1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

The Benching of James Harden by the Coach Kevin McHale

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by Carl Herrera, Nov 5, 2013.

  1. Apache

    Apache Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2013
    Messages:
    413
    Likes Received:
    5
    battom line is, the clippers play better team defense and the rockets is not.
     
  2. Fyreball

    Fyreball Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2009
    Messages:
    14,956
    Likes Received:
    12,238
    Meh, it was one game, and he was probably hungover after going out in his hometown. Chalk it up to some immaturity, learn from it, and move on. It's a long season, and it's better to have these experiences early in the season rather than later. I'm glad McHale made no bones about the benching, and was up front about the whole thing. Harden is still young, and his prone to mistakes like this. Let's not make it bigger than it needs to be. Luckily for the entire team, there's a game tonight where they can get last night out of their minds quickly.
     
  3. caneks

    caneks Rookie

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2007
    Messages:
    1,473
    Likes Received:
    226
    A good decision by Coach Kevin McHale. Everybody needs to earn his minutes.
     
  4. KlutchQT

    KlutchQT Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2013
    Messages:
    9,156
    Likes Received:
    4,288
    Where is he getting a pass?
     
  5. FoOLiSh_AzN

    FoOLiSh_AzN Member

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2008
    Messages:
    2,131
    Likes Received:
    57
    Yeah harden, played badly but he wasn't the only one on the team that played bad. Rockets gotta get better defensively on the perimeter. But it's a long season Rockets will get better. Rockets were in LA, Harden is from LA, maybe he had too much homecoming fun the night before the game? ;)

    But on to harden, this is what pisses me off about harden, this guy is really talented but he doesn't seem apply himself to the fullest of his abilities. He just seems really lazy sometimes, on offense and defense. Not moving on offense, iso's 1v1 showoff (like a pick up game at the park/gym), no hustle, doesn't play defense unless he is match up against a marquee star. (and no im not saying this just because of 1 clipper game, been saying this since last season)
     
  6. Little Bit

    Little Bit Member

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2008
    Messages:
    7,144
    Likes Received:
    6,013
    The Blazers are playing well. It will not be an easy out.
     
  7. daoshi

    daoshi Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2002
    Messages:
    3,021
    Likes Received:
    75
    Did McHale criticize Harden's defense, or effort, or anything at all about his terrible play? Harden is the star of the team, the coaches won't dare to say a thing bad about him, that's the life of NBA, a star run league.

    So just don't bring up this "coach is fair to everyone" crap.
     
    #107 daoshi, Nov 5, 2013
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2013
  8. torocan

    torocan Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2012
    Messages:
    4,228
    Likes Received:
    436
    It's more than just lazy. Harden was literally losing his man time and again, without being screened off or being crossed over.

    Check this video...

    <iframe width="640" height="360" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/NIyiEc1741s" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

    From 0:42 onward, you can literally see Harden completely losing track of his man multiple times. Riddick abused him silly, and it wasn't because Riddick is the 2nd coming of Steph Curry.

    This wasn't great Clippers offense on those plays, just fundamental defensive errors.

    Not watching his man, poor stance, bad court positional awareness, losing his guy in traffic, cutting the wrong way around other players, standing flat footed and not even attempting to close out on his man.

    All the basics they drill into you in High School, but somehow completely absent last night.

    This isn't something you fix easily. Some players have a defensive mindset and desire, some don't. And it's not something you can just turn on/off. This is going to take a lot of work both in terms of Harden and the Coaching staff.

    I really hope they start addressing this, otherwise we're going to be playing 4 on 5 on the defensive end every time we run into a competent team.
     
    1 person likes this.
  9. Nook

    Nook Member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2008
    Messages:
    54,308
    Likes Received:
    113,143
    No, you do not want to reward a player that is not giving 100% effort, especially one that is 24 years old and capable of getting 30 points a game. This is about something bigger than a game against the Clippers. You have a very talented, young player testing his boundaries and McHale needs to step in and stop it. Luckily McHale tried the same thing as a player, and has worked with a number of talented players and knows when to step in.
     
  10. FoOLiSh_AzN

    FoOLiSh_AzN Member

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2008
    Messages:
    2,131
    Likes Received:
    57

    yeah, its a star run league...who goes first (fired/traded) the coach or stars like howard, harden? the coach.

    Last season, I can see Mchale gets really frustrated in Harden's play, especially what he calls "sticky ball" but he knows this is harden's team. Tough position for the coach when he wants the ball to move, and the star of the team is doing the opposite.
     
  11. Carl Herrera

    Carl Herrera Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2007
    Messages:
    45,153
    Likes Received:
    21,570
    To be clear: This post isn't about whether Harden is an elite player or not. He is. He just had a particularly bad night on both ends of the floor. It's happened before and will happen again, though chances are it won't happen all that often.

    Also, I wouldn't have had a problem with McHale calling Harden back in during the 4th quarter, either. It's a judgment call and all coaches can do is make an educated guess as to how good the guy is going to be for his next stint. On one hand, we know Harden is very good overall. On the other hand, we saw him play bad basketball for the first 3 quarters.

    Will he be good if McHale had played him in the 4th? 50% chance? We've seen him and other guys do well after starting off or even playing most of the game badly before. Then again, guys sometimes just suck all game. A coach just gotta look at the evidence and make his best guess.

    It might work out, it might not. The point is that either decision wouldn't be totally unreasonable and don't necessarily have to be attributed to bias, stupidity or insanity-- and this is true in the case of James Harden last night or in cases where Jeremy Lin didn't play the 4th last year.
     
  12. jtr

    jtr Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2011
    Messages:
    7,470
    Likes Received:
    275
    Does McHale seem like a person that would suck up to anyone? There was an implicit rebuke of Harden in the fourth quarter. I feel sure the explicit rebuke occurred shortly after the game.
     
  13. domd221

    domd221 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2012
    Messages:
    199
    Likes Received:
    8
    The moment I saw Harden chucking shots up is the moment I thought McHale wouldn't bring him back in. He just made little boneheaded mistakes. One instance I can recall was chucking up a 3 early in the clock when he should've held the ball for the last shot in the 3rd, instead he missed it and it led to 2 points for the Clips before the end of the period.
     
  14. fuzzthetone

    fuzzthetone Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2013
    Messages:
    62
    Likes Received:
    0
    His ankle was sprained and knee was jerked...and he was still ridden by mchale like crazy...if harden got injured like Rose, our season is pretty much over...I hope him to rest until he is 100 percent. We need him to be healthy!
     
  15. Nook

    Nook Member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2008
    Messages:
    54,308
    Likes Received:
    113,143
    Because the Rockets showed a lack of effort and urgency.
     
  16. ROXTXIA

    ROXTXIA Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2000
    Messages:
    20,068
    Likes Received:
    11,768
    Someone mentioned and I have to concur, Harden probably partied too hard last night in his hometown and didn't show up to play. (paraphrasing)

    You can see these games where he's lethargic and dead-legged in the first half and later usually rights the listing ship.

    Today it didn't happen.

    Granted, McHale plays him too many minutes, and Harden had twisted his ankle the game before.

    But Harden seriously needs to focus on what is important. The team is trying to build something big. The young-man-have-fun routine will bring down the team.

    McHale probably won't say anything to Harden: "Gosh, jeepers, I mean, can I get you a snow cone? Would that help?"

    Make pit bull Sampson talk to him: "Maybe J.J. Redick can be on the All Star team instead of you. 26 points. 26 points!"

    Pile on, tell me it's just his ankle, that I'm making something out of nothing.
     
  17. Francis3422

    Francis3422 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2000
    Messages:
    8,018
    Likes Received:
    5,705
    Harden was pathetic last night on the defensive end. I have to think it is the ankle.

    I am actually surprised that ankle injury didn't keep him out a few games. It looked bad at the time.

    I thought Lin and Parsons were also not good last night though. We just have to commit to being a better defensive team than that. I really think Josh Smith could have worked nicely on this team.
     
  18. FlyingBeagles

    FlyingBeagles Member

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2012
    Messages:
    95
    Likes Received:
    8
    Credit Coach McHale for sending a message to his star and the rest of the team that bad plays won't be rewarded with playing time. This will be huge to hold each player accountable.

    McHale was clearly outcoached by Doc Rivers whose main strategy was to attack Harden's lack of D to rattle him off on the offensive end. McHale should also counter by attacking CP3 aggressively with Lin and AB so he'd also be less comfortable on the offensive end.

    That's okay. Hope coaches and players learn from this lesson and devise a counter strategy on the revenge game on Nov 9.
     
  19. roxallways

    roxallways Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2008
    Messages:
    16,860
    Likes Received:
    9,418
    Listening to 610 and they just made a good point. You rarely hear about other elite players not giving a full effort, whether they are having an off game or not. To much is given, much is required. If you have been anointed a top ten player in this league, there is no excuse for you to be going out there giving the effort like Harden did. Like they just said on the radio, they'll just be first round fodder if Harden, one of their best players, has issues of effort. I'm thankful Harden is here and he was the catalyst to bring this team back into contention, but his play last night really bothered me. He better come bare minimum with a MUCH better effort tonight. If he doesn't, if I was McHale, Harden wouldn't see the floor for most of the game. Unacceptable.
     
  20. AggNRox

    AggNRox Member

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2003
    Messages:
    3,284
    Likes Received:
    59
    I don't like benching strategy. if really need to bench one of core players, you need to do earlier. at the end, you still need to insert him back to try to win. when within 9 pts in 4th qt, harden should be inserted back.
     

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now