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Western Conference hierarchy as of 7/24

Discussion in 'NBA Dish' started by steddinotayto, Jul 24, 2003.

  1. steddinotayto

    steddinotayto Contributing Member

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    With all the moves around the league lately, I've come to a no-brainer conclusion that the West will be tougher to get through and the rising teams like Houston and Golden State won't play a major role. This is MY Western Conference rankings:

    1. Lakers

    Positives: Adding 2 future HOF'ers that will do ANYTHING to get a ring is always considered a plus. Shaq is apparently working to slim down:rolleyes:. And their bench is better than last years (with Fisher coming off the bench along with George and Walton and maybe even Fox). If the Kobe fiasco doesn't cause any mental and physical breakdown amongst the players, the Lakers will roll through the season for the ring.

    Negatives: How will Kobe's trial affect the team and how many games might he miss? And no matter what people say, the clash of multiple egos will happen when the team isn't going into the right direction...which shouldn't happen much. And Shaq....his workouts will have to be exponentially decreasing his weight in order for him to get any mobility back. Their bench is better than last years but that's not saying much. Fisher, Fox, and George will get the minutes and Rush and Walton will have to make sure the bench is comfortable. And even though he's worn out, without Bob Horry, someone (i.e. Kobe) will have to make the clutch shots and bail the team out.

    2. Spurs

    Positives: Just when Houstonians thought that the Spurs woudln't get the last laugh...they sorta did. Getting Nesterovic was a slight improvement but becoming players in the mentioned deal on espn.com and getting Turkoglu and Mercer in return is great. PLUS Bob Horry will be back in Texas. This really puts a clamp on Stephen Jackson because the Spurs don't have to put much effort out since they have Hedo and Mercer as capable starting 2's...not to mention Ginobili. Hedo adds toughness and Mercer is capable of getting double digits in scoring. Not a bad offseason

    Negatives: Will Hedo, Mercer, an worn Horry, and Rasho be enough to go up against Malone, Payton, Kobe, and Shaq? Maybe..maybe not. The depth is there but with Shaq getting into shape :rolleyes: and GP and Malone on board....this isn't the same Lakers team from last season. It'll be more of a challenge this time around. If they don't beat the Spurs, many will play 'what if's' about Jason Kidd and maybe even Mourning being on the roster. And will Parker continue to improve or will Pops continue to give him an earful during every timeout. Things like that will make a guy crack.

    3. Timberwolves

    Positives: Cassell + Spreewell + Kandi-man = trip past 1st round of playoffs. A veteran core like that to help Garnett and Sczerbiak will do wonders. If egos don't collide in the lockeroom this team will do big things. A solid starting five with Troy 'I will take the Lakers on by myself' Hudson coming off the bench, this team will do some damage.

    Negatives: If tempers flares up...it'll be costly. Getting stats for everyone won't be an easy task since their new starting PG isn't known for passes. And after Hudson...they really don't have a deep bench...and you can probly even call their bench 'Dudi'.

    4. Mavericks

    Positives: Run run run and run some more. Everyone knows what they can do about now and it will still work. Even Van Exel is joining in on the scoring madness. A bench consisting of Van Exel, Najera, Bradley builds a formidable bench.

    Negatives: Cuban messing with Nelson like that. That's totally the wrong way to treat a coach that took a chance and drafted Nowitzki. And if they fall back into their offense-no-D style of play again, they'll be fodder once more. And that center issue: When you have to depend on a returning player like Mourning to compete in the West....you're in trouble. Hopefully they can move either Nash or Nick for a big man...

    5. Kings

    Positives: They still play the running O and play decent D and were basically one Webber knee away from getting their ring. Getting Brad Miller is a pretty good pickup since he can hold is own pretty well...well...not against Yao anyways haha. Jim Jackson, Bobby Jackson, and Keon Clark will BE their bench.

    Negatives: Shipping off Hedo to a rival?? How stupid is that. Losing Pollard for Miller might be an upgrade but Pollard did bring that toughness the Kings needed. And Webber....he needs to just be back in order for them to be competitive.

    6. Trailblazers

    Positives: If they can replay how they played against the Mavs, they might do more damage. A team like this that's focused will be dangerous (i.e. series against Mavs). They're stacked and they'll always be on the outside looking in waiting for that momentum to start.

    Negatives: Losing Pippen kills any sort of organized ball they had played. Sabonis? Hopefully he's still around because only him and Pippen made the team..a team. And with all those weed findings and suspensions and what not...like how it's been the past few years...it's not the style of play that's not getting them the ring...it's their motley crue personalities.

    7. Suns

    Positives: Having a mature Marbury, an athletic Amare and a versatile Marion on your team and you'll always be dangerous..then you add on Penny and Joe Johnson the Suns has a potent lineup. This team will go as far as Marbury's leadership can take them.

    Negatives: Amare, although an athletic monster, still needs to polish that game of his. Quite frankly, he's a version of a young Shawn Kemp but without most of the J. And athleticism can only take you so far. The Suns really need a bench. Outside of Outlaw and Joe Johnson they don't have much. Googs should just retire. Plus it's hard for Cinderella stories (i.e. them in the playoffs) to come back and give a good sequel.

    8. Rockets

    Positives: Jeff Van Gundy will run the kind of team that this city sorely needed--a disciplined and intelligent basketball team. Hopefully the players--mainly Francis and Cat-- will buy into the system. Yao will probably continue to put his best effort forward and the Franchise will continue to be...the Franchise.

    Negatives: If there was a way to combine Griffin and Taylor together to make one PF b/c one has what the other doesn't. Mix in Griffin's heigh, and defensive skills with Taylor's shooting and 'moves' and that would be one decent PF. And the bench...there's none to speak of.

    Well that's MY views of how the WC is shaping out to be.
     
  2. Drexlerfan22

    Drexlerfan22 Contributing Member

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    Mavericks ahead of Kings? Are you serious? The Kings only improved by getting Miller, and they would've beaten Dallas in the playoffs anyway if Webber hadn't gone down. Heck, even Minnesota over Sactown is iffy, but at least I can see it.

    Otherwise, good list.
     
  3. KingCheetah

    KingCheetah Contributing Member

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    Great post, I agree with just about everthing you have except for the Kings being a five. I'd switch them with the T Wolves and put an asterisk by the Lakers, because a normal season is unlikely with Bryant's rape charge. There is always the possibility his career is over, which is strange to think about. Many questions for the T Wolves I think they will be a good team, but not a three seed. They might have more difficulties with locker room attitudes than the Lakers-- how will Spree possibly be happy in Minn.? At least he will be starting at the 2 guard with plenty of minutes each game.
     
  4. PhiSlammaJamma

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    Can we give up Glenn Rice to get into the Eastern Conference? Please. Somebody.
     
  5. Desert Scar

    Desert Scar Contributing Member

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    Right now the Lakers are the clear #1, the Mavs are the clear #5. I'd put the Kings at #2 and SA at #3 (perhaps switch if the Spurs resign Jackson and get a decent back-up for the games Parker flounders), but honestly I think Minn could be the #2 by the end of next season.

    We are 8 for now, could make a run for 6 or 7 with resigning Posey plus a modest FA (Pike)--if we lose Posey and stand pat we are a pretty weak 8 IMO.
     
  6. robbie380

    robbie380 ლ(▀̿Ĺ̯▀̿ ̿ლ)
    Supporting Member

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    just curious do you think Sac with Webber was better than SA last year?
     
  7. bamaslammer

    bamaslammer Contributing Member

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    Good list, even if I disagree with you on the placement of the Mavs over Sac-town.
     
  8. GATER

    GATER Contributing Member

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    Realistically, you have to add either Brad Miller or Vlade to the "Bench Mob" since (barring injury) seldom will both be on the court at the same time.

    They deal Pollard and Hedo and still have a deep team. Miller, the Jacksons, Clark and Gerald Wallace is probably an EC playoff team (albeit second tier). And they own the rights to Bodiroga (although he'll never suit up for them).

    Personnaly, I'd put them ahead of Dallas and the TWolves.
     
  9. HillBoy

    HillBoy Contributing Member

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    Good list but with Posey now gone, I need to see proof that the Rockets can be competitive in the West. I feel that they will have to fight Seattle and possibly Memphis for that 8th playoff spot. I also need to see if JVG's offense will be effective in the West. It's not outside the realm of possibility that this is a lottery team once more.
     
  10. TheFreak

    TheFreak Contributing Member

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    Scar has a little bit of an anti-Spur bias, in case you hadn't noticed. ;)

    Webber is on the way down, Divac is older...Duncan on the way up. The Kings have done nothing this off-season that would move them ahead of the Spurs.
     
  11. MrSpur

    MrSpur Member

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    For the long term SA and Sacto have done well this summer. SA has their starting 5 set for Duncan's prime. LA and Minnesota's moves are short term at best, with next year being the best year for each team. Shaq's window is closing. Unless he radically changes his physical shape I don't see him playing in this league past age 35 and his skills are going to diminish.
     
  12. ricky-retardo

    ricky-retardo Contributing Member

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    Being from Sacramento I agree with his placement of the Kings. The Kings, from the info on sports radio, are going to move Clark to save salary and might not be able to sign Jackson. If these moves happen depth could become a problem. Their only reliable man off the bench is B Jackson. Webber will most likely be unavailable for the start of the season because of knee surgery.
    Wallace is athletic but he can not shoot a jumper beyond 10 feet to save his life.
     
  13. Rocketman95

    Rocketman95 Hangout Boy

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    You may be a lousy Kings' fan, but you've got the funniest moniker on this board! :D
     
  14. ricky-retardo

    ricky-retardo Contributing Member

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    Thank you. I am not a Kings fan, I hate them but i do see a lot of their games. The Rockets are my team. Thank god for Directv.
     
  15. Deuce

    Deuce Context & Nuance

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    My initial thoughts.

    1) Lakers - Payton and Malone additions put them at the top
    2) Spurs - Robinson out, Rasho in. Hedo, Mercer, Horry add to the bench. Have championship experience now.
    3) Kings - Brad Miller was a STEAL! Championship window is now more wide open.
    4) Wolves - Sprewell, Kandi, Cassell are huge additions. Especially Sprewell who gives them a 2 guard that can DEFEND against the Kobe's of the league.
    5) Mavs - No moves as of yet, and slip below the Wolves. Inside is just too soft. Lost out on Mourning, Kandi and Miller!
    6) Portland - Lose Pippen but still loads of talent.
    7) Rockets - JVG will have the team playing harder, will not lose as many of those games against lesser opponents thus our record will be better.
    8) Suns - Big three gets better, but not much added to the team.

    Seattle - still has major holes in the front court which prevent this team from going to the next level.
    Clippers - have a lot to prove with their talent. Can they get it together?
    Warriors - Arenas was a big loss. Claxton is nice but wont make up for it.
     
  16. Live

    Live Member

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    Good list.

    I think the T-Wolves, Kings, and Mavs are pretty much tied at 3, which is pretty much what you wrote. 6-8 is completely wide-open, the Sonics have just as good a chance at making a playoff run as those 3 teams.
     
  17. Kayman

    Kayman Contributing Member

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    1. Sacto (provided they keep J.Jackson). The Kings have had bad luck with injuries two years in a row. They are the best team in the league when healthy and they ar due to be healthy. Brad Miller is a huge addition. Turkoglu is the MOP (most overrated player) in the league.

    2. Minnesotta. They have the best player in the league and the best coach in the league. They've been doing great with a bunch of journeymen and has-beens like Kendall Gill and Rod Strickland. Now, finally they have the supporting cast. Rasho Nesterovich is a runner up for MOP. Kandi is due for a good year. Spree gives them teeth and Cassel knows about winning. Depth upfront is somewhat of a concern with the departure of Joe Smith and Marc Jackson. I think E. Johnson is still servicable.

    3. Lakers. They woud be #1 if not for the Kobe factor. Also, I'd expect Payton and Malone to save some juice for the playoffs.

    4. San Antonio. This team overachieved last year, they are due for a bit of a letdown. Bruce Bowen is NOT a 40% shooter from 3pt., last year was an abberation. Their additions suck: they get the MOP and the MOP runner-up. Horry will help, but not in the regular season. Last year they somehow kept low profile, now everyone will be getting up for them.

    5. Dallas. Take away their 14-0 start and they were rather mediocre the rest of the year. Defense and toughness is still an issue. Still they are light years away from #6.

    6. Suns. You'll see improvement from Amare, J.Johnson and Voksul. This team is on the rise.

    7. Rockets. I was going to put them #6 before the Posey fiasco. It's a tough conference and #7 is a success that comes from improvements in Yao and Griffin as well as better coaching. (this is not a slam to Rudy but to Mr.Mean who took a team well into the playoff picture and managed not to get there)

    8. Warriors. The performance of this team last year was getting better and better. After years of injury problems and sitting on the bench, I think this is the year Speedy Claxton plays to his potential and leads the Warriors to the playoffs. J-Rich must be in shape though.

    9. Portland. This team is going down. Too much disfunction. Sabas and Pip are gone and both were major contributors last year. It's time to rebuild.

    10. Sonics. Good shooters on the team, but soft and injury prone.

    11. Clippers. In the East they would be in the playoffs.

    12. Grizzlies. Grizz have 20 (!) players under contract for next year. In the East they would be in playoff contention.

    13. Denver. Major progress on the roster with Andre and Carmello. Still holes remain.

    14. Utah. Yeah Babeeeee
     
  18. steddinotayto

    steddinotayto Contributing Member

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    Thanks for the comments and criticisms guys. But I honestly think that even with Brad Miller, the Kings won't make that MUCH of an improvement. Miller is a good player no doubt, but moving into the West DOES have ramifications. Remember how Yao totally abused him last season? If a rookie (ok a 7 5" rookie) can do that to him what happens when he goes up against Shaq, Duncan, and the like? I think Divac will still be their best center but of course they'll have to start Miller some time. And if Miller comes off the bench that's basically 60 mil going to waste. I really think that the Kings' opportunity is over with. If the Mavs keep playing D the way they did most of last season (and not like how they were in the playoffs) they really ARE better than the Kings. Realistically, any one of their big 4 (dirk, nash, finley, van exel) can go off on your for 40. Kings? well lets just say Bibby and Bobby Jackson better be on.

    But thanks for your comments guys. I hoped that my list didn't piss anyone off.
     
  19. MrSpur

    MrSpur Member

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    Minnesota & Sacto ranked higher? Get real. There's a reason SA "overachieved" last year. His name is Tim Duncan. He's in SA for the next 7 years. Get used to it.
     
  20. Desert Scar

    Desert Scar Contributing Member

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    I had picked the Kings at the start of the playoffs and had not seen anything before the Webber's injury to think otherwise. Honestly it would have been a hell of series--6 or 7 games, SA easily could have won, but so coud have the Kings.


    Freak may not remember, but while him and others were all saying SA was THE threat to the Lakers 2 years ago I was saying no (post the DA-SS trade and Bibby-JW trades--before that I did say the Spurs were #2), that the Kings now become the chief rival. Turned out the Kings were the better match that year and really had the series won. We will never know last year b/c Webber went down--but I don't think any reasonable persons wouldn't conclude a full strength Kings team could have won either of the last two years.

    BTW I am no Kings fan, I just don't go for "since the Spurs are from Texas if the Rockets are out I must jump on their bandwagon" perspective. TD is the best player in the league right now, bar none.

    See Spurman himself recognizes the Kings could be a challenge, unlike The "I think Webber really sucks too much to ever want him to be be a Rocket" Freak ;)

    I think it is too soon to rate the Lakers, Kings and Spurs. If Kobe is in jail it is going to be a dogfight year. I think the Spurs have some work left to do this offseason, if they get a good back-up PG (Best?) I might put them at #2. But both the Spurs and Kings need to look out for the Wolves. That is a team both with offensive and defensive firepower now. It is the Mavs who have been left in the dust by not addressing their interior defense.
     
    #20 Desert Scar, Jul 24, 2003
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2003

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