Only non believers think Popovich is better coach than Rudy T. Only non believers think any of Duncan's teammate was better than OT or Drexler. Only non believers puts one player over team and call Hakeem's teammates scrubs. True Rockets fan acknowledge that Duncan is better Hakeem and praise the greatest supporting three point role players and Mad Max.
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I'm surprised Clutch hasn't shut this down. The fact this is even being debated is comical. Or sad. Or both. Tim Duncan is a GREAT player. Has been for a long time. He will be in the Hall Of Fame. Hakeem Olajuwon is on a completely different level. You can compare all the stats you like. They are close. But, be sure to look at how each performed IN THEIR PRIMES in the playoffs - no, not in a two year span. Try looking at over a 12 year period - starting with each's second year in the league. Yes, Duncan played in more games - had a more consistent organization and better teams throughout those years. That's not debatable. Dream was one of the few who elevated his game in the playoffs. Most notably, his EFFECIENCY. Duncan's shooting percentages dropped in the playoffs while Hakeem's increased. This, while during many of those playoff games, he was the entire focus of the defense. Time and time again, the Rockets would drop it in to Dream and let him go to work... over, and over again. The pressure that comes with that - in the playoffs - is huge. And Dream elevated his game, against the best. His ability to focus and take his game up a notch or two is legendary. No, not just in the championship years - although that was remarkable to watch. Check out what he did during his early years in the playoffs. Unbelievable. I'm not going to argue with someone who would even THINK to try and put Duncan on Hakeem's level. Robert Horry said it best (posted earlier in this thread). This, from a player who played with both and played against both - respected and liked both. He speaks the truth. "No way in hell..." Was he immature early on? Certainly. More from frustration than selfishness, however. No one can know how each would have acted if they'd been in the other's shoes - considering the differences in organizations, coach's, teammates, etc. Has the way Duncan's career has been managed helped his longevity? No question. That combined with the fact that today's athlete's are playing - in their primes - longer explains that, however. It's just a fact. Hagler and Leonard were considered way past their primes at 32 and 30 when they fought. Mayweather is still considered in his prime or close to it at 36. Bernard Hopkins is winning titles at FORTY-EIGHT. So don't think that has nothing to do with the effectiveness of Duncan at 37. Advancements! I tell you what.... IF YOUR LIFE DEPENDED ON WINNING A GAME - be it at Ruckers or Fonde or on an NBA court with real refs... and you had a bunch of guys you didn't know and Dream and Duncan...and you had first pick... who are you gonna' pick? Thank you. End of story. That tells you who was the BETTER PLAYER. If you were a GM and your life depended on winning a series, with both being in their prime - and you had your pick of the two to start your team with role players to fill the remaining slots - who are you gonna' take? If you even beging to DEBATE it, you don't know basketball very well. You simply are arguing for the sake of arguing or being a troll, because anyone who watched both would without question take Dream - especially if their life depended on winning a game, or series. If you want to argue who has had the better CAREER, that's debatable. Who the better PLAYER was is simply not.
Going through your "contemporaries" the way Dream did, in a 24 month period, (Robinson, Shaq and Ewing) - and either outplaying them or simply dominating them on the biggest of stages, is extremely rare. Very few can who have played the game can come close to a run like that.
you must be following me like the pied piper. A guy who doesn't respect the Rockets history isn't a Rockets fan in my book. Maybe your book is different.
Spurs beat the Cinderella Knicks in a short season. The freakin' Nets. Detroit was decent. And a weak Cavs team with a young LeBron After the first one he had the fortune of having Tony Parker and Ginobili. If anything, Hakeem did more with less and that in my mind cements his legacy. Duncan has potentially 2 HOFers in his crew. Drexler was on the backside of his career already. If anything, the Spurs should send Beverley a thank you card for even making it in.
Duncan would've had better stats without Manu, Parker, Robinson and Pop's system of ball sharing. Even Pop said he held Duncan back. Duncan was one of the most well-rounded skilled big-man rookie ever. On the other hand, Hakeem would have won more rings and rightly dueled with MJ as the greatest ever had we had a better supporting cast and got a second all-star earlier. Duncan is the model of consistency all FOs want to build around. Just look at his career record. But I'd still take Hakeem.
He had a great supporting cast. His first one had Ralph Sampson, Lewis Loyd and Mitchell Wiggins. The NBA screwed Loyd and Wiggins, and Sampson had a career threatening injury DONT FORGET 86.
If you're looking at the teams Spurs faced in NBA finals matchups, they aren't nearly as competitive as the ones they faced in Western Conference Finals those years. The Trailblazers, Mavs, Suns, and Utah Jazz were their opponents in the Conference finals and all those teams were very good. They also played in the era with what I consider a top 3 greatest team of all time, the Shaq/Kobe Lakers. Also, the Sacramento Kings in the early 2000s, even though they never made it to the Finals, were probably among the greatest teams of all time (just got screwed because they had to play the Lakers every year). Comparing Olajuwon to Tim Duncan is like comparing Wilt Chamberlain to Bill Russell. Chamberlain had it all, but Russell just seemed to find a way to will his team to championship after championship. The better comparison is Shaq (after meeting Phil Jackson) to Tim Duncan. Shaq is probably the closest thing to Wilt when it comes to physically dominating his era. He won 2 rings in LA and 1 tagalong ring with the Heat. But if the Spurs win this year, Tim Duncan will have 5 rings and they are not of the Robert Horry nature. The Spurs win when Tim Duncan is on his game and he is having one of his best seasons in his career this year. Yes, Olajuwon and Shaq are way better athletes and are more skilled players at their position, but Tim Duncan has the it-factor that allows him to will his team to victory discretely and under the radar. You can say he had the better teams to play on, but Robinson never won any titles without him and Parker (late first rounder) and Ginobili (second rounder) were not mercenaries brought in to help him win like Clyde the Glyde. They were low draft picks that probably got to where they are because they got to be on Tim Duncan's team. I hate the Spurs as much as the next guy, but Duncan is among the most over looked players in NBA history when ranking the best ever. He is a modern day Bill Russell and someday basketball historians will draw the comparisons too.
Dream had 4-5 good years where in my opinion he should be considered the best center ever, however Duncan has had a full career of being one of the best.
Duncan is on a team in the past few years where the offense was not based on him and the best player is tony parker. This is one reason is career is obviously extended. That's due to Pop and the Spurs organization. The Lakers are trying to transfer to Dwight for the same reasons, however we know how that story went. Shaq with Miami was not the same dominant guy, Wade was their best player. Dream had to deal with Steve Francis.
Of course, but I disagree on the objectivity part...since Hakeem was a much more dominant player. If he traded place with Olajuwon: 1. Do you think Duncan at the age of 31 (or in his best years) would've effectively taken Patrick Ewing out of the series in the 1994 NBA Finals? 26.85 ppg and 10.5 rebounds 2. Do you think Duncan at the age of 32 (or in his best years) would've thoroughly obliterated David Robinson in the 1995 Western Conference Finals? 35.3 ppg and 12.5 rebounds 3A.Do you think Duncan at the age of 23 (or in his best years) would've outplayed Kareem Abdul-Jabbar (who was still very good center) in the 1986 Western Conference Finals? 31.6 ppg and 11.2 rebounds 3B. Do you think Duncan at the age of 23 (or in his best years) would've beaten 1985-86 Los Angeles Lakers with the 1985-86 Houston Rockets squads (in place of you know who)? 4. Do you think Duncan at the age of 32 (or in his best years) would've been able to lead a team back from 3-1 deficit to win a series against the heavy favorite 59 win Phoenix Suns? 5. Do you think Duncan at the age of 32 (or in his best years) would've been able to beat the 94-95 Jazz, Suns, Spurs, and Magic in consecutive rounds. I caution that in the last two rounds, he would've been matched up against David Robinson with Dennis Rodman and Shaq with Horace Grant? Focusing on Duncan himself, how many times did you see him dominate Kevin Garnett, Amare Stoudemire, Dirk Nowitzki, Karl Malone (older), Rasheed Wallace, Pau Gasol, Zach Randolph, Chris Webber, Jermaine O'Neal or Chris Bosh. Especially in a playoff series. But some of the posters claim he's a center, ok. How many times did you see Duncan dominate Shaq, Yao Ming, Dwight Howard, Andrew Bynum, Ben Wallace, Marc Gasol, Al Horford, Vlade Divac, or do I need to dig deeper into the more mediocre pool of centers.
Anyone who watched both Hakeem Olajuwon and Tim Duncan play the game of basketball and conclude that Duncan was the better player is not an objective fan. He or she does not understand the game well enough or never saw Dream play. Duncan is a top 10 player of all time, but Dream is top 5. Wake me up when Duncan had entire defenses doing whatever they could to stop him, or Duncan was the best shot blocker of all time. And Dream did his work with a team full of only role players. Duncan has had Parker and Ginobili for the last decade.
Parker late first rounder and Ginobili was a second rounder. There is an argument that they are who they are because of Duncan and Popovich. If the game is fantasy basketball, then yeah, Olajuwon is definitely better.
