case why that solution is any more likely than the one they say can't work.
     
    #9 Major, Mar 29, 2015
  10. glynch

    glynch Contributing Member

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    I guess the one state solution seems sort of logical and is the only other solution proposed. It seems to be gaining strength.

    I see your point. I suppose the majority in Israel thinks they can just continue with their present policy forever. A couple of things mitigate against this. 1) With the status quo more and more settlements are built which make it physically harder and harder for two viable states. 2)The world is getting tired of it and even in the US the tide is turning, even among Jewish Americans.
     
    #10 glynch, Mar 30, 2015
  11. StupidMoniker

    StupidMoniker I lost a bet

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    The people opposed to a two state solution don't want the Palestinians to become Israelis, they want them gone. Best case scenario is they make them someone else's problem, pushing them off on the Jordanians and Egyptians. Worst case is a "final solution".

    Instead, Israel should unilaterally implement a two state solution. They annex whatever territory they want of the West Bank, making the people living in that territory citizens, and then declare the Palestinian state to be the remainder plus Gaza (or make it a three state solution with Gaza as it's own state). From that point forward treat them as a state and there isn't much that can be done about it. End the blockade of Gaza. Further attacks are an act of war which is responded to as such.

    I think what will happen instead is a continuation of the status quo, which is to Israel's benefit more than the Palestinians. What the Palestinians need to realize is that their negotiating position continually worsens as the facts on the ground change. Each settlement built, each wall constructed, each encroachment further into the West Bank is a bit less land that they will get in an eventual deal. They are instead acting like gambling addicts, chasing the early losses and digging themselves deeper and deeper. The sooner they cut their losses, the better off they will be. But that is always easier to see from the outside than from within.
     
    #11 StupidMoniker, Mar 30, 2015
  12. Buck Turgidson

    Buck Turgidson Member

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    Well, if this isn't the most "pot v. kettle" statement I've ever seen....
     
    #12 Buck Turgidson, Mar 30, 2015
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