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[Rox11]

Makes me miss Yao! Only what could have been..

[ItsMyFault]

Originally Posted by GreatOne1978 MJ didnt take as many 3s and long 2s as Kobe does, there was no zone defense back in the day & defenders were smaller. He had a physical edge at his position during that time period and thats why he was efficient

lol... This is a joke right?

If there wasn't a zone there were still players in the paint so it was harder to finish. Defenders may have been smaller but that doesn't mean the defense was any worse on Jordan.

Michael had bigger hands than Kobe, that's one of the few things you can say that lead to Michael having better efficiency.

The biggest one is that Michael took better shots, plain and simple. He didn't jack up or force shots, and he also opened him self up to better looks.

[UTKaluman597]

Originally Posted by GreatOne1978 I didnt know Wade had 5 or more titles doing what he does?

It always irks me that kobe gets as much credit for his rings as jordan. We've seen what kobe looks like without having a dominant inside presence on his team, and it aint good. Lakers before Pau were terrible and Kobe looked much more like TMac than Jordan. Lakers after Pau started slipping werent very good either, losing in the 2nd round.

MJ was the alpha dog on all of his championship teams.
Kobes first 3 titles are thanks to shaq. He was much more of a David robinson than a Tim Duncan on those teams. Kobe was certainly instrumental to those teams, but not a necessity for Shaq and Pjax to win. If you look up Kobes stats in the finals, his numbers are pretty damn bad and nowhere close to Jordan's numbers.

Oh and for the 3pt shooting comparisons. Jordan didnt HAVE to jack up 3s to score. And yes, the primary perimeter defenders were smaller in MJ's days, but the big men who patrolled the rim were MUCH more skilled/physical. If jordan played in todays league, in his prime, hed shoot 20 fts a game. Kobe is a GREAT scorer, one of the best. But overall, hes not even close to MJ.

[Icehouse]

Originally Posted by BleedsRocketRed That still doesn't answer his question. You made a very debatable statement

He doesn't want to answer the statement. Kobe fans would rather believe that it's harder to shoot a good % in this era. That's an easier pill to swallow than their guy just not being as good of a shooter. Wade, LeBron, Durant all shoot great %'s in this era of zone defense (even though they ran zones in MJ's day as well) and bigger defenders.

[Icehouse]

Originally Posted by GreatOne1978 I didnt know Wade had 5 or more titles doing what he does?

Kobe has only led a team to 1 more title than Wade has. Kobe has actually never had a playoff run/finals as good as the one Wade had in 06 either.

Now if we are simply ring counting, then Horry has 7 titles doing what he does.

[felixng2012]

Originally Posted by GreatOne1978 MJ didnt take as many 3s and long 2s as Kobe does, there was no zone defense back in the day & defenders were smaller. He had a physical edge at his position during that time period and thats why he was efficient

MJ was a vastly more efficient scorer than Kobe and a lot of it had to do with better shot selection. Also he was a better jump shooter. He had better athleticism and huge hands which also helped.

Today's rules also benefit guards more so you can't really say that MJ's era favored guards.

Really overall, Kobe is not close to MJ.

People can harp all they want about 5 rings but he only has 2 FMVPs.

[rox4lyf]

Damn, I wonder how many analysts at ESPN had to stay from dusk til dawn watching game after game and picking out identical games.

[amaru]

Originally Posted by rox4lyf Damn, I wonder how many analysts at ESPN had to stay from dusk til dawn watching game after game and picking out identical games.

0...they have interns for that.

[JMAD21]

Its obvious that Kobe tries to act like MJ, both on and off the court.

But there is no argument as to who is/was the better player!

Kobe is ONE of the greatest to ever play, MJ is THE greatest to ever play!

[jlwee]

Originally Posted by GreatOne1978 MJ didnt take as many 3s and long 2s as Kobe does, there was no zone defense back in the day & defenders were smaller. He had a physical edge at his position during that time period and thats why he was efficient

An 38 years old MJ still shot better FG% than Kobe's whole career.

[RedRedemption]

Originally Posted by t_mac1 At the beginning of his career, it was documented that Kobe even watched and studied MJ in his interviews. And that's why you see the similarities even in the mannerisms when Kobe talks, not just how he plays.

That's borderline psychopathic, and I'm no Kobe hater.

[mig0s]

i ****ing miss yao ming

[ItsMyFault]

@ 4:13


@ 2:02

[GreatOne1978]

Originally Posted by BleedsRocketRed That still doesn't answer his question. You made a very debatable statement

I didn't know Field Goal % was the ultimate indicator of a player's effectiveness. Pau Gasols FG% > Dirks and Duncans over the years does that mean Pau is better than those two? No

[GreatOne1978]

Originally Posted by ItsMyFault lol... This is a joke right? If there wasn't a zone there were still players in the paint so it was harder to finish. Defenders may have been smaller but that doesn't mean the defense was any worse on Jordan. Michael had bigger hands than Kobe, that's one of the few things you can say that lead to Michael having better efficiency. The biggest one is that Michael took better shots, plain and simple. He didn't jack up or force shots, and he also opened him self up to better looks.

Nope zone defenses made it harder for one on one scorers unless you have sharpshooters to keep the defenses honest and open up the middle. Just ask Shaq he hated it

http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?t=1931

[GreatOne1978]

Originally Posted by Icehouse Kobe has only led a team to 1 more title than Wade has. Kobe has actually never had a playoff run/finals as good as the one Wade had in 06 either. Now if we are simply ring counting, then Horry has 7 titles doing what he does.

I guess WCSF, WCF doesn't count? Kobe was the best player during a few of those series in the 3 peat run if you dont win those there is no Finals to beat up the (L)eastern Conference teams

[GreatOne1978]

Originally Posted by felixng2012 MJ was a vastly more efficient scorer than Kobe and a lot of it had to do with better shot selection. Also he was a better jump shooter. He had better athleticism and huge hands which also helped. Today's rules also benefit guards more so you can't really say that MJ's era favored guards. Really overall, Kobe is not close to MJ. People can harp all they want about 5 rings but he only has 2 FMVPs.

How is he not close to MJ when their points per field goal attempted is very similar?? Kobe takes harder shots because hes defended better but he's also a better maker of difficult and more pressured shots

[GreatOne1978]

Originally Posted by jlwee An 38 years old MJ still shot better FG% than Kobe's whole career.

why are you making up stats?

MJ at 38 41.6%
http://www.basketball-reference.com/...jordami01.html

Kobe shoots 45.3% for his career

[rolyat93]

Originally Posted by GreatOne1978 How is he not close to MJ when their points per field goal attempted is very similar?? Kobe takes harder shots because hes defended better but he's also a better maker of difficult and more pressured shots

Bottom line, no matter if Kobe piggy backs a couple more rings off Dwight, he's only been the best player on his team for 2.

[yahboyryan]

Originally Posted by Dreamin Jordan gets more hang time. The way his body moves in the air is like none other. They can try imitate but will never duplicate.

this.. ive noticed the same... Jordan > Kobe when it comes to hang time