Why My Opinion Is Changing...SOME

Nice piece Almu.

I personally will forever be grateful for JVG for helping us get rid of Stevie Franchise and landing us tmac. No other coach would have acomplished this great change for us. A mini statue of him should be errected at the TC just for this.

I will appreciate and love him forever for this. Our franchise is better for it as well.

Go Rox!

 

Overcoaching doesn't make you a good coach. I believe a big part of his 'success' in NY had to do with Sprewell. This is a guy who had just come off a huge suspension for choking his coach and was looking for a new life in the NBA. His reputation was on the line. A lot of teams were probably scared to take him on. NY (JVG) gave him a chance, therefore he played his guts out for him. When your best player buys into what you're preaching, you've got it made as a coach because everyone else falls in line. All coaches want basically the same things, it's getting players to listen that's the hard part. Sprewell had no choice but to listen to JVG.

 

Please stop bothering me with facts. I'm trying to make a point!

Seriously, that team was OK but they were an 8th seed. How great were they if they were the 8th seed in the East? Spree was a nice player, but was he as good as T-Mac?

Really all I'm trying to say is that JVG should adjust his style to his team, not the other way around. At this point, I just don't know if he's capable.

 

ID2k is correct, that team overacheived in the playoffs.

LJ was a shell of himself back then due to his chronic back problems - but he warriored his way to some big basketes in the playoffs.

Also, to include Chris Dudley on a list of players described as "very talented" like somebody did above is like including Mo Taylor on a list of "ferocious rebounders"

 

Hogwash !!!

Camby was hurt a ton under Riley and JVG. He is not a player that I would say JVG developed.

DD

 

the irony is that cat and steve were probably much more JVG type players, at least in terms of their heart, desire, effort, than Tmac.

 

while i do give credit to jvg for getting that team to the finals and do think they overachieved somewhat,

a) they weren't an 8th seed in the traditional sense. the east was starting it's mediocre trend and all of the teams just happened to be around the same level of mediocrity. the 1st seed Heat won 33 games, the 8th seed knicks 27. i think that's 54 and 45 in an 82 game season. there was hardly any spread in record. and it just so happened that the 1st seed was the team they matched up the best with (and that they beat on a lucky bounce on a shot with .8 left in game 5). someone had to win the conference from the mass of similar teams. now, credit goes to the team that is coached well enough and mentally strong enough to do it, but it wasn't like us getting to the finals through the west last year. also, weren't the knicks somewhat banged up in the regular season, holding their win total back? sort of the way we weren't really a 6th seed when healthy back in 95.

b) i think they played detroit or atlanta in the 2nd round. i'm pretty sure whichever made it (detroit?) was the most worthless second round team of all time. the atl/det series was the most shockingly mediocre playoff matchup of all time for my money. i think the knicks swept that round and they barely had to play well to do it.

c) they got trounced by the spurs, showing the east had already fallen pretty far.


nonetheless, a very nice run for jvg.

now fire him.

 

It's true.

 

Can anyone name any players other than Pippen on that Bulls team, whom the Knicks barely edged on a contravesial call? That year was not a good year for the East, MJ retired, the Pacers were on their way down, Shaq played his rookie season. JVG was just lucky to be at the right time.

 

I believe Toni Kukoc had his best season that year.
Luc Longley was still there.
BJ Armstrong I believe.


thats three

 

Horace Grant! He was their next best player. Steve Kerr. Mike's replacement was Peter Myers.

 

Well, he he had some huge games during the 99 playoffs and came up big at key times, so call it whatever you want to call it.

Anyway, I'm imagining your assessment of coach's player development ability is going to be whatever you arbitrarily say it is, so that doesn't surprise me that you see it differently. But Boki's not a superstar so it must be Van Gundy's fault.

 

Almu great stuff, I'm with you

 

Almu may be on to something here. JVG is an excellent coach who's saddled with a mishmash of a team assembled by an incompetent GM. It's so easy to point the fingers at JVG because he's out front every night and has the personality of a wet fish. But there is no doubt that the guy BREATHES basketball and knows his stuff. But as I have posted before, there's more than enough blame to go around here starting at the top of the organization and decisions that go back years.

JVG's biggest problem may be that he's not Rudy T and there's nothing that can be done to change that. What's truly sad is that I can see what JVG is trying to accomplish. If folks would just back off just a bit and look closely what you'll realize is that the coaching philosphies of JVG & Larry Brown are not all that dissimilar. Both are emphasizing the team ball concept - it's just that Detroit has Joe Dumars finding their players while JVG is stuck with whatever Carroll Dawson signs off the NBA scrap heap.

You could see the difference first hand last night : Detroit was missing a key player in Ben Wallace yet possessed enough depth to simply overwhelm the Rockets. Dumars' personnel moves have been simply stellar - can ANYONE here say the same thing about Dawson's?

It was a mistake to think that simply by adding T-Mac this pig (team) was suddenly transformed into a true contender. No folks, the rebuilding has begun and it's gonna get real ugly before it gets better especially if Dawson is still calling the shots. In fact, if that's the case, then there's a very real possiblity that the rebuilding may never end.

 

Okay, so JVG got his Knicks to get by a Bulls team with Pippen/Kokoc/Longley as the starters on a lucky call, that makes him a good coach? A good coach is the one who can survive any environment, make good use of the strength of his players. So far, JVG only proved that he didn't screw up the Knicks when inherited from Riley. I don't think that qualifies him as a ggod coach.

If he can turn this Rockets team around have them play up to their potential, then I'll be on his camp. I'm a Rockets' fan, so I'm cheering for him right now.

 

Will somebody please address how JVG is going to get fired when he has a multi-million, multi-year contract. We are all wasting our time if his departure is financially "impossible." And why would TMac sign an extension if there were "any" doubts about the status of the team or it's coach? JVG is not the kind of guy you just start disliking after a losing streak. He isn't that likeable, so Tmac surely knew what he was like before the extension.

 

that was the year pippen sulked and sat out the end of one game because the play was called for kukoc.

 

I don't think Camby improved much under JVG, he only had one good season in New York when he was health.

 

you bulls' roster talkers are about 5 years too early. that's the 94 bulls that played the riley led knicks. jvg's 99 team played after mj retired the second time and the bulls were broken up. the bulls were like 8-42 that year with elton brand leading the way.