His argument is that Hakeem takse the court time away from our other quality big men (I think...) - but doesn't it HELP them to have the best center of all time out there on the court? Doesn't it help them to be able to practise against him? Won't it make them better defensive players because they see the way Dream does things? And the chance to play on the court WITH him - won't that do wonders for their self confidence? Tell me this rocketexpert, a rookie comes into the league and sits on the bench, for what purpose? Is it to LEARN? Personally I think sitting and watching is an invaluable tool - playing is also good, but being able to spend time seeing one of the best ever plying their craft should not be understimated!! Plus I still don't get why we're going to have to CUT someone (as your original post suggested) ------------------
some expert. if you were an expert you would atleast wait until the season was underway to start judging dream, he is an icon here, and should go out on his own terms,and him not playing in his final season isnt going to help anybody out, but maybe other teams in this division. ------------------ johnny "red" kerr:i'm glad the bulls did'nt draft steve francis. dan roan: why!!!!! johnny red kerr:because he would forever be compared to michael jordan.
...besides if Dream goes it ain't like we're gettin' anybody great this year regardless.(Wilt's dead & Kareem's lookin' for a jobby job). WE OWE THIS TO DREAM. I'd have us lose 10 more seasons (well maybe 5) to NOT see us stab the man in the back, Remember, He is also our FRANCHISE. ------------------
See, thats where you and I are different 'expert. I see having Hakeem around our young players as a positive thing, not negative. Young players have to earn their minutes, not just have them given to them. One of the reasons I put "FACTS about Hakeem Olajuwon's Retirment" on my web page ws precisely for times like this. Go check it out at http://rocketdavo.tripod.com ------------------ Current Rocket's Salary & Contract Info
Davo, you need to learn how to formulate an argument. You said- "I see having Hakeem around our young players as a positive thing, not negative" I never said that having Dream around the young guys was a negative. He could teach them every practice. Davo, try not to put words in other people's mouths. Brahma Rocket- You missed my point entirely. I agree that Dream has earned the right to do as he pleases, but we are in a rebuilding mode, and that means the young guys have to PLAY, not sit and watch. Dr. Nuegebuer- How does a rookie benefit from watching Dream get whipped by half the centers in the NBA? Did anybody learn anything when Dream was bested last year by Doleac, Ewing(!?!), and Robinson? Dream is a shell of his former self, and I hate to see him go out this way. He deserves better. ------------------
Expert- Your argument is way off base here and not very logical. You are saying that Hakeem should RETIRE because he is going to take away time from either Los, THomas, Collier, or Cato. Well, trust me, all 4 of those guys are going ot be on the team whether HAkeem retires or not. Now before you start yelling about how Im misinterpreting what youre saying, Im not. Im not saying HAkeem should get valueable minutes over those guys, Im just syaing he doesnt have to retire. It wont help the team or those young guys at all. If you were going to make that kind of argument, it shoud be...for the good of the team, HAkeem shouldnt get many minutes. There is no need to retire just to save a roster spot for players that are going to be on the roster anyways. Secondly, this is all about winning. ANd Hakeem is still better than all 4 of those guys. MAybe the athleticism of Cato puts him ahead of HAkeem, but when healthy, HAkeem can still ball. Sure, he may not be healthy all the time, but he can go on the IR and there will be another roster spot opened up for some 12th man scrub who isnt going to get any time anyway. ------------------ Jackie Treehorn treats objects like women!
You know, I cannot remember a thread that Rocket Expert has begun that has not gotten harsh criticism. I have an idea for you Rocket Expert: Log out. Take a week off. Come back. Register a new username. Start a logical, original thread that hasn't been hashed over hundreds of times. Pretend none of this ever happened. All in favor, say "AYYYYEEE!!" ------------------ HOOP-T ------------------
AYYYEEE!!! I agree Rocket Expert isn't much of an expert. First Charles, and now Hakeem. And wasn't he the guy who said Horry outplayed Croshere in the Finals? ------------------ Looking for next year's Dan Langhi? Draftsource.net Vote in the 64 player 1 on 1 NBA Tournament! http://bbs.clutchcity.net/ubb/Forum2/HTML/000958.html
AYYYYEEEEEE!!!! But Mr. Expert dont u think Hakeem will atleast help us defensively. Cato can learn alot from Hakeem. Also Hakeem will be able to hold his own against everyone except Shaq and Duncan. And who doesnt get whooped by Shaq and Duncan. To say Hakeem is hindering our younger players from developing is completely baseless. He is going to help us next year, and help develop our young big men for the future. ------------------ Fun Police Says: 1. Posting in appropriate forums Sucks! 2. Grammar and sentence structure are not FUN! 3. Duplicate threads are really FUN! 4. Conduct yourself in a FUN way! The Fun Police are Watching. Eat MANGOES & Have FUN or be Assimilated.
The team will be better without Dream!! We will have better transition defense, and a better running game when he is gone. Dream no longer helps this team, and its a shame. ------------------
Can't we all get along? And as I start looking up at the last post I start to get sick....'tank tank tank'...no thank you, not when your team could very exciting and have a chance(even if 'some thing minimum)at getting into the playoffs. As far as Hakeem going to go out on bottom, if we are able to get to playoffs I'm sure just a showing or 1st round taste of the playoffs for Hakeem would put a very sweet taste in his mouth, and satify him, going out on TOP, or middle if you like.... Hakeem for president? Oh no that was Charles..... ------------------
Only running game does not make a championship team. Ask Phoenix. With Hakeem we can be like the Knicks, except we have a bad ass pg to along with it. And the Knicks have been a pretty good team Hakeem will definitely help defensively. ------------------ Fun Police Says: 1. Posting in appropriate forums Sucks! 2. Grammar and sentence structure are not FUN! 3. Duplicate threads are really FUN! 4. Conduct yourself in a FUN way! The Fun Police are Watching. Eat MANGOES & Have FUN or be Assimilated.
Did anybody learn anything when Dream was bested last year by Doleac, Ewing(!?!), and Robinson RocketExpert, Forgive me for interjecting facts into this thread, but let's take a look at the stats for the only head to head match up between Hakeem and Doleac last year: Doleac: 4pts (2-7),2 reb, 0 ast,0 stl,0 blks Hakeem: 16pts(6-15),8 reb,0 ast,6 stl,3 blks. Yeah, I guess you're right, Doleac really smoked Hakeem good. Let me guess, people consider Doleac as the 2nd best center in the east after Morning? ------------------
nobody stops hakeem except hakeem's injuries. I think an old hakeem is better than a beefed up Cato. Hakeem can still create his own shots where Cato needs someone to dish it to him. Hakeem had a 31 point game last year, so that proves he can still get it done if he is healthy. If he is not healthy then he will be on IR and those "solid" big men will get their playing time. But if he is healthy, then we will all be happy during the playoffs because we can watch the beloved rockets whoop some laker butt. I can't wait for the season to start. ------------------
Expert... Having a healthy Hakeem on the team does not make us worse, but much better. He solidifies our half court defense and can teach Cato alot. How many center/powerforwards actually play transition defense anyways? Transition defense is about the PG, SG, and SF getting down the court to stop the opposing team from running. Cat... Yea, this is the same guy. ------------------ [This message has been edited by BayouRocket (edited August 03, 2000).]
A dream who can't breath is still better than Thomas, Cato, Collier or Thomas. None of these guys will ever be half the player Dream is. Also with a healthy Dream we could be a playoff team next year, and as much as I would love a lottery pick I realize we have some picks coming from trades in the next couple of years which shopuld enable us some improvements on our roster. No we will not win our division, but if we can get into the playoffs anything can happen. One injury to Shaq or Duncan or Sheed can completely kill the major players in the West. ------------------
RocketExpert wants arguments that really impact the points that he brings up. He's gonna get them: Hakeem Retirement Myths . . . 1. Hakeem's presence on the roster takes away a spot for a big man that will be cut. I think this has been pretty well covered by some of the other posters to the BBS, but I will interject my own position here. I have two responses: A. Hakeem still brings a seasoned defensive effort to the 5 position that is not only very effective physically, but the intimidation effect alone many times causes players to change their shot, or to pass out of a drive if Hakeem steps into the lane. B. We have no real options for big men that could possibly ouweigh the benefits of what Hakeem brings. We really need more defense from our center. No other big men that are available to the Rockets can bring what even an older Hakeem can. 2. Hakeem hinders the development of younger players by taking away minutes. Once again, two responses to this argument: A. One season of Hakeem taking roughly 20 minutes a game (he really won't play more than that) is not going to seriously impact our players. First of all, Cato is going to get his minutes one way or another. However, he can't play the entire time. Hakeem provides the best solution to bring Cato along. All other big men really are there to fill in the 4 spot, where Rudy has a penchant for PF's that can shoot the three (Thomas, Collier). All other big men are irrelevant for the purposes of development. B. Hakeem playing and practicing with the team is probably the most beneficial thing for all of the big men. It gives them a living example of how to play the 5, or to work on low post play, which Thomas and Collier need badly. I think that this was the crux of the arguments that RocketExpert was making. If we look at the Hakeem issue from a Cost/Benefit analysis for the team as a whole, clearly, Hakeem should stay: Costs: 1. Les has to give Hakeem the entire 16 million (but we're over the cap, even if he didn't give Hakeem a cent) 2. Hakeem takes roughly 15 min./game away from the 5 position. Benefits: 1. Hakeem provides mentorship for our big men 2. Hakeem brings veteran leadership (which the Rockets sorely lack) 3. Hakeem still brings a solid defensive effort to the court. ------------------
Thanks for the advice Rocketexpert. Let me see if I can improve my argument technique. Fair enough, but the title of your thread is "For the team....Olajuwon should retire". To me, this implies that Hakeem staying on the team has a negativeimpact. If not, why would you want him to retire? Surely you must see why I misunderstood you. ------------------ Current Rocket's Salary & Contract Info
Hey i think Hakeem should retire for the good of the team. what do you guys think? if you really think about it it really makes sense. im joking. i was trying to piss you off for about 2 seconds. hakeem forever. do you think when we retire his number itll be in the red and gold or the navy blue ugly crap uniform? ------------------ "Win the game, baby!" -Rudy T in the fourth quarter of game 4 of the 1995 NBA Finals
