... has hit the big time. Even the simplest of simpletons here on the board has put together that Trevor Ariza's departure spells big time minutes for Chase Budinger at the 3 spot. There have been some pretty fervent reactions to this (most vociferously on the positive, but then again DD is a loud mouth...); however, as usual, not much analysis has been provided. As a mere plebe of the Clutchfans hierarchy, I couldn't search and revisit any of the countless Budinger threads of the past so I was forced to clog the board with a new thread. My apologies. Quite plainly, I just don't get where/how/why people are elevating Budinger to a starting level SF in the league. Granted, it is hard to evaluate (I don't know of any professional scouts on this board) Budinger's ceiling based on extremely limited minutes and an absurd college career (various coaches, roles, etc), but I feel some information is always better than none. Here goes: Right now Budinger has shown only one unique Plus ability: shooting. He is and will be an excellent shooter in this league from nearly limitless range. There is no debating this fact. One of his favorite moves is hitting the pull up jumper, on the fast break and secondary break especially, a very nice skill set. However, I don't see where Budinger has shown the ability to create his own shot off the dribble. I would like to see him develope a step-back move to really utilize his size and vertical. As of now, he only has the ability the shoot over players playing lax defense, however I fear that when he is crowded on the perimeter it will severely hamper his productivity. And why would he be crowded on the perimeter? Budinger has not shown a penchant for continuously attacking the rim when he is hounded on the outside. There HAVE been glimpses of him taking a player off the dribble (to my recollection mostly along the baseline), but he has yet to impress upon me a willingness to exploit the defenses need to cut off his shooting ability by developing a secondary option like attacking the MIDDLE of the defense. Attacking the paint provides FT attempts and assist opportunities. As for defense... oy vey. He is too weak to guard stronger SFs and too slow of foot to guard quicker SFs. He also really dislikes following his player into the paint. Which brings up my next point: where are the rebounds? Don't let the highlight reel putback fool you; Budinger can be labeled nothing but a mediocre to subpar rebounder given his size and leaping ability. His distaste for physicality leaves him on the perimeter, away from the boards all too often. I don't know if it is at Adelman's behest, but he is too eager to wait on the perimeter in hopes of leaking out instead of using his size to crash the boards. And for those of you that want to defend his shortcomings by pointing out that Budinger is not your typical white guy shooter, he has that ever desired athleticism (HE PLAYED VOLLEYBALL... I GET IT ALREADY), I beg you to take a closer look. Vertical leap does not equal out and out athleticism. He is fast (like a gazelle...) in the open court, but speed and quickness are too different things. His lateral quickness does not seem to be a gift of his... meaning I do not have high hopes for an extreme improvement with his on the ball defense or his ability to attack the paint. Admittedly, this is an overly harsh review, meant not to destroy our hope of Budinger developing into a viable talent, but only to squelch the daydreamers on this board. The organization has faith in him, and I do too. However, I see his ceiling more as a quality backup than starting SF. I am eager to see the strides he makes this year towards the deficiencies I highlighted. He's a young developing player, and I am not writing off his growth potential.
If he can develop into a solid backup. That's pretty much all the Rockets have asked of him anyway... And if he doesn't... as long as his skills don't regress... he's a pretty solid player as-is anyway. Win-win.
Battier is that you? Speaking of Battier, if Budinger doesn't have the required athleticism to be a starting SF, then I wonder how the current Battier does. Your concerns about Budinger can be applied to Battier as well, so who would you suggest to be the Houston Rockets starting SF?
Some say that trading Ariza allow Budinger to play more minutes?? My question is....why can't you put Budinger at the SG position?? You mean he doesn't fit?? i don't see why?? Lowry, Budinger, Battier, Patterson and Miller (PEFECT?) OR Lowry, LEE, Budinger, Patterson and Miller (i have to admit, i like this lineup better just because LEE can create shot for other and looking the other lineup, i don't think Budinger and Battier can create offense.
I clearly stated why I felt the desire to post this thread... not to debate whether Budinger can be a quality backup, but to speak reason to those on this board that think Budinger is the future at the SF spot. And we needn't get into Battier in this thread... his subpar athleticism was always overcome with a masters technicality, but as age and injury further deteriorates his athletic ability subpar becomes too nice a word. As many noted, the days of Shane being an incredible lock down defender seem to be in the rear view mirror.
Some people are treating C Lee like chop liver. I wouldn't be surprise if Lee did the same thing to Chase like he did to J.J. Reddick and take all his mintues.
Chase is still developing. All of the things you mentioned are things he will probably look to improve upon. He's in year two - be patient. (I got my popcorn out for DD's response to this thread)
Budinger attacked the rim more times and more effectively last season than Ariza or Battier. Budinger is the better shooter than Ariza or Battier Budinger plays his role with in the system Budinger has very underrated defense and played extremely well in each of his starts. Budinger has elite athleticism
Morey and Rick are both very high on Chase. That's enough for me. Miller/Pf of the day/Chase/Lee/Lowry is arguably the best 2nd unit in the NBA and our depth will allow us to compensate for injuries (better playoff seed) and also allow our starters to play with 100% effort without having to worry about a dropoff in production if they are resting. We are a very very solid team and one piece away from a championship run.
spot on assesstment of his current play....although i dont believe he should start now, i'm not sure he doesnt deserve to, or at least won't be put in the position, to start in the future. Offensively i think he can get away with what he is doing now, although i'd love to see him improve....defensively it's just not enough....that being said, i think its all in the rebounds. He's got height and vertical hops, solid arm length. This is the area he's got the most control over and can most realistically improve in. If he makes it a priority, he can average 6-7 rebs a game as a starter. That, paired up with his shooting and fast break athleticism, could get him a starting job in the right situation. By right situation i mean on a team like this that doesnt need him to create.
What this basically was? Is you list of your own personal reasons you would not like Budinger to be the starter here. Can i go make my long thread with a bunch of stats to back up that Budinger should beat out a old and declining former Defensive specialist who doesnt score half as well as Budinger could? I dont want to do that. I would rather break it up into smaller posts in the other threads like i have. This is like your thesis on Budinger and why "I dont want him to start ending" .
battier doesnt really rely on raw athleticism to be an effective defender .. he used a lot of hustle mixed with a lot of smarts and being in the right place ..
i dont know about those ...i'm pretty sure ariza drove more, but he probably messed up more, so bud win's on efficiency, but that's not saying much given the sample size and that ariza was more willing to do it against shot blockers. His defense isn't underrated...maybe by some here, but i think the majority know where he stands. Elite athleticism? Like the OP mentioned, there's more to that than vertical jumping and linear running, so i wouldnt go as far as elite because there's definitely players that have more and where would that put them? Super duper elite?
Well that will work itslef out. Battier will go down with some wear and tear and Budinger will end up starting by default. So i really dont need to discuss this. Then Battier will never get his job back. :grin:
Ahh the reading comprehension of this board stifles my desire to talk basketball. I know Chase is a decent backup. He can shoot and he likes to run which makes him an ideal partner to Lowry's attack attack attack mentality. Saying Chase attacked the rim more than Battier and Ariza is akin to saying my grandmother attacked the rim more than Battier and Ariza... it's a given. I also understand that Chase is developing player and even now he can be a very viable option as a SYSTEM player given his shooting ability. However, as an individual talent I seriously question whether certain aspects of his game can develop. His lack of physicality means minus rebounding, minus FT attempts. And this rehearsal of the term elite athlete makes me questions Morey's brainwash abilities. He can jump high... what else?
